Qhimm.com Forums
Final Fantasy 7 => Gameplay => Releases => Topic started by: Auraplatonic on 2010-03-04 00:20:16
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Version 0.3 has been released!! :-D
http://www.mediafire.com/?ebd7y3qccu7ra07
Videos
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Aps battle: http://youtu.be/UzP75GfNsGk
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Its taken sometime to prep and time to write a batch installer(my first foray into trying to program anything, nothing too fancy but I am learning :P) but I am happy to say that the project is alive and gathering steam. I have pasted an abridged readme to give a good idea of what the project will bring. The actual readme goes into more detail about specific spells and such, I just don't want to clog up the forum with it. If anyone has any specific item questions just let me know.
INSTALLATION
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If you are coming here after the installer has finished, skip this part :-)
TO INSTALL: The installer backs up the files you will be patching(flevel.lgp, kernel.bin, kernel2.bin, scene.bin, and ff7.exe) for you but it would not hurt to do so yourself. Move the entire Shalua Rui folder AS IS(Don't extract the files inside the folder, just move the folder) into your Final Fantasy VII folder. The installer assumes your directory is C:\Program Files\Square Soft, Inc\Final Fantasy VII. If that isn't yours for some reason let me know I will offer some secondary instructions if needed. Otherwise go inside the Shalua Rui folder and then into the flevel folder and double click install.bat. The installer does most of the work, you will just have to press a key after each file is patched, and click to confirm the patching of kernel.bin, kernel2.bin, scene.bin, and ff7.exe. I highly recommend patching all 5 files as it will mess up the balance big time if you don't.
INTRODUCTION
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Shalua Rui is my attempt to reblance Final Fantasy 7. I am sticking with PC for now, with the possibility of PSX support in the future. I am more concerned with finishing the project at this point. This readme will go through the version history and explain the major changes in the modification. If you are really itching to find all the changes you should thouroughly explore the files, I have listed most things I can remember here.
VERSION HISTORY:
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v0.1 and 0.2 were my original changes but they got severly revamped into the current state.
v0.3: Up to the Mythril Mine 98% to my liking and playable. Many changes that are outlined in this readme. Additional changes past the readme will be individually listed in future version history.
v0.4 Preview: I will probably be increasing enemy damage in the beginning for the next release as I had increased armor defense and forgot to compensate. Nothing too major though.
Tifa's limit breaks will be tweaked more, probably a reduction in power.
I plan to have up to Rocket Town completed.
KNOWN BUGS
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-There could be some weird text gaps in some items and item descriptions. This is just something I think Wall Market does sometimes when compiling the kernel. I fix them as I see them so just let me know if you encounter this and I will fix it.
-Even though I have set charaters empty materia slots to have no materia, there is a weird purple placement materia that stays even in slots that are not available on equipment. Its a little annoying, just discard or sell them for now. I can't get rid of this but I will try to find a way.
-The steal and drop tables have acted weird since I have changed them. There is a possiblity you may get a weird drop or steal that is just a placement item with no use. I have edited these chances out for the most part but just let me know if you encounter it so i can fix it.
GENERAL CHANGES
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I can best break this down by file.
Kernel and kernel2.bin:
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ALOT. I have changed probably 99% of the equipment in game. The goal is to make physical attacks more viable early in the game and to make every item somewhat useful in a certain scenario. I have made all weapons have a certain purpose, an example being everyone has a "mage" weapon, a "defender" weapon, and a "warrior" weapon. There are many variations of course but this is a generalization.
I have made a couple brand new armor and everyone besides Aeris has their own special armor they can equip, as well as their own accessory. Not really an OP thing, just makes them all unique and useful in certain situations.
The significant accessory change other than that is that Ribbon no longer prevents status ailments. This will provide for more significant planning with added effect combos and other accessories, maybe even certain party combos. There may be times when you have to deal with certain status effects.
Materia changes:
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Most materia growth is increased, some for right now really hard to master. I have removed master materia as I see them as OP, in their place in game I have place the W item, summon, and magic materia. In those materia's place in game I have made 3 new materia: strength, vitality, and spirit plus. I have also added status effects to most summons, in and out of battle, and altered a few specific materia.
-There are brand new items.
-Hyper and tranquilizer are pretty rare items as I find that Fury and Sadness are pretty OP ways of dealing with enemies. There will be certain situations where they will be very helpful and this is when you should use them.
I have also created throwing items to benefit from the Throw materia. My hope is to make it more viable but I will decide based on my tests.
Character changes
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-Cloud starts at level one and everyone else starts at average party level except for Yuffie who seems to be on her own little curve.
-Stats are lined up a little better, balancing everyone out
-EXP curve tweaked to match the exp gains I was looking for. This is open to more tweaking as the game unfolds
-Limit breaks don't come as often and are more than a bonus when them come as opposed to something you depend on coming frequently.
Except for Vincent, Tifa and Barret everyone starts with some type of materia. You will be able to come across 1 of each materia without having to buy them. You won't be able to afford it anyway.
scene.bin
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-I have changed all enemies in one fashion or the other. This is just not simply doubling all enemy stats as it requires a bit more balancing than that. Status ailments are present in attacks of a lot of enemies, some enemies have really high magic or physical defense, certain weaknesses, etc. Sense materia is somewhat useful but eventually its not really going to help as it won't work on much. Until you get it, you only have so many options anyway so it shouldn't be too hard to figure things out. I hope to make you think at least a little bit.
