Author Topic: *ANOTHER* FFX pc post...  (Read 44198 times)

M0T

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« Reply #25 on: 2001-05-31 21:50:00 »
Nah theyll make it compatible with the TnT cards whilt simultaneously being totally incompatible with the geforce series and it would be cool to finally see a game that took advantage of the T&L on my card properly.

Sir Canealot

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« Reply #26 on: 2001-05-31 22:43:00 »
Giants is alot faster useing T&L. Other that that yea I know what you mean....

Ant

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« Reply #27 on: 2001-05-31 22:44:00 »
By the time FFX is ported DX9 will robably be out so following squares patterns it will utilise DirectX8

Threesixty

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« Reply #28 on: 2001-05-31 22:53:00 »
I'm running DX8a...and FF8 plays fine.
It's probably that your video drivers are not compatible with DX7.

And FF10 is supposeably going to be released in early 2002 for US and a port to PC a few months later. It's being released in Japan in July. I think I heard that FF10 is going to have voice acting. I guess the long delay is due to the voice Translations. But then again....the world releases always takes long for Square.

[This message has been edited by Threesixty (edited May 31, 2001).]


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« Reply #29 on: 2001-06-01 16:47:00 »
Ficedula: Actually, from what I can remember, that's not entirely correct.
I remember reading the following (I don't have the sources to back it up, but it seemed official):
-FF7 PSX was an instant hit and more copies were sold ever (I think it was more than all of the previous FFs combined on its opening day alone). The game met with similar success in the U.S. and Europe.
-FF7 PC continued the trend, by selling even better than FF7 PSX.
-When FF8 PSX was released, despite being a disappointment to many fans, it sold more than FF7 did on *its* opening day.
-FF8 PC sold well, but many computer users rightfully shunned it because of its poor porting. After all, at the time there were a wealth of much better PC RPGs out there.

So I think the problem was with FF8PC. Either that or Square just thinks strangely.  :wink: The fact that they got a good amount of flaming for the problems in the PC ports probably didn't help.


Sir Canealot

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« Reply #30 on: 2001-06-01 06:18:00 »
FFVII PC DID NOT sell more than the PSX! version! Where did you get that insaneity from?

The Skillster

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« Reply #31 on: 2001-06-01 15:04:00 »
hey dont mess with statician srethron
 :)

Sir Canealot

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« Reply #32 on: 2001-06-01 16:41:00 »
Well his stats are wrong damnit.

cHiBiMaRuKo

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« Reply #33 on: 2001-06-01 20:41:00 »
FF7 PC do sell more in the release day compared to FF7 PSX.

M0T

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« Reply #34 on: 2001-06-01 21:06:00 »
didnt a load of people buy it on release day because of the psx reviews it got, I thought it sold more on the release day than the PSX version as well.

Sukaeto

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« Reply #35 on: 2001-06-05 16:43:00 »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Threesixty:
I think FF9's story is better than FF7's. And the playablility is a lot longer. FF7's is about 40 hours, FF9 is a good 60 hours.

Not to go OT, but 360:  Is it possible you meant FF8 where you had FF7 at in the above sentence?


Threesixty

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« Reply #36 on: 2001-06-07 03:53:00 »
Nope, at the time I meant FF7.....

They are pretty close, I guess. But FF9 just seems richer. Maybe it's the four character party thing. It's kinda hard to compare the two, now that I think about it. One is with Castles, and has a Dungeon and Dragons feel, and the other feels kinda Futuristic with a forgotten past.

Let's just say that the Story in FF9 just feels right. Where as FF7's story seems.....unfinished.

As for playablility, there are a few more things to do in FF9. And it's a lot more common to have KO's. The tents are actually usefull.

I like to think that the other world (Terra) that is mentioned in FF9 is really Clouds world.

