Author Topic: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods and Modding Framework-The Reunion [R06f]  (Read 3035752 times)

DLPB_

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« Last Edit: 2016-04-03 10:41:25 by DLPB »

DynamixDJ

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2651 on: 2016-04-03 13:20:14 »
Lol, that is brilliant, and even more ominous without sound

jmp434

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2652 on: 2016-04-03 22:39:05 »
Hi, do you think it would be possible to create the menu overhault with the Neo-Midgar by Acro create patch on ff7.fr to give a possible French-speaking person to get a menu installable on a translated version perfectly in french? (The original version of ff7 is carnage at the translation level and gives no meaning to the game) I managed to translate the space but certain name was too limited to replace with the perfect name has true translation. ..

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2653 on: 2016-04-05 20:04:27 »
Back!

All the quirks you've corrected in Cloud's remembering have been added to the list. Thanks for telling if on PSX or not.
Thanks to you too DynamixDJ, yours are also nice discoveries  :) some were already on my list but others definitely not.

Yes, I'm making a list with the help of Dan, of any bugs, inconsistencies, oversights, oddities I can come accross, and I'll open a new thread for it.
Let's be honest, "complete" is impossible, but so far we have 256 entries and still going (next I tackle the properties/elements, the statuses and the Love Points system). The list is being sorted too.

@DynamixDJ: If you want an early look at it for things related to what you're working on, you can pm me

@jmp (in French): Je vais répondre à la place de Dan, en fait il est déjà sur vingt mille projets personnels donc il n'a pas le temps de se lancer dans des trucs qui concernent les projets des autres.
D'habitude il le dit lui-même, mais suite à une ptite embrouille on lui a demandé de ne plus répondre à ce genre de post.. mais sinon voilà, il ne t'a pas délibérément snobbé.

@Dan: Two things.

Something we're so used to that it doesn't even look out of place, when in fact it's just plain wrong:
On the field, you meet a Shin-Ra blue guard, a battle is engaged, you're fighting a blue guard.. well alright. But those red guards with their cap ! Face them in battles, and you'll also be fighting blue guards, that's plain nonsense.

Second thing. I don't know what Japanese/Beacause tells us, but in the original localization, when we're looking at an undamaged Niblheim:

-Cait Sith (when he didn't speak the first):
"Cloud, did you make up that story just to get out support?"

-Cait Sith (if Tifa is present):
"Cloud, maybe you were just dreaming…?"


Cait Sith was not in Kalm and didn't hear Cloud's story...
And Yuffie's dialogue looks a bit suspicious to me:

-Yuffie
"I thought someone said this town burnt down!"

-Yuffie (if Tifa is present)
"What the…?"

Pretty sure someone refers to Cloud in Yuffie's mouth, sarcasticly.

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2654 on: 2016-04-05 20:30:21 »
The text in question:

Code: [Select]
Niblheim
------------------------------
{TIFA}
“Huh!?”
------------------------------
{TIFA}
“But… this all burned down?”
------------------------------
{CLOUD}
“Yeah…”
------------------------------
{TIFA}
“Then how is this possible?
  My house is still here too.”
------------------------------
{BARRET}
“The hell’s goin’ on!?
  You imagine it all or somethin’?”
------------------------------
{AERIS}
“Something’s not right.”
------------------------------
{RED XIII}
“What does this mean?”
------------------------------
{CAIT SITH}
“{CLOUD},maybe ye
  juist imagined it all?”
------------------------------
x1
------------------------------
{YUFFIE}
“What the…!?”
------------------------------
{BARRET}
“You said the whole
  village was torched,yeah?”
------------------------------
{AERIS}
“This is Niblheim,right?
  The village looks fine to me.”
------------------------------
{RED XIII}
“Is this Niblheim?
  You told us it had all burned down.”
------------------------------
{CAIT SITH}
“The whole village was wiped
  oot thanks tae Sephiroth.
  At least,that’s what ah heard.”
------------------------------
x2
------------------------------
{YUFFIE}
“I got told that this
  village was gone!”
------------------------------
{CLOUD}
“Yeah…”
------------------------------
{BARRET}
“Were you jus’ messin’ with us?”
------------------------------
{AERIS}
“What’s going on?”
------------------------------
{RED XIII}
“{CLOUD}…
  Did you lie to us?”
------------------------------
{CAIT SITH}
“{CLOUD},
  did ye make up your story
  juist tae gain our sympathy?”
------------------------------
x3
------------------------------
{YUFFIE}
“What’s wrong?”
------------------------------
{CLOUD}
“I was telling the truth!”
------------------------------
{CLOUD}
“I remember… the intense
  heat of the flames…”
------------------------------
“…Urrrgh…
  …Calling…
  …Sephiroth is… calling.”
------------------------------
#cy 8
Obtained Mind Source!
------------------------------
“… Great… Sep…hi…roth…
  … is… near.”{NEW}
“…Inside… mansion…
  …Urrrgh…
  …Great… Sep…hi…roth.”
------------------------------
“… Great…Sephi…roth…
  …Gone.”{NEW}
“…Over… the mountains…
  …Gone.”
------------------------------

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2655 on: 2016-04-05 20:39:30 »
Okay, Yuffie's alright, but for his 3rd dialogue  Cait Sith's definitely acting like he was there when Cloud told his story.

and
{BARRET}
“The hell’s goin’ on!?
  You imagine it all or somethin’?”

not "imagined" ?