-EXP is drasically decreased especially in the very beginning. This isn't a LLG or anything it is just that it fits the level curve. You should be around 10 when you leave Midgar and leveling picks up a bit after that. -I left gold just about the same, maybe a little less. I originally had it pretty low as well but then I don't want you to have to grind a lot so there will be some points when fighting a bit for gold won't be a bad idea, but nothing drastic.
-AP has increased a bit but not so much that it outweighs the increase in AP needed.
I have also changed encounters, some bosses may have an extra enemy or two and some encounters have been changed so that you are able to fight some enemies easier. I like the mix so far.
flevel.lgp and ff7.exe
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My favorite edits personally...there are no new item locations, just what you get has been changed in a lot of places. I like the change as it is refreshing to not know what may be in that chest, or what materia you will get. I have also fixed a couple little things, one being that the soldiers that you get Potions from in the very beginning actually drop them individually, you can't get both from one of them(A weird bug I thought)
I have edited shops and limit breaks a decent amount. Limits are tweaked to make them a little less powerful, but useful in certain situations. Shops are a big change, you can find many new items in shops. They are placed there because you will probably find use for them, and should buy a couple. Also if you see some new status ailment curing item, its probably a good idea to buy a couple.
Overall this is harder than the original but not hardcore. However some battles will be pretty tough. I am trying to make something that requires you to really think about your planning, not just OP materia combinations= You win.
CREDITS:
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I just want to say I could not have done this without the members of Qhimm.com who have created the programs for me to modify the various files:
For modding:
Squall78 for Loveless text editor
NFITC1 for Proud Clod and Wall Market; scene and kernel.bin editors
Bosola for LIBRE limit break editor
titeguy3 for White Choco shop editor
myst6re for Makou Reactor field editor
For my own testing:
Aali for his graphics driver
sithlord48 for Black Chocobo save editor
For installation
Aali for lgp/unlgp
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good luck friend i can't wait, this would really be nice if you could balance the difficulty so we could actually get to see that elusive game over screen but at the same time not get to acquainted with it. :lol:
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Alright I'll lend a hand and test it when you release Midgar part 8-)
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I'll be happy to test run it, if im done with my own rebalanced/harder... er.... mod. Just let us know when you want us to test it out, and what you want us to test :P
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I am already producing a rebalance. Do your own damn mod ; )
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Well, I have all the way till Aps finished, so the mini-release will be soon, just thought I would let you all know :D Also thanks to those who said they would give it a shot.
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You can try this (http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=4759) and this one (http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=6818.0) as a reference. If I understand you correctly, something in the middle is what you should aim for.
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I had your mod in mind when I was making this as well :D
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Awesome, would love this.
Will this difficulty be incorporated as an option in gjoerulv mod installer?
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Honestly at this point I am just trying to get a working version version that people can test, for all I know it could suck :P It takes me some time because I test the parts myself as well. Basically I am aiming to be mostly finished with up to midgar by tonight. I can't work on it right this second because this is the weekend that I have my kids.
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That's what babysitters are for xD. Just kidding. Either way, good luck with this, and when you wanna release a beta, I'll definitely check it out.
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Testing beta released! All the info is in OP. Thanks again in advance if any of you happen to test :)
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Well, I'll hop on it later. I'm gonna crash for now, as it's almost midnight here. But, I'll look into it when i get up tomorrow.
Question: Why everyone, EXCEPT Yuffie?....
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Question: Why everyone, EXCEPT Yuffie?....
Well basically for 2 reasons. For one, the level modifier for Yuffie in Wall Market is 0.5 which I think means to put her at the average party level. Since this modifier is unique to her and you get her at different circumstances than the other characters I don't know if it will have adverse effects on the game if I change it. Secondly I plan on making the actual Yuffie fight difficult and giving her some more starting materia. I guess a decent reward would be for her to start at a better level.
I have a plan as far as materia is concerned for the mod. This will take full effect is titeguy3 is able to help us edit shop prices :) Ideally you will be able to get one of any materia that are in shops(besides the ones you find) as part of someones initial equipment. At first this may seem to be unbalanced but I plan on substantially increasing materia prices. I feel like the original game made you rely too much on materia, mainly by letting you get multiple copies at low prices. This puts physical attacks really at a disadvantage, and makes them mostly pointless until endgame. You will still be able to get multiple copies but at much higher prices. This will also force you into more strategic situations especially in the beginning where you don't have alot of materia.
EDIT: I forgot to also mention that limit breaks charge up alot slower, this is a good balance because this way they don't come around so often that you can abuse them. In my experience testing they come around when you actually need them and are a help.
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Yea, I tried installing this, but the installer is an updater. And because of this I can't install as there are no files to update. Or so the installer says, which means i can't use this....
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You have to take clean kernel.bin, kernel2.bin, and scene.bin files(from your FF7 install disk if you don't have them anymore on your computer) and copy them to the default destination folder(C:\mod), or one of your choice. It updates those files. I can't give away copies of the actual bin files, because that would be illegal.
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Yea, I know about the legal issues. I've just never done this kind of upgrade...
