Author Topic: [FF7PC-98] Beacause - FF7 Retranslation (Merged into Reunion, use that instead)  (Read 362035 times)

DLPB_

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We have also injected personality into the translation.  And this part was badly done originally (Did Baskett use Google Translate?):

Old
Code: [Select]
{YUFFIE}
“Are you waiting for {CLOUD}?”{NEW}
“He's flying right now, so you can't get him.”{NEW}
“Were you going to force me
into the submarine right now?”{NEW}
“Quit it!
If you want to go, then just leave me behind.”{NEW}
“…ooooooh.
What're you talking about? I…”


New
Code: [Select]
{YUFFIE}
“{CLOUD}…
are we stuck up here?”{NEW}
“We…
can't just keep flyin' forever?”{NEW}
“Hey,now hold on!
Don't even think about
shovin' me in that sub again!”{NEW}
“I won't go! Never!
Leave me here,
leave me here!”{NEW}
“…Urrrrk.
What am I saying…?”
« Last Edit: 2012-05-24 18:32:29 by DLPB »

DLPB_

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Someone asked about Japanese script:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/36889302/FF7/Japanese_text.7z

Use latest 7zip and decode.

DLPB_

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OFFICIALLY HALF DONE. 8)

  • Dialogue (completed): 359/553
  • Dialogue (not completed): 194
    Dialogue: 681KB of 1353KB (50.33%)

StickySock

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Now is that 50% completed or 50% left to complete? Lol

Congrats! Now i impatiently await 75%  :-D

DLPB_

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FFFUUU

I have been through the Barrett issue and the only thing I can find is that if you have a bad kernel or a bad scene bin (hardcore mod would do it), the ff7.exe will be skipped leading to no translation changes. 

Please make sure you are using the original files (and delete backup-dlpb) the reinstall and see what happens.

DLPB_

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Time for another before and after:

Old
Code: [Select]
Ester
“Ummm…
First use {PURPLE}[ASSIST]{WHITE}
to choose either AUTO or MANUAL.”{NEW}
“This lets you control the Chocobo
yourself or lets it run on its own.”{NEW}
“But it's pretty hard to make the
Chocobo run the way you want it to.
If the Chocobo doesn't like you,
it won't listen.”{NEW}
“Then,you're stuck…”{NEW}
“But,most of the Chocobos
I have are mellow
and you should be able to
handle them.”{NEW}
“When you're riding,
use {PURPLE}[SWITCH]{WHITE} to Speed Up
and {PURPLE}[CANCEL]{WHITE} to Slow Down.”{NEW}
“But,if you go faster than
the Chocobo can handle,it will
quickly lose its stamina.”{NEW}
“Use the {PURPLE}[Directional Keys]{WHITE} to
move the Chocobo left and right,
use {PURPLE}[OK]{WHITE}
to get a boost of speed.”{NEW}
“But this makes your stamina
run out faster.”{NEW}
“Some Chocobos are bad-tempered
and can't pace themselves.
They'll lose their
stamina quickly.”{NEW}
“Those Chocobos should be
set on Manual
to slow them down.”{NEW}
“Finally,some advice
for the restless. Once
the first and second Chocobo
cross the goal line,”{NEW}
“Press {PURPLE}[START]{WHITE}
to end the race.”
------------------------------

New
Code: [Select]
Esto
“Righto…”{NEW}
“First,use {PURPLE}[ASSIST]{WHITE} to switch
between Auto and Manual.
You choose between controlling it
yourself or letting it run on its own.”{NEW}
“It's actually quite hard to make
a Chocobo do what you want.
If you've not bonded with it,
it won't listen to a word you say.”{NEW}
“That can't be helped
this time,unfortunately.”{NEW}
“Well,nevermind.
Most of the Chocobos
I prepare are quite mellow,
so you should be be fine.”{NEW}
“When you're in control,use
{PURPLE}[SWITCH]{WHITE} to speed up,
{PURPLE}[CANCEL]{WHITE} to slow down.”{NEW}
“But watch out…
If you push a Chocobo
faster than it can handle,it'll
lose its stamina in no time.”{NEW}
“You can guide the Chocobo
with the {PURPLE}[Directional Keys]{WHITE}.
To make it sprint,use the
whip by pressing {PURPLE}[OK]{WHITE}.”{NEW}
“Obviously,its stamina will
run out a lot faster this way.”{NEW}
“A Chocobo with poor
temperament doesn't know
its own pace and can wear
itself out almost immediately.”{NEW}
“If you're dealing with a
Chocobo like that,switch
to Manual and slow it down.”{NEW}
“Finally,
some advice for the restless.
Once first and second
place have been decided…”{NEW}
“…you can press
{PURPLE}[START]{WHITE} to end the race.”

