Final Fantasy VII downloaded 100,000 times in two weeks

[Prince Lex]

Yeah its available for PSP in the UK.

[titeguy3]

MGS4.....I won't even get started on that game....I will just say that I would use that as an absolute example of how graphics got in the way.  Cut scenes lasting over 40 minutes is not intelligent game design and the plot was god awful imho.

That's how MGS games are. Since the beginning it's been 50% gameplay, 50% cutscenes/codec conversations. If you don't wanna watch cutscenes and listen to people talk, why would you play MGS to begin with?

I personally think all four mgs games are marvelous games, and that Hideo Kojima and his Konami team are the cream of the crop when it comes to video game design and development. None of them were perfect, but they were all great games as in they all had their strongpoints (MGS1:Story, MGS2: Controls, MGS3: Fight Sequences, MGS4: Originality).

I personally think it would be impossible to REMAKE ff7 and sacrifice plot for graphics...since the plot's *already there*. All you need to renovate is the graphics. Although I wouldn't hold it past Square-Enix to do something really stupid like make a battle system that emphasizes appearance rather than technique/enjoyability.

EDIT: and it just occurred to me, sometimes over the top flashiness is a good thing. Look at attacks like Omnislash and Supernova. Now don't even try to tell me that Supernova is less over the top than cutting a boulder in half or jumping super high in the air. Hell it even said in the original FF7 manual that cloud's sword "can cut almost anything in two" so I don't see where that's deviating.

[The Seer of Shadows]

Now, if they ever do remake FF7, one thing that must be done imo is to shorten the Supernova sequence.  That Safer Sephiroth battle can get so frustratingly boring if you don't kill him quickly enough.  Though I realize that to many people, that would be low priority.

When it comes to a remake, I would not imagine that the dialogue, or at least the style of the dialogue, will be very faithful to the original.  It seems a little out of Sephiroth's character to laugh evilly, which he did a little too much in the original FF7.  What I imagine they'll do is simply have him smile instead or alternatively change his attitude to make him appear more contemptuous and loathing.  They're also likely to tone down Barret's and Cid's dialogue, as although you can easily censor swear words when they're written down, it's not the same when there's voice acting.

Certainly, if they do create a voiceover for FF7, I'm praying that they take out Heidegger's "stupid horse laugh" (as Rufus calls it) and Scarlet's signature laugh as well as Palmer getting the hiccups while laughing during battle, because really, what kind of voice actor could imitate that in a way that doesn't sound ridiculous?  Nevertheless, I'd be interested in seeing what kind of voice actors they get.  I'd also be interested in hearing spoken dialogue from Bugenhagen and, more than anyone else, Jenova.

The worst thing they could do with a remake is incorporating a FF7AC-like battle style.  Simply because that just wouldn't look right in many battles (the boss battle against Palmer comes to mind).

[Kudistos Megistos]

Now, if they ever do remake FF7, one thing that must be done imo is to shorten the Supernova sequence.  That Safer Sephiroth battle can get so frustratingly boring if you don't kill him quickly enough.  Though I realize that to many people, that would be low priority.

But the Supernova sequence is legendary! OK, what they could do is shorten it after the first time you see it. They could also give the player the option of watching a shortened versions of the summons, as they do in some other FF games. In the mod I've been meaning to get working on, Supernova is changed slightly, so you'll only see it once in battle  

When it comes to a remake, I would not imagine that the dialogue, or at least the style of the dialogue, will be very faithful to the original.  It seems a little out of Sephiroth's character to laugh evilly, which he did a little too much in the original FF7.  What I imagine they'll do is simply have him smile instead or alternatively change his attitude to make him appear more contemptuous and loathing.

He does laugh a little, but I never thought of it as an evil laugh; it always seemed to be a laugh at the craziness/futility of the situation. So yeah, no evil laugh please  

They're also likely to tone down Barret's and Cid's dialogue, as although you can easily censor swear words when they're written down, it's not the same when there's voice acting.

Pfft, Americans  

That's a possibility if they want a low age rating, but I hope they don't do it.

Certainly, if they do create a voiceover for FF7, I'm praying that they take out Heidegger's "stupid horse laugh" (as Rufus calls it) and Scarlet's signature laugh as well as Palmer getting the hiccups while laughing during battle, because really, what kind of voice actor could imitate that in a way that doesn't sound ridiculous?  Nevertheless, I'd be interested in seeing what kind of voice actors they get.  I'd also be interested in hearing spoken dialogue from Bugenhagen and, more than anyone else, Jenova.