[This message has been edited by Threesixty (edited June 06, 2001).]


cHiBiMaRuKo

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« Reply #37 on: 2001-06-07 09:31:00 »
In terms of storyline, I think FF 7 blow F 9 away easily, but maybe FF 9 have better gameplay and battle system.

eerrrr

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« Reply #38 on: 2001-06-07 21:05:00 »
Hhhmmmm, I'm not too sure. FF7 was the first RPG I played, but now that I'm on FF9 I understand how to do everything more easily. So whether FF9 didnt have enough side quests, or whether I just found them all easier than I did with FF7's I'm not too sure about. FF7 & 9 come very close, I just dont know who's first.

Threesixty

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« Reply #39 on: 2001-06-07 23:24:00 »
The only reason FF7 is fondly, remembered, is because of it's unexplainable ending....and it's soft plot. Just about everything in the FF7's plot, can be explained in a different way. FF9 and FF8 are both complete stories, you know exactly what's going on, nothing is left to the imagination. So I wouldn't exactly say that FF7's story blows FF9's away. Besides, when FF7 first came out just about everyone hated the ending....

I would say that FF7's is a lot more fun to talk about, because of it's inconstancies and ending. But I wouldn't call it a better storyline. FF7 wasn't well written, it just stirs up your imagination. Maybe things were lost in the translation....(culture?).

want some examples?
They never told us why Aeris went to bed at the Golden Saucer (probably one of the biggest clues they left out of the story, it would explain, so much.). Why did the Aeris, Tifa and Cloud share dreams?  What happened after the white light. What did Cloud mean by that he understood now, if they go to the promise land they will find Aeris. (Suicide, resurrection?)....

FF9 and 8 were well written, but because it was well written there is no question of what happens, so there is nothing to discuss of FF9. That's why so many people believe that FF7 has a great storyline....It really doesn't, it's all the online discussions of FF7, that make it a good story.

There is one thing that I really don't like about FF9. It's the age of the Characters.....they are just too, young.... I like the Ages in FF7, a lot more. But then again....the guys in FF9 aren't human, so maybe they mature differently. FF8 was too young, too.

[This message has been edited by Threesixty (edited June 08, 2001).]


cHiBiMaRuKo

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« Reply #40 on: 2001-06-08 00:37:00 »

 
Quote
They never told us why Aeris went to bed at the Golden (probably one of the biggest clues they left out of the story, it would explain, so much.). Why did the Aeris, Tifa and Cloud share dreams? What happened after the white light. What did Cloud mean by that he understood now, if they go to the promise land they will find Aeris. (Suicide, resurrection?)....

Did Aeris go to bed saying she was tired? Is there anything else hidden from her statement? Even I don't suspect anything amiss with it. About your dream, but sorry my RAM don't work very well, but which dream(s) that those three shared? It's pretty common for people to dream about someone(s) else.
About Cloud statement, it means ( at least what I've been thinking of ) that they will know the way how to resurrect Aeris when they arrive there. About the ending, I actually have no problems with it. It simply shows that the whole humanity is wiped out by Meteor. Simple as that. Not a good ending, but very unique.

I admit that FF7 seems to be unfinished ( remember Aeris grave, the unusable key items etc. ), but still it's much better than FF9 or FF8 and up to par with FF6, at least for me. As I've said before, there's no game else that kills one of the main characters mid-way to the game. FF9 story is just above average ( but not excellent ) for me. And above all, FF7 have Sephiroth. Kuja sucks hahaha  :). And I don't like the music for FF9 either, it's the worst of all FF I've ever played, even FF8 have much better music than it.


Threesixty

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« Reply #41 on: 2001-06-08 05:21:00 »
So you think all humanity died, huh?

Well, I believe your wrong....