****EDIT****
OK! So I got this working. And I have to say, it's pretty hard. One thing I didn't like was the sleep guy I ran into while I still had only cloud. I had to restart 3 times before I got to the point where Barret was part of the party, simply because I kept dying to the combo of a guard hound with sleep, and an Shinra guard guy. I could usually only get 2 attack in to the battle, 3 if lucky. And that didn't matter 'cause it took 3 just to kill the dog. And by then i was 1 hit from death. So I'd say nono on the dogs causing sleep...>> personally. Also, is there anyone in the first part that drops antidotes? 'Cause I find it kinda annoying that I get poisoned by the boss, and the only way to heal poison is to die and then phoenix down. I'd have to say this is the first time I've ever died to the scorpion. Mainly cause I just wanted to see what he could do, and wasn't prepared because I'd just wanted to test him out. But damn, I died in no time xD. Still, I think we should avoid status causing enemies at least until we have the ability to heal the statuses they cause...>>. Also, I think starting at lvl 1 kinda nuts it all up. 'Cause yea, level one you don't do shit damage, but I'm gonna prolly have to get to at least 8 before facing the guard scorpion again. And at the rate I'm gaining strength, the enemies will likely die in one hit all over again just because I'll be strong enough to take out the boss, but too strong for basic enemies. Also, I like the idea of starting at a higher level for storyline purposes. Cloud was in SOLDIER, why the hell is he such a pussy when fighting the guards and dogs? The scorpion sure, but a dog?
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actually, cloud never made soldier, he only thinks he does, but he doesn't..
you will know this if you finished final fantasy 7 and crisis core.. ;D
http://www.armchairempire.com/Previews/PSP/final-fantasy-vii-crisis-core.htm
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Thanks for the feedback :) I ran into the same problem you did with the guard hounds, but I think I will keep it for now. You can get antidote drops from the guard hounds. As far as for guard scorpion he is beatable without any grinding at least for me in multiple tests. Part of another of the goals I have with this mod is to minimize the amount of grinding you have to do. Although in the case in the reactor fighting a few battles to get some potions may be a good idea. Also conserving your magic will be good idea as well.
I guess all in all my perspective of the bosses is different because I already know what the strategies are. What I will do is upload some vids of me fighting bosses to give everyone some perspective on what to expect.
EDIT: I uploaded a video of the guard scorpion for anyone who is interested, its in OP. Airbuster to come! :)
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Alright so I finally have midgar balanced pretty much the way I want it. Barring a quick retest I will upload a more updated version and start to work on the rest. Also a couple more boss videos to come as well. Stay tuned!
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Awesome, keep it up!
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Airbuster video up!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdzkYTgEsY8
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actually, cloud never made soldier, he only thinks he does, but he doesn't..
you will know this if you finished final fantasy 7 and crisis core.. ;D
http://www.armchairempire.com/Previews/PSP/final-fantasy-vii-crisis-core.htm
Yes, but he, through thinking he's Zack, essentially DID make solider 1st class. And even if he didn't, we was part of Shinra army, so he had to have SOME experience. Also, I DID finish both Crisis Core and FFVII.
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OK, so I have done pretty much all I want to do with the game up to leaving Midgar. Here is the best testing version:
http://www.mediafire.com/?hkmy2z4levz
The only thing I really need to add are the shop edits but that would require patching FF7.exe. That isn't a problem except I am trying to figure out which would be the best version to use as a baseline to patch. I am thinking just a clean 1.02 FF7.exe but that might make it more trouble than its worth if people have to repatch and all that. Any thoughts?
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OK, so I have done pretty much all I want to do with the game up to leaving Midgar. Here is the best testing version:
http://www.mediafire.com/?hkmy2z4levz
The only thing I really need to add are the shop edits but that would require patching FF7.exe. That isn't a problem except I am trying to figure out which would be the best version to use as a baseline to patch. I am thinking just a clean 1.02 FF7.exe but that might make it more trouble than its worth if people have to repatch and all that. Any thoughts?
Awesome work. I think that should be fine, do people usually patch the .exe? I think the only time I have done it was with the 9999 limit breaker patch to use with the Hardcore Mod, but since this is 'no-so hardcore', that wouldn't really be necessary.
Yes, but he, through thinking he's Zack, essentially DID make solider 1st class. And even if he didn't, we was part of Shinra army, so he had to have SOME experience. Also, I DID finish both Crisis Core and FFVII.
What do you mean he essentially made 1st class soldier? He didn't even make 3rd class.
Actually it makes sense that he be weak.
He was a grunt whose minimal experience was limited to a gun. The reactor mission would be the first time he even uses the buster sword.
Not to mention the obvious mental and physical toll that the experiments had on him.
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Yes, but he, through thinking he's Zack, essentially DID make solider 1st class. And even if he didn't, we was part of Shinra army, so he had to have SOME experience. Also, I DID finish both Crisis Core and FFVII.
What do you mean he essentially made 1st class soldier? He didn't even make 3rd class.
Actually it makes sense that he be weak.
He was a grunt whose minimal experience was limited to a gun. The reactor mission would be the first time he even uses the buster sword.
Not to mention the obvious mental and physical toll that the experiments had on him.
It's not actually Cloud in the flashback. It's really Zack, and Cloud's just telling the story as if it were him. Zack *is* a 1st class soldier.
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Well, he quite obviously takes on a lot of Zack's traits that he probably wouldn't have without the events that occurred. And his memories mix with clouds own, if not overpower. So as far as cloud is concerned he IS soldier 1st class, and has the knowledge to back it up because he takes on Zack's memories somehow. He knows the ways to use the sword through this, and he knows a lot of things he wouldn't for being a shinra grunt. Thus he is experienced in combat because he thinks he's Zack through most of the beginning of the game.