But those things that Heidegger, Scarlet and Palmer do are parts of their character! Really, what would they be without Gya-ha-ha and Kya-ha-ha? Well, I suppose they'd be like a clean mouthed Cid or Barret  

The worst thing they could do with a remake is incorporating a FF7AC-like battle style.  Simply because that just wouldn't look right in many battles (the boss battle against Palmer comes to mind).

ZOMG but the less time the fighters spend on the ground the better the fight is!

I'd say the AC style fights wouldn't look right in any of the battles. It's a fantasy game, but the FF7 world seems to have the same physical laws as ours ('cept for the magic and ability to swing huge swords). Higher and crazier isn't always better.

[The Seer of Shadows]

When it comes to a remake, I would not imagine that the dialogue, or at least the style of the dialogue, will be very faithful to the original.  It seems a little out of Sephiroth's character to laugh evilly, which he did a little too much in the original FF7.  What I imagine they'll do is simply have him smile instead or alternatively change his attitude to make him appear more contemptuous and loathing.

He does laugh a little, but I never thought of it as an evil laugh; it always seemed to be a laugh at the craziness/futility of the situation. So yeah, no evil laugh please  

With the character of Kefka still quite fresh in their minds while they were working on the original FFVII, they probably intended Sephiroth to be insane and laughing evilly, though not so much as Kefka.  At least, that's how I see it.  I mean, they pretty much copied the final boss battle of FFVI for reuse in FFVII, with a few alterations.  It just seems to me that they liked Kefka so much that they wanted to take him and make him into something even better, the product being Sephiroth.

Nowadays, Sephiroth actually seems sane, though still ill-intending and dark.  That's the kind of villain I prefer.  It's scarier to see Sephiroth looking at the camera with hatred than with a creepy smile that makes it seem as if he has completely gone off his rocker.  And both of these approaches to his character have been seen through various remakes of that Nibelheim scene where there is fire all around and he slowly looks up at the camera.

What I'm saying is that over time, Sephiroth's evil character seems to have evolved.  I watched AC not long after playing FF7 for the first time and Sephiroth really struck me as being completely different.  In the game, he seems like he is out of control, and merely desiring the destruction of everything just for the sake of becoming more powerful.  In AC, he seems to be perfectly in control of himself, and wanting to create a future of his own while killing the planet in the process since it'll further his plan.  I've noticed it through the differences in his battle quotes between the two KH games as well (though he was abnormally out of character in the first.  "No more games.  Show me what you've got!"  Sephiroth saying that?  Really?), not to mention the change in voice actors dramatically changing his persona (and that was undeniably for the better.  Even Lance Bass knows that, I'm sure).

It's also interesting to note that at the end of FF7, when he fades away, you briefly see an expression of sorrow and devastation on his face, but every time he is defeated from the release of KH onwards, he fades while bearing an expression of anger.

[seifertemp]

That's how MGS games are. Since the beginning it's been 50% gameplay, 50% cutscenes/codec conversations. If you don't wanna watch cutscenes and listen to people talk, why would you play MGS to begin with?

No.  You miss the point.  MGS1, most of the talking was optional.  You had more codec people, same as in 2 and 3.  The gameplay was 50/50 and the story didn't suck.  In MGS4, you are forced into multiple cut scenes and it is ANYTHING but 50/50.  It is more like 80/20 in favour of bloated meaningless cut scenes.  MGS1 and 2 are two of my favourite games.  MGS4 is imho, a huge waste of disc.  If MGS4 had a decent plot which wasn't a far fetched retcon, fair enough, but it didn't.  It was a rather bloated ego masturbation for Hideo and fanboys.  MGS1 was a masterpiece in both story and gameplay.  MGS2 was a masterpiece in game play.  And even 3 had something to offer.  But most of us don't want forcing into 40 minute cut scenes.  Cutscens in MGS1 were seldom if ever as long as the ones in MGS4 and they were nowhere near as frequent.  If I want to watch a bad movie I will find one in a film shop.

EDIT: and it just occurred to me, sometimes over the top flashiness is a good thing. Look at attacks like Omnislash and Supernova. Now don't even try to tell me that Supernova is less over the top than cutting a boulder in half or jumping super high in the air. Hell it even said in the original FF7 manual that cloud's sword "can cut almost anything in two" so I don't see where that's deviating.