Look at the final movie again. Pay close attention to the village scene, it's right before Barret's adobted kid (still can't remember her name...) says something about the Flower Girl and goes to the window. The village is the one that is next door to Midgar, the layout is exactly the same, and the girl is looking out of that tower. (Of course, the problem is that she didn't walk up any stairs to get to the window or the fact that that room of the tower didn't have the room for a table and chair, in it, inside the game the tower had a very small room. Barely enough room for one person...the final movie is even slightly, flawed)
 
So, it isn't the slums of Midgar that she's in....which is a counterdictory to the story, by the way. That Shinra dude, "Caith Seth" said he sent everyone, including Barret's kid and Aeris' mother, into the slums of Midgar.

Anyway, That neiboring village Barret's kid and the other kids are really at. (I can't remember the name of the village....either) The planet's life-stream limits the destruction of the two forces on the upper levels of Midgar.... Midgar is still in one piece after 500 years of decay, if holy and meteor distroyed mankine....Midgar should have been vaporized. (that is a slightly simplified version of my conclusion, of the ending movie. The unexplainable part is the conclusion of the  main characters...and what Cloud meant by his Promise Land statement.)

So....you still think Mankind dies, huh? there is also the symbolism of Birth at the end of that movie and the sound of children playing at the very, very end.

As far as the Dreams....Cloud and Aeris connected when Aeris left the party. Tifa joined Cloud's mind when she was knocked out on the Highwind. and again when they fall in the lifestream. The question I have is the reason of why they connected....that magic was never acknowledged in the story. They just threw it in and never gave an explanation to it. (I don't like plots with holes in them)

Like I said before, I like FF7....but it isn't complete, and thus, to me, It doesn't have a perfect storyline (It's flawed). It's a very good rough draft, though. If the holes were all patched, then I would agree that FF7 is the best story, Ever!, for an RPG. But as it stands now...It's even if not a hair under FF9. Let's see how FF10 is       :D. (I really need to finish the other FF games, I've started all of them, but I haven't finished any of them: FF4, 5 and 6)

Oh, and Aeris all of a sudden said she was tired and ran up the stairs.....I haven't played the game in a while. But I know I remember this for a reason. I think the other characters were puzzled by her reaction. It was a clue of something to come. Square never told us why she ran up the stairs. If I remember correctly (I may be wrong, or conviced myself. I hope I'm not just substituting Tifa's bubbles texts for Aeris'....minds can remember things wrongly, sometimes...) she was going to say something and then she said she was sleepy and ran up the stairs. (an incomplete bubble, text statement, I think?...I know Yuffie said something about it after Aeris ran up the stairs.) I believe Aeris was going to tell Cloud something and got scared or maybe embarassed. At first I thought she ran up those stairs, because of the upcoming "so called" date with Cloud, but later I realized that you can date Tifa, Yuffie or hang out with Barrett, under the right circumstances. So it had to be something, else. Something that she was too scared to tell Cloud about....now that I'm recalling, she also covered up Cloud's strange reaction at the Ancient's Temple, with no real explanation, of why she bothered. (the story could have been a lot more richer, if they gave us better or, at least, some explanations for stuff.)

I've been trying to piece together the story of FF7 for quite some time....and I always come across an illogical roadblocks of some kind when I do.

Who's in control, Jenova or Sephiroth.
If the person Cloud is chasing is really Jenova, in the form of Sephiroth, why is it noted, in the story, that Jenova/Sephiroth has the tattoo #1. Does the real Sephiroth have that tattoo? They never told us...it would have been another solid clue. Why is it that they can fly? Even Cloud flys when he realizes he's part of Jenova. Also, apparently they can shapeshift. Why does Cloud look like Tifa's Cloud and also like Zack? Just too many missing puzzles in FF7, that they hint at, but never directly tell you. (Maybe that's why it's remembered as the best story of the FF games? The Mystery, and the torment....Guess I don't like unsolved mysteries. I like the torment, though.)

There's a lot more and I have a lot of amusing theories (that I'm sure would be good reading), but all of my theories have some sort of flaw in them.....maybe I'll replay the game again.....and come up with a better theory. But as far as I can tell, FF7's story is flawed.