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Well, he quite obviously takes on a lot of Zack's traits that he probably wouldn't have without the events that occurred. And his memories mix with clouds own, if not overpower. So as far as cloud is concerned he IS soldier 1st class, and has the knowledge to back it up because he takes on Zack's memories somehow. He knows the ways to use the sword through this, and he knows a lot of things he wouldn't for being a shinra grunt. Thus he is experienced in combat because he thinks he's Zack through most of the beginning of the game.
I think it might be fair to say that the knowledge he gained from mixing his memories with those of Zack and the strength he gained from the Jenova cells would have been cancelled out at the beginning of the game by the damage done to him from the Mako poisoning. As a result, he comes out with average strength overall.
It would make sense if his strength grew at a faster rate than that of anyone else in the party as he starts to heal and becomes able to realise his potential, but maybe the developers thought that having Cloud significantly stronger than everyone else would make the game unbalanced.
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It would make sense if his strength grew at a faster rate than that of anyone else in the party as he starts to heal and becomes able to realise his potential, but maybe the developers thought that having Cloud significantly stronger than everyone else would make the game unbalanced.
I don't see why that would be the case...you can never take Cloud out of your party unless the story demands it. Speaking of which, I wonder if there's a way to undo the inability to swap Cloud out using [PHS]....
Moreover, I wonder what kinds of repercussions this would have on the gameplay...I can't think of any major problems except when Cloud has dialogue in the middle of a battle, which he doesn't except in the Guard Scorpion battle, at which point you don't even have the [PHS]...
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Well, he quite obviously takes on a lot of Zack's traits that he probably wouldn't have without the events that occurred. And his memories mix with clouds own, if not overpower. So as far as cloud is concerned he IS soldier 1st class, and has the knowledge to back it up because he takes on Zack's memories somehow. He knows the ways to use the sword through this, and he knows a lot of things he wouldn't for being a shinra grunt. Thus he is experienced in combat because he thinks he's Zack through most of the beginning of the game.
I think it might be fair to say that the knowledge he gained from mixing his memories with those of Zack and the strength he gained from the Jenova cells would have been cancelled out at the beginning of the game by the damage done to him from the Mako poisoning. As a result, he comes out with average strength overall.
It would make sense if his strength grew at a faster rate than that of anyone else in the party as he starts to heal and becomes able to realise his potential, but maybe the developers thought that having Cloud significantly stronger than everyone else would make the game unbalanced.
I was mainly more taking this anyway as a why would he be level 1 at the beginning of the game if he has had the combat experiences and what not (or at least thinks he has) not saying he has to be level 50 from the get go. However, were it not for the Mako poisoning and whatnot, I think he really should have been stronger than one "alive" on the planet.... besides maybe Vincent, you know, being that he carries Chaos and all.
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Vincent could hold his own even before being injected with Chaos, he *was* a turk, after all...
But I digress...flashback cloud aka zack should at least be able to have a fair fight with sephy, rather than be a lv1, but really, it wouldn't make sense for cloud to be stronger in the past than he is in the present, and that'd probably give away more of the plot than the original developers intended at that point in the game...
BTW, with an unmodded kernel.bin, cloud is lv6 from the start of the game. (7 if you count the inevitable level up after the first battle)
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It would make sense if his strength grew at a faster rate than that of anyone else in the party as he starts to heal and becomes able to realise his potential, but maybe the developers thought that having Cloud significantly stronger than everyone else would make the game unbalanced.
I don't see why that would be the case...you can never take Cloud out of your party unless the story demands it.
Perhaps I worded it badly. Having Cloud significantly stronger than everyone else would make the rest of the party seem useless by comparison; it would feel as if Cloud were "carrying" the party. Actually, it might have actual repercussions on gameplay, since having one party member stronger than the others would call for a different strategy, and enemy attacks would have to be almost lethal to other party members in order to bother Cloud or have to be so weak as to hardly bother Cloud if they are to do reasonable damage to everyone else. I suppose that this might not break the game, but it probably wouldn't be what the developers wanted.Speaking of which, I wonder if there's a way to undo the inability to swap Cloud out using [PHS]....
Moreover, I wonder what kinds of repercussions this would have on the gameplay...I can't think of any major problems except when Cloud has dialogue in the middle of a battle, which he doesn't except in the Guard Scorpion battle, at which point you don't even have the [PHS]...
I can see it causing more problems on the field screen than in battle; a lot of events depend on having Cloud in the party.I was mainly more taking this anyway as a why would he be level 1 at the beginning of the game if he has had the combat experiences and what not (or at least thinks he has) not saying he has to be level 50 from the get go. However, were it not for the Mako poisoning and whatnot, I think he really should have been stronger than one "alive" on the planet....
Yeah, but he does have Mako poisoning, so isn't stronger than anyone else ;D
Also, my reasons as to why it would be bad for one party member to be stronger than everyone else apply even more for the start of the game. If Cloud were, say, five levels higher than Barret and Tifa, they'd feel really useless when they joined the party. One of the interesting things about the start of the game is that the way you fight your battles really changes depending on how many people are in your party. If Cloud were much stronger, adding Barret to the party wouldn't make much of a difference to how you fight. Furthermore, since the enemies would be targeting Barret, Tifa and Aeris as much as Cloud, then either they'd be dying all the time or Cloud would barely get touched because, as I said, enemy attacks would have a much bigger effect on the weaker party members than on Cloud.
