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Miscellaneous Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: WatashiWaZero on 2019-05-09 23:58:25
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Just going to leave this here...
English (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOn2bWuA_0w)
Japanese (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-GEmPzn0xc)
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I kinda prefer the Japanese if i could play with subs :) though simple phrases are easy to understand like when Aerith is giving Cloud a flower :)
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It looks good so far - seems to be aiming to sit somewhere around FFXIII/FFXV and Crisis Core for gameplay.
Not a replacement for the original, but we knew it wouldn't be. Looks exciting and fun all the same.
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I just can't let go of the fact that it seems like you don't get to choose whether or not to buy the flower anymore. This brings up questions about the entire "who will Cloud date" mechanic.
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You date Aerith. That shit's cannon.
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You date Aerith. That strawberries's cannon.
You spelt Barret wrong :P
EDIT: And so did I >_>
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So disappointed in the direction this took. I think Square actually thinks fans of FF enjoy their stupid "Gameplay" mechanic that they started in FFXII where the computer plays the game for you, unless you want it to be a chaotic disaster action title instead of the RPG you actually wanted to play. XII, XIII, and XV are the worst FF games I've played due to this... FFX was the last one with anything resembling the kind of things I want in a JRPG title, which is sad for a series that originally helped shape the genre into what it was.
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It’s somewhat amusing, though. While I agree completely about the battle system, it was born from technical limitations at the time. Now that those limitations are all but a thing of the past we diehard fans want so desperately to keep it and not sully our “precious final nostalgia series” with modern mechanics while also wanting higher energy games like Dead Space or any number of open world action games (struggling to think of good examples right now so just roll with it :P).
That’s not to say we shouldn’t want to keep the same mechanics we fell in love with the series with because it’s obviously something we enjoy enough to want to preserve. Square is just doing what they can with what they have available to them, like they always have. Trying to appeal to older gamers driven by nostalgia who are less likely to be spending money on gaming is not in their financial interest.
I would love a return to the system that made me love FFs in the first place. I think it peaked at FF9 and that still remains to be my favorite FF. I’m sad to think that another FF will never capture that feeling for me again, but I don’t begrudge new fans and younger gamers getting this new FF7 experience if it makes them want to explore the series’ roots and get an impression of the old games unsullied by nostalgia. I won’t be partaking in this remake/reimagining/reboot/re-whatever and I’m just going to leave it at that. This new direction isn’t “garbage” by itself, it’s just not what I want in a series that was originally made famous by its turn based battle mechanic. Heck I might even be willing to embrace it if it were part of a different series.
My point is that we all have that thing that made each of us fall in love with FF in part or has a whole. That thing isn’t gone from wherever you found it from at the beginning, but we should accept that nothing in the series since might spark that feeling again.
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While it may be true that the classic turn-based battle systems of old-school RPGs were the result of technical limitations, it's also true (at least to me) that those systems made battles a lot more tactical than those modern "button mash" battle systems. In older RPGs, be they ATB-based or not, I had to think carefully about most of my moves, while in games from FFXII and onwards, I honestly don't even see some of my own moves anymore. When everybody, friend and foe alike, all perform their actions simultaneously, the entire screen just becomes an un-overseeable mess, and you can't really follow what's actually going on anymore. This is augmented by the fact that you don't (or worse, can't) enter your own party members' commands anymore. I've had a lot of battles in FFXIII that I won without even realizing it until the victory screen popped up. In older games, defeating a boss or winning a hard battle always gave me a sense of satisfaction, while in FFXII or FFXIII, I was mostly left wondering: just who defeated these enemies now? Was that really me? Somehow it didn't feel that way...
And so I whole-heartedly agree with paladin181 and DLPB: the technical possibilites may have become better over the years, yet somehow Square-Enix didn't manage to put them to good use, imho. Just because they can implement a very fast-paced, hectic battle system doesn't mean that that's necessarily the best approach for an RPG.
I'm also worried about what Covarr said. It really looks like you get the flower automatically, and if that's indeed the case, they are likely to have abandonded other dialogue choices that they deemed "unnecessary" as well... which saddens me, as this is yet another interactive gameplay element that goes down the drain, pushing the game further into the "movie-like" direction that FFXIII took...
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Gameplay looks fine. It hasn't been a secret that it would be different and not turn based. The only thing that worries me is the same thing some of you have pointed out, the change in the flower scene. That scene itself is whatever not that big a deal but if they changed that... I'm worried about what else might be changing too.
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It looks fucking awful. No turn-based battles meaning it's pure button mashing with no tactical depth (perfect for all the casuals out there), pathetic looking pseudo-realistic anime characters that look just like in the movie Advent Children and cringy fully voiced dialogue. No thanks. I already had some pretty low expectations though, so I can't say I'm surprised. I'm just glad there's still an active modding community so I can just enjoy the original with updated graphics that stay true to the original.