[This message has been edited by Threesixty (edited June 08, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Threesixty (edited June 08, 2001).]


Sukaeto

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« Reply #42 on: 2001-06-08 11:03:00 »
I'm not sure what you mean by "Why does Cloud look like Tifa's Cloud and Zack?"

What is Tifa's Cloud supposed to be?

Cloud 'looks like' Zack because Zack put him in those clothes before the two escaped from the Shinra mansion.  Remember?  Cloud was in the grunt uniform?

As far as Tifa's Cloud . . . if you mean the Cloud from Tifa's memory . . . that is Cloud.  Cloud is Cloud.  Cloud was born in Nibelhiem.  When he was fourteen, he went out to join soldier, but never made it.  He was just a grunt.  He went back to Nibelhiem with Sephiroth and Zack, but was so ashamed and afraid that Tifa & the other townspeople would look at him as a failure that he never took his helmet off in front of them.

He attacked Sephiroth in the reactor, after Sephiroth stabbed Tifa and Zack.  Sephiroth stabbed through Cloud, but Cloud threw him into the life stream, and collapsed.

Zagan, the martial arts guy, was the first one to come into the reactor and see Cloud, Zack, and Tifa lying there half-dead.  He grabbed Tifa (the only one he could carry) and ran off.  Hojo found Cloud and Zack, and used them in his 'experiment.'  He kept each in a tube, testing them for a reaction when near Jenova.  Zack showed no reaction, but Cloud would go berserk.  (both were injected with Jenova cells when they were inducted into Shinra's army.  Zack must've just had a stronger mind than Cloud.)

Five years pass, and they manage to escape.  Shinra Soldiers hunt them down & shoot Zack.  They leave Cloud, though, thinking he's going to die anyway. (he was barely conscious at the time.)  When Cloud re-gained consciousness, he grabbed the closest thing to him (Zack's buster sword) and headed to Midgar.  That's where he ran into Tifa, and FF7's story starts soon after.


cHiBiMaRuKo

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« Reply #43 on: 2001-06-08 11:21:00 »

 
Quote
So....you still think Mankind dies, huh? there is also the symbolism of Birth at the end of that movie and the sound of children playing at the very, very end.

Aiyah, just look at the last movie ( after credits ). It shows that Red 13 and his son or whatever looking  at Midgar from the bloody canyon. Midgar look damaged etc, and I certainly heard the sound of children playing too. But try looking at the map of FF7 world. The canyon and Midgar is located far apart, even between them is a sea. My theory is that the lifestream failed to stop Meteor, and it hit Midgar and the planet and caused the earth face changed so radically it kills the whole humanity ( or almost ). And then Midgar lying just beside the canyon. The children sound could come from Red 13 descendants. You know, if Red 13 speaks, why his children can't?

Quote
As far as the Dreams....Cloud and Aeris connected when Aeris left the party. Tifa joined Cloud's mind when she was knocked out on the Highwind. and again when they fall in the lifestream. The question I have is the reason of why they connected....that magic was never acknowledged in the story. They just threw it in and never gave an explanation to it. (I don't like plots with holes in them)

In the first dream, I wouldn't say their mind is connected. Remember, Sephiroth is in it too. Sephiroth could easily controls Cloud as he is stronger than Cloud himself. Maybe he projected the image of Aeris going there to make Cloud go too.
About Tifa entering Clouds mind, I wouldn't say that either. Remember it happened after Cloud fall into the lifestream. Just like Sephiroth, he become stronger after going into the Lifestream ( but probably too much Cloud become a vegetable ). Just like Sephiroth, he maybe used the power to go into Tifa mind. And the one at the lifestream. They fused minds because of it. That's all.