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I'm actually kinda saying that everyone shouldn't start at level 1, and everyone should probably be more around 3~5 because they pretty much all have some fighting experience. Tifa's a martial artist, Berret leads AVALANCE.... Aerith is the only one i can really see as being level 1 because I've never really seen anything saying she's ever fought for any reason, except she lives in the slums... and there are monsters down there.
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I'm actually kinda saying that everyone shouldn't start at level 1, and everyone should probably be more around 3~5 because they pretty much all have some fighting experience. Tifa's a martial artist, Berret leads AVALANCE.... Aerith is the only one i can really see as being level 1 because I've never really seen anything saying she's ever fought for any reason, except she lives in the slums... and there are monsters down there.
That's reasonable, and the game originally has them all starting at at least level five anyway. Aeris is probably a bit stronger because of the aforementioned gameplay problems that could come from having Cloud at level eight fighting alongside Aeris at level one. Gameplay always takes precedence over realism. And Aeris might get a bit of a boost from being an Ancient. :P
I suppose everyone in FF7 has a reason for starting at the level they start at; Red XIII is some kind of wolf/lion thing, so it would make sense if he were strong; Yuffie is a ninja; Cait Sith is a robot (and we can assume that robots are strong) and Vincent is a former Turk. The only exception is Cid; I can't recall there being any reason why he would be good at fighting or have experience. Meh, maybe we can assume he started off as a military pilot and used to be in the armed forces. :D
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Points about Cloud's history:
Cloud was level 1 in the flashback because cloud himself was weak, however Zack wasn't weak at all during the trip. Zack and Cloud's memories never did merge together, only those that Cloud was with Zack did (otherwise he would have recognized Aeris).
Cloud is weakened by Mako poisoning after waking up in Midgar, why do you think he starts at level 7 instead of level 15 or so to represent the strength he did have as a grunt? The reason for him subsuming Zack's identity is because of his subconscious desire to make Tifa notice him coupled with the Mako poisoning to begin with and his adventures with Zack while he was in the Shinra Army (see CC: FFVII for more details).
The representation between Sepheroth at level 50 in his flashback and him being level 1 was very close in proximity to how strong Sepheroth was compared to him during that trip. And everyone knows how to use a sword, you swing it with the sharp edge toward your enemy, not much to it if your enemy has never fought with/against a blade before.
As for the rest of the menagerie of characters:
Vincent is a former Turk who has been infused with Chaos.
Yuffie is a Ninja trained in Wutai.
Cait Sith is a robot controlled by the head of Shinra's Urban Development.
Barret and Tifa are rebel fighters against Shinra.
Aeris is the last of the ancients born with the powers of the planet.
Cid is a former pilot for Shinra (most likely the military).
Red XIII is the descendant of a race of intelligent big cats that have obvious physical prowess.
Of those, Vincent, Cait Sith, Red XIII and Cid, in addition to Cloud, have been trained and/or experimented on by Shinra to make them stronger.
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Well, he quite obviously takes on a lot of Zack's traits that he probably wouldn't have without the events that occurred. And his memories mix with clouds own, if not overpower. So as far as cloud is concerned he IS soldier 1st class, and has the knowledge to back it up because he takes on Zack's memories somehow. He knows the ways to use the sword through this, and he knows a lot of things he wouldn't for being a shinra grunt. Thus he is experienced in combat because he thinks he's Zack through most of the beginning of the game.
Where did this Zack and Clouds memory mixing come from?
Cloud is just messed up in the head from traumatic experience, jenova/mako experiments, and his own self esteem issues.
No 'magical memory transference' took place...
Damyn, Cloud being weak at the start of the game makes sense from both a story and gameplay persepctive.
Deal with it.
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Jenova has the power to change one's looks, thoughts, and personality. The jenova cells cloud had took his memories of zack and incorporated them to cloud.
Also, SOLDIERs are infused with mako to make them stronger. Cloud was infused with Mako. Cloud is stronger.
Cloud has a bit of Jenova in him. Cloud can now reach a potential much higher than regular SOLDIERs.
Cloud never received proper SOLDIER training, so in the beginning of the game he is quite strong, but not as strong as someone like Zack or any of the other "official" first class SOLDIERs
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Because Cloud is Zack's living legacy. So.. Cloud must live the way Zack lives. Cloud wants to show everyone that is also as strong as Zack. In short,
Cloud wants to be Zack because its Zack's dying wish to Cloud, to continue what Zack started.. ;)
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Also, my reasons as to why it would be bad for one party member to be stronger than everyone else apply even more for the start of the game. If Cloud were, say, five levels higher than Barret and Tifa, they'd feel really useless when they joined the party. One of the interesting things about the start of the game is that the way you fight your battles really changes depending on how many people are in your party. If Cloud were much stronger, adding Barret to the party wouldn't make much of a difference to how you fight. Furthermore, since the enemies would be targeting Barret, Tifa and Aeris as much as Cloud, then either they'd be dying all the time or Cloud would barely get touched because, as I said, enemy attacks would have a much bigger effect on the weaker party members than on Cloud.
My main goal is make it difficult and interesting. I don't want there to be any extremes as far too easy or too hard. In my experience so far it hasn't been too bad with having them start at 1. I am not really focused on the "realism" of Clouds level based on his experience because in my opinion he should start at level 1 from an rpg perspective. You are starting the game, you haven't fought with him yet. He should be at the lowest level with no experience, imo.