I am also going back over the game from the beginning correcting some of my more clunky dialogue which was made from a lack of experience ;)

So new is:

Code: [Select]
District 1,Station
--------------------------------------------------
Biggs
“Wow…
You're from Soldier,all right!”{NEW}
“But… one of theirs
in a group like Avalanche…!?”
--------------------------------------------------
Jessie
“…Soldier? They're the enemy…”
--------------------------------------------------
Jessie
“Why would a Soldier join Avalanche?”
--------------------------------------------------
#h 3
Biggs
“Hang on,Jessie,
he quit Shin-Ra…
He's with us now.”
--------------------------------------------------
Biggs
“I didn't catch your name…”
--------------------------------------------------
{CLOUD}
“…{CLOUD}.”
--------------------------------------------------
Biggs
“{CLOUD},eh? I'm…”
--------------------------------------------------
{CLOUD}
“I'm not interested in names.
Once the job's done… I'm gone.”
--------------------------------------------------
“What the hell you all doin'!?
I told ya… never move in a group!”
--------------------------------------------------
“Our target's Mako Reactor 1.
Meet up at the bridge in front of it.”
--------------------------------------------------
“Ex-Soldier,huh?
Don't trust ya!”
--------------------------------------------------
{BARRET}
“You can run by
holdin' {PURPLE}[Cancel]{WHITE} with
the {PURPLE}[Directional Keys]{WHITE}.
Keep up with me!”
--------------------------------------------------

Soldier and 'a Soldier' are like the Marines.  So the 2 are used interchangeably.
« Last Edit: 2012-05-28 18:42:03 by DLPB »

DLPB_

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FF7 has an estimated 150000-180000 words.  (inc the battle text, kernel text).  I knew it had a lot of text but damn man, I didn't understand it until I started going through it all.

DLPB_

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In the coming days I am gonna be looking through this entire document and making a few minor concessions to literal vs localised. As you know, where possible I try to keep the actual intended translation unless it simply doesn't work or is too awkward.

In the past I have overlooked slightly awkward things but I will be looking at them again.  Only a minority of things will need changing, but the major one I am leaning towards is "Armour" making a return.  Luksy seems to agree that although Protections is intended and some of the items in the game cannot be armours (I mean bands and bangles are not armours), it may be wise to keep the other as it is a standard.

I have also decided to make items and materias you gain have a new format.  No more

Obtained "Masamune Blade"!

Instead the new format is

Obtained
     Masamune Blade!

Where Masamune blade will be in white.  We will see how it goes.

The materia will be coloured properly according to type.




A full break down of colours is:

Red: Summon Materia

Green: Magic Materia and sometimes highlighted dialogue.

Blue: Support Materia

Yellow: Command Materia

Purple: Independent Materia, menu names and controls.

Cyan:  Place names

Grey:  dialogue flash back scenes.

White:  Items.
« Last Edit: 2012-05-29 08:45:25 by DLPB »

Gemini

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Giving colors to items, places, and whatnot doesn't seem like a correction you should make, since you're adding something that wasn't there in the first place (and that's the main reason why you are retranslating: preserve the original material and providing better options when it's necessary). The original has other manners for making key words stick out.

As for the "Obtained X" string, I would go and fix the articles whenever necessary. "Obtained the Masamune" sounds more natural and that's what you'd usually find.

dkma841

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Well i actually prefer it with colours my mind get's bored just reading white text putting colours will make it much nicer and wake me up and seem more modern/updated

DLPB_

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The colours make no change to the translation.  Sure they were not there originally, but I think they add something to the game.  I can't see it hurting here to change the colour really...  and it does look better than simple white all the time.