 

Quote
Oh, and Aeris all of a sudden said she was tired and ran up the stairs.....I haven't played the game in a while. But I know I remember this for a reason. I think the other characters were puzzled by her reaction. It was a clue of something to come. Square never told us why she ran up the stairs. If I remember correctly (I may be wrong, or conviced myself. I hope I'm not just substituting Tifa's bubbles texts for Aeris'....minds can remember things wrongly, sometimes...) she was going to say something and then she said she was sleepy and ran up the stairs. (an incomplete bubble, text statement, I think?...I know Yuffie said something about it after Aeris ran up the stairs.) I believe Aeris was going to tell Cloud something and got scared or maybe embarassed. At first I thought she ran up those stairs, because of the upcoming "so called" date with Cloud, but later I realized that you can date Tifa, Yuffie or hang out with Barrett, under the right circumstances. So it had to be something, else. Something that she was too scared to tell Cloud about....now that I'm recalling, she also covered up Cloud's strange reaction at the Ancient's Temple, with no real explanation, of why she bothered. (the story could have been a lot more richer, if they gave us better or, at least, some explanations for stuff.)

Not all characters are puzzled by Aeris remarks, especially Yuffie and Tifa itself. After Aeris go to bed, isn't Tifa following shortly after, citing the same reason ( hope my RAM is working well ). Yuffie does say something about it, but just go to sleep like them. But not to an effect that there's something we don't know has happened. At most, maybe the only thing Aeris want to say is about Caith Sith.....

Quote
Who's in control, Jenova or Sephiroth.

Sephiroth. That's pretty obvious I'm suprised you're puzzled with it.


 

Quote
If the person Cloud is chasing is really Jenova, in the form of Sephiroth, why is it noted, in the story, that Jenova/Sephiroth has the tattoo #1. Does the real Sephiroth have that tattoo? They never told us...it would have been another solid clue. Why is it that they can fly? Even Cloud flys when he realizes he's part of Jenova. Also, apparently they can shapeshift. Why does Cloud look like Tifa's Cloud and also like Zack? Just too many missing puzzles in FF7, that they hint at, but never directly tell you. (Maybe that's why it's remembered as the best story of the FF games? The Mystery, and the torment....Guess I don't like unsolved mysteries. I like the torment, though.)

Sephiroth sure have the tattoo, but is that important? Unless of course his body is dissolved by the lifestream, which in Cloud case, didn't. Sephiroth can fly because he's powerful from Jenova power. Cloud can too for the same reason. Did Cloud fly again after that? No isn't it? Tifa's Cloud never look like Cloud, he delusional. Tifa is looking at Zack all the way. Only Cloud is thinking that he's Zack, a first-class Soldier while he's actually aren't. That explained Tifa reaction when Cloud tell the story about Sephiroth coming to Nibelheim.


Sir Canealot

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« Reply #44 on: 2001-06-08 16:08:00 »
Whoa you guys are deep but I shall add a few things then.

 

Quote
(both were injected with Jenova cells when they were inducted into Shinra's army. Zack must've just had a stronger mind than Cloud.)

Cloud wasent exposed to Jenove nor Mako when he joined the Shinra army. If he did he would have glowihg eyes. So there for all of the Shinra soldiers would have glowing eyes. So people wouldent be so shocked about it.

Quote
But try looking at the map of FF7 world. The canyon and Midgar is located far apart, even between them is a sea. My theory is that the lifestream failed to stop Meteor, and it hit Midgar and the planet and caused the earth face changed so radically it kills the whole humanity ( or almost ). And then Midgar lying just beside the canyon. The children sound could come from Red 13 descendants. You know, if Red 13 speaks, why his children can't?

The canyon and midgar are far apart yes.
But there is ledges that he could have been looking from. Remember there is a wide canyon from Kalm-Chocobo Farm? he could be leeding them though a mountain path though there to over look midgar. There is a way to figer that out but I cant do it since suddenly FFVII isnt working with the 1240 dets any more. Oh well.