I do understand that it may seem daunting that Cid for example would start at level 1. I guess my thinking there was that it was just an interesting twist to explore. I have balanced out that aspect with Red by making him really important to the first battle you fight with him, even at a low level. As the mod develops this may change but its just something that in everyone's testing we will have to see.
Another part of the game I did not like was the imbalance of stats. Cloud is overpowered throughout the game especially in the beginning(Yea i know the Jevova and all that) and I never liked how the other characters could not compare damage wise. To combat this I basically evened out everyone's stats on 6 distinct curves but they differ based on what the characters strong stats would be. The thing with the original game is that there is a sort of distinction in stats but noone really stands out except for Cloud because he is better than everyone else. I know his situation but that isn't much balance imo.
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So anyone have anymore opinions yet? Im working on getting to the end of the first disk because I am personally pretty happy with the progress thus far.
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I was thinking of a name for a while, and I found one! Shalua Rui is mostly me trying out to see if I can make a balanced, yet difficult modification that will be well accepted. Its not going to be hardcore but there will be a good amount of difficulty in parts. Anyway I am working on this day by day and I will have a soft test release soon. What I will soon release will be the game up until you leave Midgar. I want to work on it in parts to see what the community reaction is instead of making a whole game patch that could potentially suck, leaving me a lot more to edit. Anyone who tries it will be greatly appreciated and their input will drive where the mod will go.
Alright! I have up to Midgar completed. The only thing I am missing is the shop part of the patch, which I should be adding soon.
http://www.mediafire.com/?hkmy2z4levz
Its listed in the installer, but changes include:
EVERYONE except for Yuffie starts at level one.(Unless you are insane enough to level Cloud past 65 before you get them lol)
Stats are overhauled; basically it works on 6 set curves for every character that are ranked differently to provide variety and balance. HP and MP curves are lower as well, something more similar to FF6
To improve the effectiveness of physical attacks especially early in the game some enemies are weak to the physical "elements"(punch, shoot, hit, cut). This helps the characters with low magic have a strength at their disposal, something that FF7 lacked.
EXP and gold gained are decreased, but not crazy low.
AP is increased, and AP needed for materia is increased, but at a lower curve.
Minor Equipment changes
Enemy drop/steal values and items are changed. Any interesting drops you get could be very useful especially on bosses. Also, bosses rarely drop sources, and you can steal from them! Its a rare steal but worth it if you can score the item.
Enemies deal more damage and have more HP. Enemies use status ailments to put a twist on battle. Look out for alot of attacks to target the whole party.
Videos!
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Guard Scorpion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlqiDxJivx0
Airbuster: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdzkYTgEsY8
I am already producing a Rebalance that does this, and more - adding new spells, instituting an elemental and status class system, changing mechanics and limit breaks - which I started in Q3 last year. React as you will.
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Sounds interesting. My main goal is not to add alot of new spells to the game, its mostly to take the original game and balance its difficulty. I think it would be cool to see new spells but I don't think its a rebalance to add a lot of new stuff, that would be more along the lines of a remake. I would also say that what you are doing won't necessarily do what mine does because it seems we have different goals as far as what we consider to be rebalanced. Im interested to see the results though and would definitely play it. This project is mostly for my enjoyment but I figure I would share it with the community and hope someone else could enjoy it too. I'm not a really good programmer or anything so I am thankful for all of the great work others have done to help me with what I am doing.
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Likewise, I'd be interested to play your mod too. Will it be PSX compatible?
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I haven't really thought about that aspect yet. I want to get a finished one first :P Work is slow as life is busy.
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I think this mod looks very very promising. You and bosola should form an alliance and work together merge ya mods and make the best HARDCORE MOD EVAH! :wink: :o ;D
:mrgreen:
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I think this mod looks very very promising. You and bosola should form an alliance and work together merge ya mods and make the best HARDCORE MOD EVAH! :wink: :o ;D
:mrgreen:
See: Gjoerulv
I don't think anybody will ever make a harder mod (that's still fun).
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I think this mod looks very very promising. You and bosola should form an alliance and work together merge ya mods and make the best HARDCORE MOD EVAH! :wink: :o ;D
:mrgreen:
See: Gjoerulv
I don't think anybody will ever make a harder mod (that's still fun).
Gjoerulv's mod is great I love it too especially the new monsters. however its a bit to much health on monsters. Makes gameplay alot "longer" Otherwise its a really awesome hardcore mod ;)
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all of these rebalance mods sound interesting, but my i suggest a bit of unification? everyone seems to be doing some things the same and other different, but working against each other. Not to sound condescending, but a bit of Team Avalanche spirit could help all of you. I can think of 3 or 4 mods like this around here now, but not a single one gets it "right", or packages multiple levels in a single installer.
I LOVE these mods, but there are too many that are too similar.
Join forces, together you are more powerful than alone.
ps... i will play this mod no matter what action you take ;)
lee
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all of these rebalance mods sound interesting, but my i suggest a bit of unification? everyone seems to be doing some things the same and other different, but working against each other. Not to sound condescending, but a bit of Team Avalanche spirit could help all of you. I can think of 3 or 4 mods like this around here now, but not a single one gets it "right", or packages multiple levels in a single installer.
I LOVE these mods, but there are too many that are too similar.