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2656 on: 2016-04-05 20:40:41 »
Nah.  ;) It's short for "Did you imagine"

Are you sure Cait isn't present at the Gold Saucer?  He retells the story there.

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2657 on: 2016-04-05 20:50:06 »
Oh okay.

ah.. I don't even remember Cloud talking about it again at the GS  x)  So I can't tell, but if CS heard about it at that moment, then np.

Something else's catching my attention: Sep..hi ? A syllable is cut in half there, the one for the 'f' sound. That reads "sep" + "ee".

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2658 on: 2016-04-05 21:01:47 »
That's how it is spoken.  It isn't "seph-i-roth"  it's "sep-i-roth"

Also, Cloud doesn't mention that Niblheim was burned down to Cait - so your issue is still relevant. He shouldn't be acting as if Cloud lied.  Although, you can still imagine dialogue took place between different members off-screen, I guess.


Covarr

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2659 on: 2016-04-05 21:13:41 »
That's how it is spoken.  It isn't "seph-i-roth"  it's "sep-i-roth"
That sounds wrong. Literally every time I've ever heard it in any official media (which I know isn't a solid basis in many cases), it's been pronounced sef-i-roth. But more importantly, in Hebrew it would be sef-ee-rote. Hell, even some Japanese materials call him Sefiros or Sefirot. I can't find any linguistic basis for a hard p there.
« Last Edit: 2016-04-05 21:15:37 by Covarr »

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2660 on: 2016-04-05 21:21:31 »
I can assume it with a phrase like “{CLOUD}, maybe ye juist imagined it all?”
but “{CLOUD}, did ye make up your story juist tae gain our sympathy?” seems to imply he has heared the full story.. Like Cloud took another hour to talk about it a second time? in an ellipsed moment.. meh

And anyway, depending on members, Cait Sith says he heard it from Cloud, or that he's just heard of it, like randomly: "At least, that’s what ah heard." So even there that's not consistent.
That 2nd sentence likely implies that Reeve got to know about it due to his position in the Shin-Ra.

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2661 on: 2016-04-05 21:26:24 »
That sounds wrong. Literally every time I've ever heard it in any official media (which I know isn't a solid basis in many cases), it's been pronounced sef-i-roth. But more importantly, in Hebrew it would be sef-ee-rote. Hell, even some Japanese materials call him Sefiros or Sefirot. I can't find any linguistic basis for a hard p there.

I forgot about the hebrew, but yeah I guess you're right, because it comes from "sefirot". 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sephirot  is that "sef" or "sep".

; Hebrew: סְפִירוֹת‎ Səphîrôṯ

@whitewind -  yeah, the second one might even be my attempt to make sense of it.  I#ll have to speak to Luksy.  But I wouldn't be surprised if this is an original writing error.

edit

セフィロス (Sefirosu?)

That puts pay to it, really. It's a hard f.  Not sure why I thought it was sep - I used to use Seph as a kid.
« Last Edit: 2016-04-05 21:32:58 by DLPB »

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2662 on: 2016-04-05 21:36:00 »
“… Great… Seph…i…roth…
  … is… near.”{NEW}
“…Inside… mansion…
  …Urrrgh…
  …Great… Seph…i…roth.”
------------------------------
“… Great…Sephi…roth…
  …Gone.”{NEW}
“…Over… the mountains…
  …Gone.”
----------------

Corrected in nivl_3

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2663 on: 2016-04-05 21:45:07 »
"ph" is always pronounced 'f' I think, like in "catastrophe".

But in your correction, the syllables are still not correctly separated (if we're basing it on syllables, that is). The syllables are Se - phi - roth. That's how the word is naturally divided. "Seph - i" just breaks "phi" in the middle of it.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2664 on: 2016-04-05 21:47:19 »
Seph is the same as "sef" - and these dudes are just talking strangely.  I don't think it matters if it's seph-i-roth or "se-phi-roth".  However, to me, the fact this comes from "sef" means seph is actually the first syllable? Seph is one syllable, the same as Sef.  When I say Sephiroth it is Sef-i-roth.