And has any one consider another thing?
Aeris foster mother recoqsines the glow in Clouds eyes. Perhaps her husband could have been part of Soldier? Perhaps with cloud and Zack?

Heh people doing the story for the FFVII remake(I aint been accepted yet   :() should keep an eye on this!

[This message has been edited by Sir Canealot (edited June 08, 2001).]


MMiller8

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« Reply #45 on: 2001-06-08 20:17:00 »
One thing I noticed about FF9, (not that it was bad) was that Zidane, and practically all of the charachters were almost totally undeveloped in the beginning.  I remember exiting the ice cave and thinking; "Wow.  I control this guy.  And he kidnapped a princess. Wow."
I think I agree with threesixty on the FF7 thing, tho.  Of course, just like the story, it's popularity can be explained in many plausible ways also.

eerrrr

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« Reply #46 on: 2001-06-08 20:58:00 »
This is a very interesting thread.

Quote
(both were injected with Jenova cells when they were inducted into Shinra's army. Zack must've just had a stronger mind than Cloud.)

Cloud wasent exposed to Jenove nor Mako when he joined the Shinra army. If he did he would have glowihg eyes. So there for all of the Shinra soldiers would have glowing eyes. So people wouldent be so shocked about it.

But at the start of the game dont loads of people recognise Cloud of being part of SOLDIER becuase of the glow in his eyes? Even when he met the first President of ShinRa he noticed the glow in his eyes too, at the start when you go to blow a Mako Reactor.

About Sephiroth, he had the Tattoo #1 and stuff, but the one that you're chasing wasnt the real him was it? He'd been sleeping in the Promised Land for ages. I think he was just controlling the other Sephiroth (or was Jenova controlling it?) to lead Cloud and the Black Materia to him.

I don't think the world ended after Meteor hit, it would have ended, but Aeris summoned Holy so it weakened Meteor, and it just ended up destroying Midgar.

Quote
As far as Tifa's Cloud . . . if you mean the Cloud from Tifa's memory . . . that is Cloud. Cloud is Cloud. Cloud was born in Nibelhiem. When he was fourteen, he went out to join soldier, but never made it. He was just a grunt. He went back to Nibelhiem with Sephiroth and Zack, but was so ashamed and afraid that Tifa & the other townspeople would look at him as a failure that he never took his helmet off in front of them.

I think you're right there TiadaghtonDude. But Aeris dated Zack didnt she? In Midgar she said she went out with someone who was a first class SOLDIER just like Cloud, but he had to leave. Also she ran out of the conversation when you meet Zack's parents in Gongaga Village. But the thing I'm confused about is if you go to Gongaga and speak to Zack's parents with Tifa, why does she run out? Maybe it actually tells you in the game, I havent played it for years.

I think FF7's story was great, but the game itself was unfinished and there were many unexplained parts to it.

Something else, about FF9. Like the thing about Cloud flying. At the end of FF9 (SPOILERS) Zidane can fly and jump around and run up walls and stuff to get to Kuja. After all, he was created to be stronger than Kuja. But why didnt he use his powers to fight Necron and stuff?


Sir Canealot

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« Reply #47 on: 2001-06-08 21:27:00 »
Eerrr I was just saying that normal Shinras soldiers dont get exposed to Mako.

And Aeris and Tifa both do run out. Aeris did date Zack. Remember in the play ground Cloud says "Who was he I probley knew him"
But Aeris quickly changes the subject. So Aeris probley had some idea of clouds problems all along.


MMiller8

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« Reply #48 on: 2001-06-08 21:32:00 »
Hehehe... I feel stupid!  I didn't know this post continued on two pages, and I posted my last post thinking it would appear right after Threesixty's post at the end of the first page!  I have to wake up, although here it still is only ten in the morning...

