Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-09 20:15:00
![]("http://www.completeubb.f2s.com/devices.gif")
Post by: The Skillster on 2001-04-09 21:00:00
graphics card make,
sound card make
directx (if u want) version
and is the drivers correctly installed for the above two?
looks like there are drivers that are redundent in your system, or windows is detecting a device it doesnt know much about (ie multimedia cards, tv cards etc) also a list of cards on your motherboard?
Post by: J*** H******* on 2001-04-10 06:34:00
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-10 16:26:00
Pentium 2 MMX
233 MHZ
32MB RAM
Windows 98 SE
ATI Rage 2 Graphics Card
Yamaha OPL3-SAx Sound driver
Rockwell V.34 Voice, Speakerphone PnP Built-in Modem
DirectX 8
What do you mean by cards on my mother board? All of my system devices drivers were last updated in 1999 and the ones with PCI in their name already have the latest drivers. Need anymore info?
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-10 22:11:00
1) Your Rage Pro has video input/output (TV) build on to it. Some cards do; that would explain the extra devices. Even though it's one physical card, it (for ease of use) can appear as two devices.
2) Your motherboard has stuff like sound integrated on to it and you haven't disabled it. That's the extra devices.
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-11 14:24:00
oh yeah, how much would 96MB RAM cost cos i want to boost to 128MB RAM, and is it possible to buy MHz? cos ive got 233 at the mo, can you actually shove MHz sticks in like RAM?
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-11 22:28:00
RAM is cheap at the moment. About £0.50/MB, less in larger quantities. That's about $0.70? per MB in US money.
Speed ... is dependant on your CPU (processor). You can *replace* your processor. You could "upgrade" some 486's and earlier CPU's by adding on extra chips but not anything remotely modern. Your motherboard will support a certain range of CPU speeds; you may be able to take out your current chip and put in a faster one instead. Or if your motherboard doesn't support anything faster you'll need to replace the motherboard too.
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-11 22:39:00
You can get a new processor (and motherboard) but replacing the motherboard is a pain. You have to take just about everything out, take the motherboard out, put the new motherboard in, and then put everything you took off the first one back in.
Post by: Threesixty on 2001-04-11 22:40:00
And having onboard video and sound on, while having some PCI card installed that do the same thing, can cause all sorts of crashes.
Post by: The Skillster on 2001-04-12 17:40:00
no chance upping the CPU speed, unless itll support a cyrix M2 upto 333mhz?
if not then forget it, dump the motherboard CPU and the memory! buying a duron and a via motherboard plus some sdram ram and a new power supply too will be cheaper in the long term, believe me!!! dont go for a p2 or youll be slapped in the face when u need to upgrade!
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-12 19:15:00
....but expensive.
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-12 20:01:00
Post by: The SaiNt on 2001-04-12 20:40:00
I've read an article about it.
I can't remember the details but is has something to do with the P4 having a new architecture that makes it only faster than current processors only if the program code is optimised for it. If it uses the same normal optimizations in the code, the P4 performs with horrible performance. I could be wrong though. Now where did I last read that document?
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-12 22:09:00
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-12 22:30:00
Can someone point me to an article explaining the optomized code stuff? Is Athlon a better processor choice?
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-12 22:32:00
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-12 22:47:00
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-13 01:27:00
I don't know the exact details of the optimisations but I think it's something along the lines of even more multiple instruction execution ie. execute more than one instruction at the same time. (I could be wrong, can't remember exactly)
Post by: Anonymous on 2001-04-13 03:28:00
Post by: Threesixty on 2001-04-13 08:03:00
USA rough, pricewatch estimates:
P4 1.5Gig chip = 525
256 Rdram = 425
Motherboard = 190
total is around 1100 dollars
1.3 Athlon-C (266fsb) = 250
256 DDR = 130
(or) 256 Sdram = 110 (50 dollars if you choose the gamble-quality, generic stuff)
Motherboard = about 140
total is around 550
Then you have to add your extras....but there would be no difference in price for those.