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It looks ferning awful. No turn-based battles meaning it's pure button mashing with no tactical depth (perfect for all the casuals out there), pathetic looking pseudo-realistic anime characters that look just like in the movie Advent Children and cringy fully voiced dialogue. No thanks. I already had some pretty low expectations though, so I can't say I'm surprised. I'm just glad there's still an active modding community so I can just enjoy the original with updated graphics that stay true to the original.
::)
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^Amen.
Haha for the "non believer", just teasin' ;)
I can't hide my excitement for the game though no matter how you hate the modern outcome :P
As for the GoT, except for the first season I never dealt with this series. I guess is neither you adore nor you hate it. :mrgreen:
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It's only a teaser, the game can still end up being completely different when it finally releases in 2036.
Even Square will have to get their shit together at some point... I mean, if Capcom can do it then any company can. Maybe they'll surprise us... just maybe.
Until they release the next teaser where they show Genesis there's no reason to lose hope :D .
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It's only a teaser, the game can still end up being completely different when it finally releases in 2036.
That'll still be a shorter development cycle than Duke Nukem Forever.
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Would you rather live in a universe where Square just did a remaster, or where they're doing a remake?
The way I see it, the latter provides more value and potential, in proportion to "how different" it is.
Remember, not only can we mod the old game to be more "modern", but we'll also be able to mod the remake to be "more like the original".
Aww, you wanted it to be turn-based? Don't worry, I guarantee you there will be a mod soon enough to make it turn-based.
Aww, you wanted the choice to reject Aerith's flower? And for that to affect the date mechanics? Don't worry, there will be a mod for that.
The great thing about having a DIFFERENT remake is, it gives us a huge spectrum of possibilities. So more people can be pleased eventually. You just have to wait for the mod you want. Or write it yourself!
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Aww, you wanted it to be turn-based? Don't worry, I guarantee you there will be a mod soon enough to make it turn-based.
Aww, you wanted the choice to reject Aerith's flower? And for that to affect the date mechanics? Don't worry, there will be a mod for that.
You realize you're not gonna be modding absolutely anything on Playstation/Xbox right...? lol
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It uses Unreal Engine 4 so tools should be there. But it's not trivial to switch an action game to a turnbased game. I mean a lot of people is working on the balancing. For a turnbased mode you have to re-balance the whole thing. But it might be that they give us tools to modify the game, as they had tried it for FF XV.
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There eventually being mods available for the remake doesn't make me any happier, regardless of how easy or difficult it will be to mod this remake. The thing is, in order to apply mods to a certain game, you're gonna have to BUY said game first. And as long as Square-Enix is moving in their current direction they're not gonna get any money from me. I will keep my eye on this remake thingy and maybe watch a playthrough on youtube or whatever, but if the final game turns out to be the way many players fear at the moment, then I'm certainly not gonna support them in any way, shape or form.
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I am actually disappointed in Square-Enix for destroying Jessies face and hairstyle.
The other team did a much better job at keeping the look from the Playstation game that i liked. Her new face is too realistic - and her hair is totally not the charming hairstyle i liked in the original, and that i were pleased had been kept in the 2015 version..
The new Jessie is looking like a different woman dressed in the same clothing..
She has darker hair (not good), her hairstyle is wrong (very bad) and her face is too realistic (also not good - if the hairstyle were fixed i would be fine with her. Cyberconnect2 did a better job on Jessie.)
As for the others i liked the new designs, Wedge might have been too small - i prefer the much larger Wedge from the 2015 trailer as well. I don't like the style-change from the original. I wanted HD-versions of the FF7 characters - not realistic different looking FF7 characters.. They did Aerith perfectly right though.
- I have hated Clouds pants ever since advent children. I loved the German soldier styled pants. I don't like how they removed the coolness about them.
This is the 2015 Jessie:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D6Lids5U0AE-u6V.png)
(https://cdn.videogamesblogger.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/final-fantasy-vii-remake-jessie-and-biggs-screenshot.jpg)
This is the new:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D6LieVEUcAM9MSJ.jpg)
PS: I kinda always liked Jessie for some reason.. I really disapprove of the new 2019 hairstyle - the 2015 one was spot-on...
I did really love this look:
(http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/finalfantasy/images/b/b9/Mobius_Jessie.png/revision/latest/top-crop/width/480/height/480?cb=20160314094557)
Why is Square repairing what isn't broken? Do they think that because all their other IP:s are realistic that the anime-style needed to be changed for the FF7 Remake as well? Realistic anime-characters are 100% better than the new real-world style. Jessie is proof of that - i think they are doing a big mistake changing the original style of the characters. And CyberConnect2 at least understood that the original looks are the best..