Threesixty

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« Reply #49 on: 2001-06-08 23:29:00 »
See what I mean....the story has a totally soft plot. Everything can be scrambled into your own image, because the writers never gave answers to all the clues they left. (it's incomplete....and I don't like that about FF7)

About the Tifa's Cloud thing....I'm going really deep into the story....I thought that some of you all would remember some past posting I've made on the subject, but maybe I just posted that stuff on the Eidos page.

Sephiroth had said something about Jenova able to read minds and that the Cloud's personally had come from Tifa's mind. (think he said something about Cloud being a combo of Jenova cells, Mako Energy, and Tifa's memories. what Sephiroth didn't know was that Cloud was really in Nib and the memories from Tifa were kinda correct...but not totally.) When Tifa finds Cloud there is a flash, can't remember if it's red or white....I think it was red. Cloud didn't know who Tifa was, everytime he would answer her, there was a flash of light. That light was Jenova telling the blank mind of Cloud what to say.......and the reason, was because Jenova was reading Tifa's memories.

Hmmm, guess I answered myself (Actually I just remembered one of my conclusions)....guess Cloud acts like Zack, because Tifa wants to remember that it was Cloud that went to Nibelhem. It was just a coincidence that Cloud was there, but in a mask and Shinra uniform. (I haven't thought about this for a long time....I've forgot about some of my old theories  :wink: ) And since they are shapeshifters I guess Zacks's hairstyle kinda stuck....but with Cloud's hair color. (I have proof of this, remember #1 Sephiroth turns into Tifa).

As far as who's in control....Sephiroth was somewhat normal, until he found Jenova....(I can't go into it...not until after 6pm Central time)

As for the Dream....your forgetting that Tifa was in Cloud's mind, when she was knocked out on the Highwind (I need to replay the game for solid proof...cause I can't remember what happens in that sequence....I think Cloud walks away, and Tifa is talking to ghosts....I can't remember...but I think something important was said there....Oh, I think that's when we see Tifa's first meeting with Cloud. And the reasons why she was staying with him... There minds had to be connected, because of those red flashes of light.)
 
In the dream with Aeris, they were talking directly to each other.... Your reaction just proves my point. The story is written just to leave questions....It's considered good, because of what is left behind, not because of what's in the storyline.

As far as Aeris running to bed....in that Casta Rio? whatever....in that place she went to bed early, too. Because she was worried about, who she really was....She always gets tired, when she is worring about something. I'm sure it means something when she does the same thing in the Golden Saucer.

As far as the continent changing...you have to remember that the Lifestream was being made by killing the life around effected areas. The Crater was one of these areas, and Midgar was another, but Midgar was messed up because of man using up the energy...the Crater was void of life because the Planet was trying to heal itself. After the game, it shows the area around Midgar to be abundunt of life. Meaning that the Planet is completely healed.. As for the canyon thing. Maybe it isn't the Cosmo Canyon, but that valley that Cloud walks through to get to that Chocobo ranch. Lots can happen in 500 years...or maybe it was that mountain range that's around Midgar. Or maybe it's just another movie glitch.

The #1 tattoo. I need to know if Sephiroth was branded by the #1 at birth, to satisfy another conclusion I came up with....I'd go into it, but I don't have time right now. They put a lot of emphasis into that there are only 12 clones, minus Red, Cloud and Zack.....but these 12 clones never hold any real importance in the game. And why was there a Black clone flying away from key spots...Anchient's temple is coming to mind, right now. My conclusion all hangs on that #1 tatto on Sephiroth. If he had it at birth, my conclusion is broken......

(The game needed proofreading...for these and a lot of other small details. Especially since you need to study these small details to understand the story. Square didn't check these small details well enough. So your left with an unconsistant storyline. And that is what FF7 really is, an Unconsistant Story)

FF8's story was weak, that's why people don't like it. That and the fact that lot's of people don't understand the mentality of a Loner.....I understand FF8, too well and it's a touching story, if you know what a "Loner" goes through. (All Loners think more than they speak...and we/they think way to much about stupid things.)