Join forces, together you are more powerful than alone.
ps... i will play this mod no matter what action you take ;)
lee
This is true, but it takes a *lot* of organization to make an AI overhaul like this into a joint project. Not to mention, I speak for myself at the very least when I say that AI editing is fun and satisfying. I can see why people would be reluctant to split up the workload because, to me at least, I don't view it as work. I enjoyed making my mod a lot, and I actually kind of wish I had more to change.
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pyrozen I'm glad I am not alone with the "Join forces" Part ;) Its great idea!! And also if they do join forces it will be done way faster and it will be even BETTER! 8-)
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all of these rebalance mods sound interesting, but my i suggest a bit of unification? everyone seems to be doing some things the same and other different, but working against each other. Not to sound condescending, but a bit of Team Avalanche spirit could help all of you. I can think of 3 or 4 mods like this around here now, but not a single one gets it "right", or packages multiple levels in a single installer.
I LOVE these mods, but there are too many that are too similar.
Join forces, together you are more powerful than alone.
ps... i will play this mod no matter what action you take ;)
lee
I don't think joining forces is a bad idea but I don't think it would work. The reason being is that the mods themselves are different and the mod makers are different as well as far as their goals of what they want. With Hay's mod it is more of just an edit on the monsters to make the game reasonably difficult. Gjoerulv's mod is really(I mean really) hardcore difficulty with new monsters and bosses. Bosola is working on new mechanics and spells while also adjusting the difficulty. For my mod in particular I am not adding any new monsters, spells, or items. I am changing monster stats, drops, attacks, and changing materia and spells. There will be the same spells just altered to rebalance them. A good example would be Beta which will become a Fire/Gravity elemental spell. This will help curve its overpower and also make sense with its animation. I want to stay true to the game but also rebalance it, thats why I don't want to add new stuff to it. I also want to make it interesting and make you incorporate new strategies. I am making the bosses with strategies to go along with them that you will have to figure out. I want the boss encounters especially to be memorable because they are just that: bosses. My hope is that when you play it that it doesn't feel like the same battles you have already been through, but you know that it is still the game you know and love.
Basically what I am saying is that I am always willing to collaborate but I think its good to have different mods because someone may be looking for different things when they look for a mod.
Also, I added patching for FF7.exe to alter the shop prices! This is another important part of the mod as shops are pretty different. This will patch any FF7.exe but it will revert it to just a plain 1.02 patch with the new items/prices. Just use YAMP again to put whatever patches you want, it should work fine.
http://www.mediafire.com/?om22mwja3mj
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Two new videos up!!!
Aps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsNSZiqRzGA
Bottomswell
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAVlwNaYDIY
I am pretty much done up to Jenova BIRTH, so I will have that video and a playable version soon.
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Two new videos up!!!
Aps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsNSZiqRzGA
Bottomswell
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAVlwNaYDIY
I am pretty much done up to Jenova BIRTH, so I will have that video and a playable version soon.
Thanks for the update Aura, looks like it's coming along nicely.
Also I dunno how you are encoding your videos, but it looks very strange.
Give Avidemux a try, with x264/AAC/MP4 settings http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/
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Two new videos up!!!
Aps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsNSZiqRzGA
Bottomswell
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAVlwNaYDIY
I am pretty much done up to Jenova BIRTH, so I will have that video and a playable version soon.
Thanks for the update Aura, looks like it's coming along nicely.
Also I dunno how you are encoding your videos, but it looks very strange.
Give Avidemux a try, with x264/AAC/MP4 settings http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/
Thanks, I'll give it a try. I'm using camstudio right now, kind of sucks because it records slower than real time. I am using windows media maker to add in the song, basically just with the default encoding settings.
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NEW VERSION RELEASE! 0.2
This takes you all the way to Corel, right before the Gold Saucer. Enjoy!
http://www.mediafire.com/?mymmxzkzzjf
Also, Jenova-BIRTH video is up. Thanks Timber for the info, I think it looks a bit better.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-k2956EIRvY
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I am also going to make a difficulty mod :) And maybe we can share ideas at a later date
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Looking nice.
In this last run i've been making i've found myself killing bosses almost like regular mobs (until i got the buggy, that is, after that i grinded a bit) so this mod interests me. For starters to the game it might be too much but for veterans it might be fresh new air, since everyone can see people soloing with cloud Ruby weapon (without any materia!!!).
Anyway, it would be nice to add more optional bosses, crystal weapon or pearl weapon for example, with an higher grade of difficulty, but that would demand also a graphic designer and maybe some guy who was able to do some coding to spawn these new mobs in certain areas in a certain time.
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Anyway, it would be nice to add more optional bosses, crystal weapon or pearl weapon for example, with an higher grade of difficulty, but that would demand also a graphic designer and maybe some guy who was able to do some coding to spawn these new mobs in certain areas in a certain time.
Meteor can already do this. And if you're a hex editing guru (gjoerulv) then it's also possible to do this
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Looking nice.
In this last run i've been making i've found myself killing bosses almost like regular mobs (until i got the buggy, that is, after that i grinded a bit) so this mod interests me. For starters to the game it might be too much but for veterans it might be fresh new air, since everyone can see people soloing with cloud Ruby weapon (without any materia!!!).
Anyway, it would be nice to add more optional bosses, crystal weapon or pearl weapon for example, with an higher grade of difficulty, but that would demand also a graphic designer and maybe some guy who was able to do some coding to spawn these new mobs in certain areas in a certain time.