Actually it is shortened down in the japanese version by a lot, and yes it is over the top and since there is no way to skip it, it becomes irritating after the first time you have seen it.  But it is in the battle.  The battle is not the field and should not be taken literally as part of the story.  Also, this is a fantasy.  It has laws like any other world.  It can allow a sword to cut almost anything in 2 without it being far fetched, but once it has made the rule that a human can easily die (tifa vs sep for a starter) and that a lot of its laws are based entirely on those of Earth, it can no longer allow fight scenes that go on for ages and DEFY BIOLOGY.  A story has its limits and so many people fail to see this.

You cannot have tifa being slashed once and almost dying to then have people smashed into brick walls without a scratch on them. That isn't how good story telling works, now or ever.

[titeguy3]

You cannot have tifa being slashed once and almost dying to then have people smashed into brick walls without a scratch on them. That isn't how good story telling works, now or ever.

They're at higher levels. 

[seifertemp]

You cannot have tifa being slashed once and almost dying to then have people smashed into brick walls without a scratch on them. That isn't how good story telling works, now or ever.

They're at higher levels. 

   

[Prince Lex]

That's how MGS games are. Since the beginning it's been 50% gameplay, 50% cutscenes/codec conversations. If you don't wanna watch cutscenes and listen to people talk, why would you play MGS to begin with?

No.  You miss the point.  MGS1, most of the talking was optional.  You had more codec people, same as in 2 and 3.  The gameplay was 50/50 and the story didn't suck.  In MGS4, you are forced into multiple cut scenes and it is ANYTHING but 50/50.  It is more like 80/20 in favour of bloated meaningless cut scenes.  MGS1 and 2 are two of my favourite games.  MGS4 is imho, a huge waste of disc.  If MGS4 had a decent plot which wasn't a far fetched retcon, fair enough, but it didn't.  It was a rather bloated ego masturbation for Hideo and fanboys.  MGS1 was a masterpiece in both story and gameplay.  MGS2 was a masterpiece in game play.  And even 3 had something to offer.  But most of us don't want forcing into 40 minute cut scenes.  Cutscens in MGS1 were seldom if ever as long as the ones in MGS4 and they were nowhere near as frequent.  If I want to watch a bad movie I will find one in a film shop.

EDIT: and it just occurred to me, sometimes over the top flashiness is a good thing. Look at attacks like Omnislash and Supernova. Now don't even try to tell me that Supernova is less over the top than cutting a boulder in half or jumping super high in the air. Hell it even said in the original FF7 manual that cloud's sword "can cut almost anything in two" so I don't see where that's deviating.

Actually it is shortened down in the japanese version by a lot, and yes it is over the top and since there is no way to skip it, it becomes irritating after the first time you have seen it.  But it is in the battle.  The battle is not the field and should not be taken literally as part of the story.  Also, this is a fantasy.  It has laws like any other world.  It can allow a sword to cut almost anything in 2 without it being far fetched, but once it has made the rule that a human can easily die (tifa vs sep for a starter) and that a lot of its laws are based entirely on those of Earth, it can no longer allow fight scenes that go on for ages and DEFY BIOLOGY.  A story has its limits and so many people fail to see this.

You cannot have tifa being slashed once and almost dying to then have people smashed into brick walls without a scratch on them. That isn't how good story telling works, now or ever.

I'm not trying to seek an argument so I'm going to be as polite as possible when I say this.

Be careful. The last time you were here, you aggravated a few people (including myself) by not taking into account the opinions of others.

You - yet again - are demonstrating how right you are in every single way. Does the thought never cross your mind that you could be wrong? Is it not more likely that the majority don't care about the limits of a fantasy world?

Some people might have enjoyed the way MGS4 played out, from start to finish. You really can't just encroach upon everyone elses freedom of speech and expression. Seifer, to avoid a scenario like last time, I am asking you nicely to please make sure when posting things like this, to make it CLEAR that it is YOUR opinion, and not fact. Because it's not fact - it's your opinion. And it's this forcefulness, this having to be right all the time, the stubborn, sometimes arrogant nature of your posts that get you so many enemies.

You're writing what you THINK, not what IS. Please be careful, that's all I ask.

[seifertemp]

I am not replying to that or even reading it;)  because you have failed with the emotional response and ignorance that I no longer have any desire to take notice of.  That kind of post creates problems directly and you know it.  If you didn't want to create an argument you should have gone about it better (all i can see is underlining and the first line put me off) .  If you can't handle what I have to say, don't read it.  Free speech and all that crap

 

[Prince Lex]

Then why did you reply?