StickySock

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I personally think that it is a great idea, especially since during my first playthrough of the game I hated having to search through my inventory when I recieved something to see what it was. Obviously I am not talking about picking up a materia, because you could obviously see it, but when you open a chest, steal from an enemy, or are given something from a side quest it would be nice to know what type of item it was.

The only problem I would see that may arise is from tutorial messages perhaps, unless you have separate colors for them.

DLPB_

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Tutorials can only be 1 colour anyway, they don't accept other flags.  This would only be for the "Obtained" text.

DLPB_

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Actually it looks OK for normal text too, and stops the pesky "All Materia" confusion.  Bonus.

DLPB_

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It took me 6 hours straight to fix some dialogue errors and update the text to include the new colours and format.

I must be literally mad.

Jaki

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Damn! You must have one or more people help you to complete this mod.
« Last Edit: 2012-05-30 09:54:54 by ZOSO »

DLPB_

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Please note, some kind fellows over at FF Wiki are again taking things we learned and giving no credit whatsoever, which sucks.  A bit of recognition for the hours of research would not go amiss.

The following is almost  final.  I have gone through all the things we have changed and made concessions for anything which was overly literal. I was surprised to find that 65 Attack names needed change.

I hope this goes someway to dispelling the myth that I want a literal sounding piece of crap.



Changes:


  • Protection goes back to Armour
  • Items in dialogue boxes have a new format such as

     Obtained
            Dragoon Lance
  • Ultimate Limit Breaks and Weapons are coloured in rainbow font. (apart from Aerith's Princess Guard)
  • Materia is colour coded.
  • The use of straight speech mark " is heavily restricted to proper use in dialogue only.
  • Enemy Avoid (materia) becomes Enemy Evade
  • Flame Emission (Enemy Skill) goes back to Flamethrower (I find it very likely that is what they meant.  The Japanese for this skill is 火炎放射 compare to Flamethrower 火炎放射器 and it looks like a flame thrower....  I dunno what possessed me to call it Flame Emission, I must have been on drugs!)
  • Ogrenix becomes Ogrenyx.  Nyx is the usual spelling of the Goddess from Greek Mythology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyx
  • Fire-Dragon Fang becomes Red Dragon Fang
  • Sea-Dragon Scales goes back to Dragon Scales

(Unless we call it Hydra Scales or something...  which keeps the sea monster connection in there)
  • Polar Wind goes back to being Antarctic Wind (this fits in with "Southern Polar Wind" and does not have to have connections with Earth that I first thought)
  • Toxic Substance becomes Toxic Waste (again must have been on drugs)
  • Gravity Ball goes back to Graviball
  • Mind becomes Intelligence
  • Mind up becomes Intelligence Up
  • Added "Autograph of" to the information area for Signed Shikishi.
  • Revive Materia becomes Rebirth Materia
  • Rise becomes Life
  • Araise becomes Lifa
Enemies and moves

Superball becomes Super Ball

Snap becomes Teeth Snap

Whole Body Tail becomes Tail

Defence End becomes Defence Down

Defence Start becomes Defence Up

Double Brain becomes Dual Brain

Energy Absorb becomes Absorb Energy

Big Eruption becomes Violent Eruption (dictionary gives this as one of the choices)

Great Tsunami becomes Mega-tsunami

Jumping Cartilage Sword becomes Jumping Sword (the other move establishes what the sword is)

Almost all Confuse become Confusion, as that is correct.

Lightning Strike goes back to Lightning

Magic Draining Cartilage Sword becomes Draining Sword

Neo Turk's Ray becomes Neo Turks' Ray (grammar was wrong)

Petrification Smog becomes Petrifying Smog

Petrification Finger becomes Petrifying Finger

Sad Yin Attack becomes Sad Yin

Shell Defence becomes Shell

Shield Defence becomes Shielding

Solo Wing Shot  goes back to Solo Wing Fire

Harmful Smog becomes Toxic Smog

Ultra Harmful Smog becomes Deadly Smog

Petrification Glare becomes Petrifying Glare

Powerful Kick becomes Power Kick

Violent Earthquake becomes Megathrust (which is a liberty.  See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megathrust_earthquake)