At least right now my goal for this is not to create new monsters. Basically I am trying to keep the game the way it is, but balance things around to make all of the things you come across actually useful, and increase the difficulty curve but not crazy high. A good example of what I have most recently done is try to make Throw more useful by making 4-point shurikens a buyable item at a lower price. I always thought that throw really wasn't helpful, especially because weapon prices were a bit high. I wouldn't want to spend forever trying to steal Atomic Scissors either lol. I actually decreased all weapon prices, but materia and item prices are generally higher and you don't get as much gil from enemies. Also there is a good variety of combat items you can get at certain shops.
Of course all of this is subject to change based on testing, so that is where you all come in :P
Meteor can already do this. And if you're a hex editing guru (gjoerulv) then it's also possible to do this
His hex skills amaze me. Nightmarish, you should check out his mod, it is a lot of fun and hard, with all the kinds of things you were talking about.
I am also going to make a difficulty mod :) And maybe we can share ideas at a later date
Just let me know :)
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Also if the HP limit of 9999 is removed in your mod (or you plan to add it to other mods that remove it), there should be more bosses doing over 9000 (!!!) dmg, 1 hit ko, etc.
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NEW VERSION RELEASE! 0.2
This takes you all the way to Corel, right before the Gold Saucer. Enjoy!
http://www.mediafire.com/?mymmxzkzzjf
Also, Jenova-BIRTH video is up. Thanks Timber for the info, I think it looks a bit better.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-k2956EIRvY
Sweet! Wish I had time to test this out :(
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Well, the project is still around. I have gone through a lot of computer and life issues since the last time I posted. In any case I still want to try to work on it. I have many ideas and will be somewhat starting from scratch(not that I had a terrible amount completed anyway :P).
Some have said that the people making these type of mods should try to get a Team Avalanche type thing going...however at least for me I don't see that as something I would be interested in. That isn't to say anything against anyone or their mods because I have played other FF7 mods around here and I like the work very much. I tend to think of it as similar to the D2 modding community where there are several different modifications and they good for just the fact that they are different. Mods like this have a personal touch and a specific goal. Many of the mods I have seen choose to add many new bosses, spells, and even change the way the game works in some respects. I am not opposed to this from the stance as I would play and most likely enjoy it but from the standpoint of how I would modify the game it is not the direction I want to go in.
Anyway I am just doing this for fun and I figured that I might as well share it with the community just in case anyone was interested. I will be posting an update in a day or two with my current changelog. :)
EDIT: Here is a list of some of the base changes:
For now I won't alter character stats so much as there will be enough customization with weapons, accessories, and materia. I'm not 100% happy with the current curves but that is something I will toggle with later.
My goal is for you to come across 1 of every materia in some way whether it be as treasure or the gold saucer, or if a character comes with it. Purchasing materia from a shop will be just extra, and it will cost much more because I feel this will allow the player to use other options such as physical attacks(which will generally be more useful especially early on) and items that have different effects.
I will make items more useful i.e. potions healing a bit more, maybe I will add a mega-potion item as this is nothing new to final fantasy games.
I found that throw materia was pretty useless because weapons cost too much to stock up on in bulk(and stealing is very time consuming), and the damage of throw doesn't really justify that cost. To make the ability more viable I will make some type of throwing weapon at a cheap cost purchasable in shops.
Speaking of shops there will be some tweaks mostly in costs of materia. I will gauge other costs as I playtest.
As far as equipment goes I have a couple of thoughts on it, and hopefully some input from the community will help me find the best way to go. I could just do a general alter of the equipment which really wouldn't change all that much but I was thinking about the concept of initial equipment. The buster sword and gatling gun are the two initial equipment items that you can't sell because they are story based. I always found it kind of silly that the weapon that was good enough to be treasured by great members of SOLDIER would be easily outclassed by a mythril sword purchasable at a shop. With this thought I want my goal to make all equipment more usable, possibly even interchangeable as the game progresses. Each weapon will have a defined role and will have some use even later on depending on the situation based on stat boosts, materia slots, etc.
I want to make physical attacks more viable which can be achieved a couple of ways: through boosting weapons and making some enemies weak to the weapon "elements" (cut, shoot, etc.)
These are a few of the base changes and I will speak more on enemies later. I will also update the original post soon to reflect my progress. Thanks in advance for any input you may have :D
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I have edited the original post of this thread to reflect the current status of the project.
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Version 0.3 has been released!!
Check original post for all the details :-D
http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=9470.msg128485#msg128485
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Back to work. I've been spending a lot of time with my kids since they have been over for the summer but also been thinking about this. I have made a few tweaks already, increased enemy damage a bit and a few shop edits.
For anyone that has downloaded this, was installation ok? I am starting to teach myself stuff and something like NSIS may be eventual but I was trying to make something to teach myself and test what I can do. Also if anyone has any feedback i.e. this is too easy, or too hard let me know. I am trying to aim for something that is difficult but doesn't make you pull your hair out. Well, maybe a battle or two I will make that way lol.
For anyone who does start a new playthrough I hope you like the flevel edits. I am trying to mix it up a bit treasure wise, improving some and changing locations of others. I am trying to make a good balance where items and materia can be useful simultaneously and not just a couple items getting decent use and spamming magic/summons.
EDIT: I have made a new video; all the other video links besides OP in this thread are dead as things changed and new videos needed made.
Aps battle: http://youtu.be/UzP75GfNsGk
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I like it.
One of these days everyone is going to complete their rebalance at the same time and the world will explode.