I just put together an 1.2 Athlon C
MSI K7T-Turbo R (has built in sound)
256megs of Corsair Case 2, Sdram,
2 7200 IBM ultra 100, 30gigs Harddrives (running on Raid 0)
Antex SX1030b, Case
Alpha Pal 6035 heatsink
Geforce 2 PRO 64meg
for roughly 1400 dollars. If I had gotten the P4 it would probably have been in the 2000 dollar range.
Already had a Sb live card, monitor, CDRW, and a 3-1/4 floppy drive.
:D Had to do a little bragging
...my other computer is a 200mmx.
The P4 is like one of those "Lamborghini" cars.
The Athlon is like buying an old beat up car, slapping on a 800HP engine (can you say, HEMI?), and modifying the chassie.
(Same results...just less flash, and a whole lot of less money)
Besides, the P4 is having a lot of Hardware Compatiblility problems, a lot more than the Athlon VIA Chipset motherboards. (VIA seems to be ironing out their problems. I don't know what's going on the P4 side of things. I quit my PC research after I built this here, computer.)
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-13 09:18:00
I see what youre saying about the price and stuff. I'm not getting a new comp anytime soon (i don't think) but I'm looking at hardware and stuff, and I'll have time to see if people start writing software to take advantage of the P4 (which they probably will). If they don't, I'll go athlon.
Post by: Anonymous on 2001-04-13 15:06:00
Post by: Joey on 2001-04-13 15:13:00
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-13 17:17:00
Post by: Srethron Askvelhtnod on 2001-04-14 02:26:00
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-14 02:33:00
Post by: Threesixty on 2001-04-14 06:08:00
But with Athlon's highest Mhz (1.33G socketA) price vs. the lowest Mhz (850mhz socketA) price....well..the difference isn't so bad (the P3 is about the same..the P4 is in it's own little section. Hmm, the P4 is a lot like those old Pentium Pros. Remember those things?). There's, like, a two hundred dollar difference in price between the slowest and the fastest. It used to be a good 800 dollars difference in price, in the good ole days.
And there is no reason to overclock a 1.3G....or a 1.0G for that matter, because there isn't any software that really needs anything faster than that. And as far as games go....the Video Card Can't keep up with anythink over 900mhz.
As far as overclocking a P4? I don't know if it is possible or isn't. It all depends on the motherboard. And as far as I know, there are not that many to choose from. Can't really say if any of them allow overclocking. I also, doubt that the CPU is unlocked. (The 1.2 Athlon C that I bought was unlocked)
I just benched marked my System with SiSoft Sandra 2001.
The CPU Benchmarks Show the P4 1.6:
Dhrystone ALU 3065 MIPS
Whetstone FPU/SSE2 833/1955 MFLOPS
My 1.2:
Dhrystone ALU 3336 MIPS
Whetstone FPU 1607 MFLOPS
I don't know what either really means, but I'm going to guess that SSE2 is that optimize code that everyone is talking about, because it's only found on the P4 Benchmark Comparson chart. If you look at the other numbers. The Athlon 1.2 beats the Intel 1.6. Especially when it comes to the Float Point Calcs.
It's the memory Bench marks that the P4 excells at. My MSI board is well known for it's stablility, and unagressive Memory Timing (I haven't flashed to the 4-way interleaving, "OC" ("overclocking" beta) Bios. So the Benchmarks are a little lower than they can be. I'm waiting for an official release and if none ever comes, and if there is a way to activate the Raid bios...I heard that it doesn't turn on in that beta version...then I'll do the 4-way interleaving flash.)
Intel 850 PC800 CL2 Rdram:
Int ALU/RAM Bandwith 1374 MB/s
Float FPU/RAM Bandwidth 1400 MB/s
My System:
Int ALU/RAM Bandwith 490 MB/s
Float FPU/RAM Bandwidth 554 MB/s
But Rdram has it's problems....which makes it look good on paper, but not so good in the field. However it's still faster than Sdram, and cost four times as much!