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There eventually being mods available for the remake doesn't make me any happier, regardless of how easy or difficult it will be to mod this remake.
Though, it would be funny to replace the models with the original chibi models. Probably the best mod ever for the remake.
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Looks like crisis core sll over. Hate it.
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Though, it would be funny to replace the models with the original chibi models. Probably the best mod ever for the remake.
Lol, that would be super funny indeed! Imagine the faces of certain SE staff if such a mod actually manages to become popular, lol! Unlikely, I know, but a hilarious thought nonetheless.
About the character model looks: I've never cared about the details of those super-realistic character models in the various compilation games, but I remember various design choices by Square Enix that just left me shaking my head. When I first saw the Advent Children Sephiroth, I wondered for a moment if that was really him, looking so very different from his in-game counterpart (same with some other AC characters as well). Barret's new sun glasses were another... awkward choice to me, to say the least. Didn't the original Barret look baddass enough already? So why was this necessary? It doesn't add anything whatsoever to his character, and only serves to enhance that pseudo-coolness-factor that Square Enix seems to be so fond of.
And now this new Jessie... makeover? I'm completely with mr_nygren on this one, this woman looks like a completely different person now. If I were to just look at that picture of her, and without knowledge of the rest of the trailer, I'd never be able to identify her as Jessie...
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Would you rather live in a universe where Square just did a remaster, or where they're doing a remake?
The way I see it, the latter provides more value and potential, in proportion to "how different" it is.
Remember, not only can we mod the old game to be more "modern", but we'll also be able to mod the remake to be "more like the original".
Aww, you wanted it to be turn-based? Don't worry, I guarantee you there will be a mod soon enough to make it turn-based.
Aww, you wanted the choice to reject Aerith's flower? And for that to affect the date mechanics? Don't worry, there will be a mod for that.
The great thing about having a DIFFERENT remake is, it gives us a huge spectrum of possibilities. So more people can be pleased eventually. You just have to wait for the mod you want. Or write it yourself!
Sigh, this kind of argument again...
Imagine this:
It would be amazing if, instead of an action RPG, they made the remake into a puzzle-visual novel game where you have to solve mathematical equations to progress. Sephiroth is renamed KefkaYoBiatches and is a Dolphin. Palmer is now the main character; Cloud is dropped entirely. Now, any complaints or arguing against this direction could be countered with: "Just mod it to an action RPG with Cloud as the main character! It's just a game, and they are exploring their creativity, stop complaining, and look forward to it! CHANGE IS GOOD!"
Ye, moding an action RPG into a turn-based RPG isn't exactly trivial. How many "turn-based-RPG-to-action-RPG" mods is there of any game ever? I'm guessing extremely few or none. Where is the Dragon Quest 11 action mod?
SE is taking the action RPG direction mainly 'cause that's where the money is. Painfully obvious. Sure some -or even most- of the devs may like this route, but the £$¥ IS the main reason. Any marked research would tell you the demographic this game is catered towards (the mainstream gaming marked) prefer to play action-based games over turn-based.
I can't remember who was interviewed and when (Kitase?), but when asked if they will change the battle system, the answer was something like this: "Yes, it will be an action RPG, like you would expect, and as you are familiar with other FF remakes." Ummm... What remakes were those? And why would I expect a FF remake to be an action game? Pushing my expectations much?
It has also been said that turn-based games are outdated.
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How? When? Is chess outdated too?
And that teaser... Ye, nothing new under the sun. Move on.
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I'm personally still in the "I don't give a crap about the battle system" train. I want the story to remain fully untouched. 100% the same as the original. If the battles system is different, I don't care. Plenty of games use the ATB system, it's not something I'll cry about but if the story is changed, if parts are removed/added... then I'm gonna be pissed off.
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Lol, that would be super funny indeed! Imagine the faces of certain SE staff if such a mod actually manages to become popular, lol! Unlikely, I know, but a hilarious thought nonetheless.
About the character model looks: I've never cared about the details of those super-realistic character models in the various compilation games, but I remember various design choices by Square Enix that just left me shaking my head. When I first saw the Advent Children Sephiroth, I wondered for a moment if that was really him, looking so very different from his in-game counterpart (same with some other AC characters as well). Barret's new sun glasses were another... awkward choice to me, to say the least. Didn't the original Barret look baddass enough already? So why was this necessary? It doesn't add anything whatsoever to his character, and only serves to enhance that pseudo-coolness-factor that Square Enix seems to be so fond of.