Seph is one syllable, the same as the male name Seth.
« Last Edit: 2016-04-05 21:51:08 by DLPB »

DynamixDJ

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2665 on: 2016-04-05 21:55:22 »
Lol, legitimately curious as to why you've made Cait Sith sound Scottish?

@White Wind - Hey nice one for compiling that list, I would most definitely like a sneak peak at it. I've started compiling my own starting with the post I made the other day, I've added one thing to it regarding "Special" enemy formations being incorrectly placed in a normal battle slot, and vica-versa. I was going to (eventually) start my own topic, but with 256 entries (or the magic 100h) you're definitely the appropriate candidate.

I'm going to be actively looking for bugs and anomalies from now on, and reporting them here (I really wish I'd started doing this sooner, because I've spotted quite a few things in the past few months). Which brings me to my next question - DB, do you think that the optional Gongaga scene involving Barret ("gonjun1") was intentionally removed.... before posting I looked at your flevel.lgp, and I can see that you have deleted the line in the back of the Church (variable [3][129] Bit5) that disables this scene from playing.... So i guess you DO regard this as an unintentional mistake.

So.... what exactly were they trying to do in the back of the Church with variable 3-129 Bit5 d'ya think????

And in regards to the pronunciation of Sephiroth.... to me I think Se-phi-roth sounds more fitting than Seph-i-roth... but that's just me  :)

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2666 on: 2016-04-05 21:56:17 »
No idea - it's just a rogue var that ended up being set - and wrecked the Gongaga scene.

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2667 on: 2016-04-05 21:58:46 »
If the word was 'sef' or 'seph', then it has just one syllable (one 'breath' to pronounce it, and it has one vowel). Now add any one vowel to it, and you have two syllables: se-fi, se-fa, ... (two 'breathes', two vowels)

also: se-fir
but: se-fi-ro
se-fi-rot
se-fi-ro-tu
and so on

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2668 on: 2016-04-05 22:06:04 »
"i" can surely be a syllable on its own? 

Seph-i-roth  is how it would be spoken when considering "seph" as one syllable.  Or maybe it can be both.  It depends.  I can pronounce either correctly.

Regardless, it still works in the scene, because "seph" is the correct pronunciation.
« Last Edit: 2016-04-05 22:08:41 by DLPB »

DynamixDJ

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2669 on: 2016-04-05 22:10:15 »
No idea - it's just a rogue var that ended up being set - and wrecked the Gongaga scene.
A scene that could have been valuable for the PS4 players, given the trophy criteria (Best Bromance). I particularly like the dialogue if you choose "not interested"

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2670 on: 2016-04-05 22:47:50 »
"i" can be a syllable yeah, but it depends on its position in the word.

"Seph" is a syllable when there's no other vowel after. Add any vowel after it, and "Seph" is not the syllable anymore, because "-ph" becomes the beginning of the 2nd syllable.
"Is" = 1: is
"Iseph" = 2: i-seph ('s' not part of the 1st syllable anymore)
"Isepho" = 3: i-se-pho ('ph' not part of the 2nd syllable anymore)

In the case of "Seph-i-roth", "i" alone is not a syllable but a phoneme, as are the sounds "S" "e" "f" "r" "o" "t".. all phonemes.
A syllable is a group of phonemes based on a pronounced vowel. In "Seph-i-roth", "i" should be the base for a syllable, but here it's not, here it's just a phoneme.
Basically, "i" (or any vowel) can be the sole phoneme of its syllable when it's beginning a multi-syllable word. ( like i-seph.. with a real word: a-ffect )

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2671 on: 2016-04-05 22:50:33 »
I still think it's fine in the original scene - since you can say it like that.  It's just a choice, really.  They aren't supposed to be speaking in syllables in the scene - just the name is broken up. Another part I have used sephi.

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2672 on: 2016-04-05 22:58:44 »
Yup it is fine!

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2673 on: 2016-04-06 06:46:28 »
Hell, even some Japanese materials call him Sefiros or Sefirot. I can't find any linguistic basis for a hard p there.

He is called like this in the flevel script.

At the time at Nibelheim Cait was never in the group when Cloud was talking about his past. The Goldsaucer scene is after Rocket Town, though it's also after Nibelheim. However you can assume that the characters do speak with each other. The Cosmo Canyon is for example a place where your party splits a few times and there they have the time to talk with each other.
It feels strange to read the sentence, but it's not unexplainable

Ver Greeneyes

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R04c)
« Reply #2674 on: 2016-04-06 12:05:13 »
Spoken as someone struggling to get the words out, I can certainly see "Seph.. i.. roth" working (imagine coughing to get the second and third parts out), though I agree that it's not how you would split the name into syllables (but that's probably not the intent here).
« Last Edit: 2016-04-06 14:20:04 by Ver Greeneyes »