I said it before...the only thing that's giving the P4 it's edge to the regular consumers base (people who just look at stats and don't consider the actual performace in real world tests) is the Rdram Hype. If you just look at the CPU speeds, Mhz to Mhz, the Athlon is a generation above the P4. (The P4 is nothing more than a P3 with Rambus, at least, that's what It looks like to me.)
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-14 06:46:00
Go to www.pricewatch.com and check out the prices they have there. A lot of computer part retailers enter their prices into there often, so you get a good idea on where you can find the part you're looking for at the best price.
Post by: Wing on 2001-04-14 07:08:00
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-14 14:30:00
Here, at least, the more you spend the more you save! I can save £10-£20 on a £100 upgrade, but I saved nearly £100 off my parents' £500 PC. A full PC, costing over £1000, I could save £200 off the price of a big name easily.
Plus in the UK, you always get at least 12 months warranty on parts- and the big companies won't give more than that unless you're gonna pay for it.
Post by: The SaiNt on 2001-04-14 15:36:00
Well, O/C ing also depends on the batch of processors that you have. Certain batches do perform better than others. Sometimes, O/C ing a processor, doesn't only depend on the temperature. In some cases, people actually do a "voltage mod" to gain higher voltages for O/C ing. The highest one i've seen is 2.97's for an Athlon I think....
But honestly, the extra effort spent O/C is sometimes just not worth it. If you like to boast clock speeds not available in the market yet, then hey go ahead. I'm not against O/C here however. I've O/C ed my Athlon 1Ghz to a 1.3 before. But I decided that it wasn't worth the performance increase so I've put it back to 1 Ghz. After all, I don't exactly play games in software mode or anything. My Geforce GTS can easily take care of things. :)
Threesixty, you have a RAID setup too?
I have 20GB Quantum AS drives running on RAID stripping and I would say performance is excellent :)
I might as well post my system specs:-
Abit KT7 RAID Motherboard (KT-133 Chipset)
Highpoint 370 RAID Controller built on M/B
256 MB 150 MHz Kingston SDRAM
1000Ghz @ 1300 AMD Athlon Processor
2 X 20GB Quantum AS (7200 rpm) drives.
MSI Geforce GTS 32MB (Core @ 245 / RAM @ 393) w TV output
ASUS RIVA TNT with built in Video Capture.
SBLive! Value Sound Card
Altec Lansing ACS 54 4-point speakers
50X Aopen CD-Rom Drive
Yamaha CRW 2100ES IDE CD Writer
(40X read, 16X Write, 10X Rewrite)
(101 CD-R's in my cupboard)
External ZIP 100 MB USB
Sony 17" Trinitron E200 Monitor (Flat Screen)
Microsoft Professional Natural Keyboard (USB)
Logitech Optical Eye Mouse (not the ifeel one)
3Com US Robotics 56K modem (Yuck!, a disgrace to my PC)
1.44 MB Mitsubishi Floppy Drive (Another, old object)
12 Fans in my PC. (Note all the Fans in my PC are Overvoltages to either 17V or 24V)
Yeah, my PC is as noisy as an aeroplane. :D
A Scanner and Printer which I'm too lazy to give details about :)
Hehe, you should see the amount of plug points I use in this room of mine :)
I have a fax machine, a VCR, A Hifi Set, 2 PC's, a scanner, a printer, a modem, a zip drive, a TV, ,my PCspeakers and a few other electrical components here. :P
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-14 18:56:00
Post by: ficedula on 2001-04-14 19:04:00
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-14 19:06:00
Post by: Wing on 2001-04-14 19:53:00
Post by: The SaiNt on 2001-04-14 22:04:00
My CD Writer? It burns at 16X(2400KB/s)
Unfortunately, it only achieves 16X after it has written about 25% of the CD. It starts at 12X. The only drive I know that can achieve true 16X Write is the Plextor Drive.
Post by: eerrrr on 2001-04-14 22:37:00
Post by: Aaron on 2001-04-15 01:01:00
Post by: Trilinear on 2001-04-28 11:48:00
Post by: The SaiNt on 2001-04-28 11:58:00
It isn't any really known branded casing.
Though I've practically modified the whole thing :)
Post by: Trilinear on 2001-04-28 13:10:00