And now this new Jessie... makeover? I'm completely with mr_nygren on this one, this woman looks like a completely different person now. If I were to just look at that picture of her, and without knowledge of the rest of the trailer, I'd never be able to identify her as Jessie...
I do agree with DLPB:s answer to my text mostly.
But chibi-models? No, they were great for their time but i want something new. But i would prefer HD-models that tries to look like the PRB/battle/FMV-models in HD. Or like in the 2015 trailer were they at least had a more anime-styled vibe. If they are too real-life like then FF7 will loose a part of it's charm. The unique style of Final fantasy VII made a difference in why it stood out. By making it in the same style as other Final Fantasy games it will no longer stand out from the others.
Edit: I answered this post to fast before reading everything.
Yes, i 100% agree that the characters looked a lot better in the original FMV-movies than in Advent Children. They should have kept the original style. Even if they made it realistic they should not have changed the clothes, the pants, the weapons etc - because the characters were already bad-ass in the original game. If they weren't we wouldn't have liked it. The style on the contrary was one of the most fascinating and important aspects of the game. Every character with few exceptions looked really cool! But Sephiroth in particular made me obsessive for a few years about him and the game - mostly because of him.
His looks were so bad-ass that i wanted to be him and play as him really badly. President Rufus wasn't far behind. All i am hinting at is that the new style of Advent Children was underwhelming compared to the original FMV's. And of course Tifa went from a 10 to a 6 - if rating her looks. I think most FF7-fans had a crush on her for a particular reason.
Changing the looks of Sephiroth made him look less cool, and especially his hairstyle looked off in all the modern games - in FF7 it looked perfect. Even the chibi-model of Sephiroth looked more bad-ass than the modern representations - especially in the "Temple of the Ancients". It just had a much better hairstyle and cold big eyes. Barret looked way better in the original, he became smaller and less huge in everything that followed.
About Jessie, i am happy we are two thinking like this - She looks like she could be any Japanese woman now. While the original had a much more unique look.
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I'm personally still in the "I don't give a crap about the battle system" train. I want the story to remain fully untouched. 100% the same as the original. If the battles system is different, I don't care. Plenty of games use the ATB system, it's not something I'll cry about but if the story is changed, if parts are removed/added... then I'm gonna be pissed off.
As close as possible would be the best. The story has a strong base but technically it has many plot holes, isn't logical in some places and sometimes there could be more information and explanation (like the relationship between Tseng and Aerith and way he hasn't captured her when she was young). The big thing of to be a Soldier is also only important at the beginning, the rest of the game doesn't even care about Soldier or Cloud's Soldier-dress. But with my experience of the games from Nomura and Kitase I have high doubts that something really intelligent will be presented to us. I still think that the happenings of the first CD will be happened in Midgar only. Maybe there will be some location swaps like in CC, but I don't believe that we get to see a real WM like in the original. But my hope is still not lost at all.
Regarding the battle system: I can live with ARPG system or with an ATB system. However, I hope we don't get a single action button smasher game a la KH. I also think that an ARPG will put the game in direct competition with God of WAR, Spiderman, etc, while a refined ATB system would make the game unique and more outstanding from the rest of the current game generation. Divinity Original Sins has proven that it doesn't need fast actions for a good game.
FFVII isn't perfect and that's the only reason why moding the game makes sense to me, unlike FFIX which is perfect in my opinion (on PSX at last. For the PC port they could have overhauled every character at last and not only a handful. Same with FFX).
PS MGS3 had a theater mode where you could see the vids with Snake from MGS1 and it was pretty cool. A fun mod with the original chibi models might look awkward but I guarantee you that this mod will be one of the most famous mods. Mostly because many wants a nostalgic kick.
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I'm personally still in the "I don't give a crap about the battle system" train. I want the story to remain fully untouched. 100% the same as the original. If the battles system is different, I don't care. Plenty of games use the ATB system, it's not something I'll cry about but if the story is changed, if parts are removed/added... then I'm gonna be pissed off.
I just suck at action-oriented gameplay, as it has for one failed to keep my interest for long, and second i suck at it - i had to use cheats at a certain point to get forward in Final Fantasy XII. But in V!!-IV i never had to. The reason was because the turn based battle-system is way easier to survive in. I do agree with Kaldarasha that the game would benefit from a unique system as compared to becoming like everything else on the modern market.
Final Fantasy VII with superior graphics, more story etc - doesn't need a new battle system. On the contrary the new battle system could be the cause of the game bombing ending any chances of part 2 and 3.
Let me return to the style again: DragonBall Z has looked the same since the 80's - they still do have 80's clothing. There is no need for FF7 to not have 90's clothing today so to speak. That is part of the charm.
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Courtesy of reddit... (https://i.redd.it/sy0oe7i2dcy21.jpg)