Triangular Attack becomes Triangular Offensive

Turk's Ray becomes Turks' Ray

Sword Upper becomes Sword Uppercut

Verbal Attack becomes Verbal Assault

Double Shield Throw becomes Shields Throw

Frog Petrification goes back to  Petrified Frog

Insulter becomes Insult

Before Firing becomes Loading Cannon

Big Mouth Breath goes back to Big Breath

Big Sound Wave becomes Super Sound

Big Rotation becomes Big Turn

Finger Shot becomes Finger Fire

Freezing Finger Shot becomes Freezing Finger Fire

Consecutive Claw becomes Continuous Claw

Cursing Words becomes Hex

Damage Attack becomes Damage

Dangerous Sting becomes Deadly Sting

Electric Discharge becomes Arc

Diverting Magnetic Field becomes Diverting Field

Fire Shot becomes Fire Blast

Flame Shot becomes Flame Dart

Flap Wings goes back to Flap

Flying Upper becomes Flying Uppercut

Glass Smash becomes Smash Glass

Head Attack becomes Head Charge

Big headhunting becomes Full Headhunting

Bubble Hell goes back to Hell Bubbles

Icicle Fall goes back to Icicle Drop

Last Left breath becomes Left's last breath
Last Right breath becomes Right's last breath

Paralysis Laser becomes Paralysing Laser

Scissor Tornado becomes Tornado Scissor

Shoulder Attack becomes Shoulder Barge

Slap becomes Face Slap

Sonic Attack becomes Sonic Strike

Spider Attack becomes Spider Thrust

Sword Attack becomes Sword

Drain Tentacle goes back to Tentacle Drain

Triple Attack becomes Triple Assault

Maybe I should call Petrifying Glare Medusa ;)  or is this a step too far  :-D


Things being looked into:

Twin-Dragon Fang

Any help appreciated with this.  The "fang" has to stay though no matter what.


Echo Screen > やまびこえんまく > Echo Smokescreen

Looking into this one again since やまびこ seems to have some connection with
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E5%B1%B1%E5%BD%A6

I can't read a word of that so I await Luksy's input.  It may be that when all is said and done "Smokescreen" on its own suffices... or it could be that this is some sort of legend that needs to be preserved.


Flower Prong   
フラワープラング
furawaapurangu
Flower Plunge

I am sticking with this for now even though kana does not match.  Funny thing to note is that プラン are plan (and this enemy is a plant).  Any relevance?


« Last Edit: 2012-05-30 15:29:25 by DLPB »

LeonhartGR

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Yeah! Nyx=νυξ=night (Nyx represents the Goddess of night)

DLPB_

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That also brings to an end my day.  I have been working on FF7 now since 12 last night, with around 2 hours break overall... that means I have been working on it 12 hours of 14.  Mad.

Reminds me actually...  On another forum a year or so ago, I was told that I don't really like FF7... that I must hate it, because I want to change it.  I'd love to punch the person who said that after what I just went through.  :-D

This is definitely the hardest thing I have had to do for any project anywhere... with 150000-180000 words... and so much formatting and localising and researching, it has taken considerable time to get this far alone.

If Baskett really did do the localising alone, it is no wonder he had such a hard time with the lack of support he got.  This is not a 1 or 2 man job...  it really needs  a good team to do it properly in an acceptable time frame (what we are doing is doing it properly in an unacceptable time frame).  So now I can see why the original translation was not up to scratch.  The work needed in there is not normal.  I can't emphasise that enough.

The amount of time needed is crazy.  I won't be beaten though!  By hook or by f*cking crook, this project is getting finished to a standard I am happy with.
« Last Edit: 2012-05-30 13:35:57 by DLPB »

DLPB_

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I have just added a few more changes above this post like Revive Materia

Revive > Rebirth
Rise > Life
Araise > Lifa

So what am I saying with all these changes?

I am saying that I was wrong.  :o  I was wrong to be completely gung ho with the adherence to accuracy at all times.  There is a small degree of lee way.  For the most part (like 95%) the actual 1:1 meanings are perfectly fine... but sometimes like above they just aren't.  The fundamental problem I have with most fan translations and of Baskett's original is that they take TOO MANY liberties.. and make too many mistakes.  For example, I could easily call Quake "Tremor" but what you get out of it cannot justify changing the work.