I'm not trying to cause problems, I was just trying to give you some advice. You seem to be very self destructive yourself.

EDIT: Forgot to add, I wonder what your post said before the edit?

[obesebear]

Really???  This sh*t again??

Please, let's just drop this now.

[Covarr]

In MGS4, you are forced into multiple cut scenes and it is ANYTHING but 50/50.  It is more like 80/20 in favour of bloated meaningless cut scenes.

You can skip cutscenes, at least in the 2nd playthrough. I don't know about the first playthrough, because I didn't try to skip any cutscenes, seeing as I enjoyed them.

But the fact of the matter is, it certainly wasn't an instance of sacrificing gameplay for graphics. You may not have liked the gameplay, but it's clear that a lot of time and thought went into every aspect of it. It's polished, and it does what it tries to do. Every feature was put in all the way. Sure the Drebin shop wasn't the greatest idea in the world, and the guns were pretty much the same, but the stealth was very much intact (at least if you go for a zero alert playthrough), and the controls worked well.

For an example of a game that sacrifices gameplay for graphics, look no further than the first three Resident Evil games (as well as REmake). The tank controls were awful, but it's obvious that Capcom didn't care about anything but fright factor.

In a FF7 remake, I'd be just as interested in a shorter animation for Knights of the Round, not just Supernova. It's enough that it takes a long time and much work to actually GET KotR, but then to have to sit through its ridiculous animation every time was quite annoying. Particularly when you abuse materia so that your whole party uses it consecutively. Using that against Safer Sephiroth, with him also using Supernova, makes for just a ridiculous battle.

[Hellbringer616]

I agree Covarr. Though instead of shorter. Do what they did in FFX, set animations to short for Aeon summons and overdrivers.

Also, i enjoyed MGS4, granted i only played MGS1 and only got half way through, but MGS4 i thought was a fantastic game.

I jokingly say it's an "interactive movie over a game" But still great

[seifertemp]

We will just have to disagree on mgs4   

As for KoTR and other long animations, I agree.  FF9 and I think 10 made it so you could reduce the animation times.  We need some way to do that for 7.  Super nova was much shorter in jap version (i mentioned before and i prob learnt that here.  Any case > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWcFUQ0THJ0 )

[Xelane]

is the japanese version of supernova even in the Us game? or did they remove it completely? If it is i would love to put that animation in for a move with wallmarket

[The Seer of Shadows]

Seconded.  I actually prefer that version of Supernova.  The US version is over the top.

I imagine it'll have the same modding limitation as the US version, though, that being that it can only be used in Safer Sephiroth's battle background.  It probably can't be found anywhere in the US version of the game anyway.

[Xelane]

the only reason you can only use it in safer sephiroth's backround is because in the us version the backround breaks away to reveal the beginning of the attack

the japanese version should be usable anywhere as it is just fading into the universe where the supernova happens.

[Covarr]

How difficult would it be, assuming the US game has the Japanese version of the attack somewhere in its code, to swap the animation in so that US players could have the shorter animation?

[The Seer of Shadows]

It would be as easy as opening the scene.bin with Proud Clod, scrolling down to the file with Safer Sephiroth in it, clicking on "Super Nova" in the attack list on the left, and changing no more than two, possibly three values.  The problem comes in with knowing what to change them to.

The values I'm talking about are the attack animation and the camera angle.

[Xelane]

well to start we need to know if it is still in there at all. if it is then it is probably not listed in any attack index, but i imagine that they just put it somewhere else instead of rewriting the code for the entire move.

so the question comes down to: if i were a game designer.....

where would i put the original attack animation?

[The Seer of Shadows]

If I were a game designer, and I was to make a new animation for Super Nova, I would leave the original wherever it was to begin with and create the new Super Nova somewhere else.  In other words, if the original Super Nova is to be found anywhere, I imagine it would be somewhere among Sephiroth's other attack animations (I assume that's where they put Super Nova originally).

I wouldn't get any hopes up about finding it, though it is a cool idea.  It'd be a nice attack to put in the Comet materia if possible (if not, then maybe it could get a place in Enemy Skills as a replacement for that stupid Dragon Force thing).

[seifertemp]

They may have removed it and swapped it with the new one.  Afterall, the new one is not in the jap version I assume, and the new one probably has exact same ref address as old.

[The Seer of Shadows]

I'm thinking exactly the same thing, which is why I wouldn't get my hopes up.

[seifertemp]

but is it possible to rip it from psx version?