So yeah, I was wrong to be so hell bent on being "as literal as possible" before, but at the same time, it was also a good thing because it has made me very careful.  I think I am happy with all the non dialogue now...

The dialogue has given me a new perspective on localisation... that sometimes sacrifices must be made.  I understand now that invoking the same feelings in a person and capturing how the scene was meant to be felt and understood, is more important than an absolutely strict translation.

The dialogue has never been literal really, I always viewed it separate to non dialogue... but now I don't.  I see the whole project as one complete package. 

Don't expect me to be making many more concessions, if any at all... after the 70+ changes I have made today, I feel I now have the balance right.

If you do have a suggestion you can always tell me.
 
« Last Edit: 2012-05-30 15:16:13 by DLPB »

saftle

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I am relatively new to the FF7 modding scene and to this site, however I thought I'd say that that this project is outstanding so far.

Even though I beat FF7 nearly 13 years ago, I already notice so many changes since playing it then. The original English translation was definitely lacking. It wasn't even the grammar that really bugged me. It was more along the lines of just being confusing at times with how they chose to translate it.

Thank you for this project and I cannot wait for new updates. This is my first time playing FF7 in 13 years and your project has greatly enhanced the experience. I am also thankful to all those that have contributed.

DLPB_

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Still a long way to go...  after this project gets to 100%, a full run through will be needed to correct boxes, grammar and unnatural sentences...  I will get to a stage though where I am happy.

It is weird how it happens... for example, in the early days I was happy with

"Wow!  Just what I expected from Soldier!
But.. one of theirs in a group like Avalanche"

Then I went back months later and realised it sounded... crap.  So now it is

"wow! You're from Soldier, all right!" 

As you can see... these things are difficult to tie down... that is the skill here.

Thanks for that :)

IN other news, I am now finishing off the main excel document which will be placed on google for online viewing, rather than the clunky first posts here
« Last Edit: 2012-05-30 21:59:10 by DLPB »

knightsoftheround

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I've got a question in regard to Seto ie Red XIII/Nanaki's father. I wouldn't have thought of this if it wasn't for the absolutely massive amount of mythological references made in Final Fantasy and Squaresoft/Enix games, but...

It there any possibility it's instead supposed to be Set/Seth/Sutekh/It's all pronounced the same but no one can agree on a romanization, in reference to the Ancient Egyptian deity? I know due to other things I'm a big fan of that the katakana used for that god is "セト". Set would still maintain accuracy to the katakana if I understand katakana rules right, too. Here's the Wikipedia page on the god: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_%28mythology%29

In other news, I really like how you've set up the Item Get screen. I've got mixed feelings about the colors (I'm not fond of changes that don't exist for clarity and/or maintaining meaning) but the layout looks really nice.

Also how the heck does someone get the idea that you aren't a fan?! That smells an awful lot like you're getting burned by the video game version of the sub vs dub war...
« Last Edit: 2012-05-31 10:32:05 by mugenginga »

DLPB_

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Yeah I have already spotted the "set" thing, and left it alone.

The problem with the argument for the god here is that there is no way to tell...  with nearly all the other changes, it is perfectly obvious that a mistake has been made... there is something to go on.  But with Seto...  the kana gives no clue whatsoever on what was intended.

It could be any number of variants, including Set...  and Seth .

Without more to go on I have to leave things alone.

[ Also, Seto apparently means "Hidden" or "back door" in Japanese. sounds dubious to me, I will get Luksy to have a look)

also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seth
« Last Edit: 2012-05-31 14:24:46 by DLPB »

knightsoftheround

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Ah, okay. If you've thought of it that's fine. I'd probably go with Set to be accurate to both possibilities, but that's just me. It really is a minor thing. I'm... actually not envious of the choices you've had to make. XD edi

Edit due to your edit: I'm aware of the Hebrew Seth too - I've got an OC based on him, actually. If that potential translation is possible though, that lends the best evidence that Seto is what was intended. It honestly feels a better fit than any of the mythological connections.

So really, it is probably best to err on the side of caution and go straight from the katakana like you're doing. XD
« Last Edit: 2012-06-01 15:15:00 by mugenginga »