Author Topic: Hardest Part of FFVIII  (Read 5762 times)

Lionheart1827

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Hardest Part of FFVIII
« on: 2001-04-02 05:20:00 »
This is a pointless topic.  But anyway, i think the hardest part of ff8 is on the way down to ultima weapon.  not fighting him, butgoing down into that cave and you fight really tough monsters like 2x iron giants at once, or behemoths and ruby dragons and you cant save and you have to be lucky to escape also until you get down to ultima weapon.  That i think is the hardest part of the game.
What do you think the hardest is guys?

eerrrr

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« Reply #1 on: 2001-04-02 20:58:00 »
yeah that was probably the hardest part. i never got to disc 4 though cos i got bored of ff8 and now im playing ff9. those stupid ruby dragons were right wankers. then when i got to ultima weapon i thought it would be really hard but it was easy, they should have just done another ruby dragon.

Terence Fergusson

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« Reply #2 on: 2001-04-02 23:57:00 »
Considering that there is a way to prevent any of those monsters appearing on the way down to Ultima Weapon (if they appear, you obviously didn't solve the puzzle correctly), and that there's a hidden Save Point at the bottom, I find it hard to believe that that is the hardest part of the game.

Aaron

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« Reply #3 on: 2001-04-03 00:51:00 »
Omega and Ultima Weapon themselves are pretty tough.  That part isn't too hard (Odin came to 90% of the fights I fought there anyway and if he doesn't show up, Diablos does good damage).

The MOST ANNOYING THING is the Tonberrys.  You have to kill like 20 to get the Tonberry GF.


The Skillster

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« Reply #4 on: 2001-04-03 01:40:00 »
WOW! TERRENCE! where have u been the last 6 months? hibernating  :wink:

Terence Fergusson

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« Reply #5 on: 2001-04-03 07:40:00 »
The term is lurking.  Since I rarely have the chance to get here *EVERY* day, I tend to just watch, especially since the discussions I normally *want* to take part in have often moved on or are too old.  Or have been answered adequately by other people.

eerrrr

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« Reply #6 on: 2001-04-03 14:39:00 »
what do you mean 'there is a way to prevent any of those monsters appearing'? you cant use enemy away down there and when you're talking about the hidden save point do you mean the one at the bottom just before you fight Ultima.

The Skillster

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« Reply #7 on: 2001-04-03 15:43:00 »
er? terrence if DONT solve the steam pressure problem correctly then there ARE NO FIGHTS on the way down and theres no ultima weapon either! only when u solve the puzzle properly do the fights begin

The SaiNt

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« Reply #8 on: 2001-04-03 17:14:00 »
It really has been a long time since i've seen Terence actually make a reply

The Skillster

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« Reply #9 on: 2001-04-03 18:15:00 »
hey terrence we could sure use your brains down in the tech forum!! we have dillemas with all sorts of FF7 PC tech issues, just have a look  :wink:

Terence Fergusson

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« Reply #10 on: 2001-04-03 23:43:00 »
False.  If you use Zell to use his... uh... mechanical skills, then you will have all sort of fights that you have to complete before you get down to Ultima Weapon.

If you complete the puzzle *PROPERLY* (finding the steam room, not wasting energy points, and having enough points to both open the fisrt door and raise Ultima Weapon *without* Zell's interference), then there are no extra fights on the way down to Ultima Weapon.  You can even save there just before the battle with a hidden save point.


And I've been watching the Tech forums anyway.  I've never gone *that* deep into the games... although I've more been interested with how the game mechanics work, rather than how the files are stored.  When you get to game mechanics, I'll start taking more notice :P


The Skillster

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« Reply #11 on: 2001-04-04 01:51:00 »
i guess u still dont know where the battle encounter stats r stored?

Threesixty

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« Reply #12 on: 2001-04-04 06:51:00 »
Yeah, well...I think the hardest part of FF8PC was getting it to run properly with a Geforce 2 card with a mislabled Geforce patch while running the wrong Nvidia D3 Driver version and then trying to figure out what to do, not knowing all of that.  :)

(the gamma correction on the menus and walking/talking areas is still not right...it should be darker....but the battle engine is just right...no way of fixing that, at least I don't think there is.)


Terence Fergusson

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« Reply #13 on: 2001-04-04 07:01:00 »
Skillster> I don't actively look at the files.  I do more memory hacking than anything (this helped majorly in deciphering how the save file was stored).  That's why I've been leaving most of the file hacking to the other people in the Tech Forum.  For now, I don't believe I'm needed ^_^

But if you start delving into game mechanics, like how damage is calculated, I'll suddenly become very interested :P


The Skillster

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« Reply #14 on: 2001-04-04 10:52:00 »
but isnt the encounter rates and enemy info temporarly stored in the memory once u step onto that feild level (ie world map?) because eventually it has to get uploaded to the ram. and yes once the files have been buggered they will need to fiddle with the game mechanics, especially halkun as he making his own ff7.exe for linux!

Terence Fergusson

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« Reply #15 on: 2001-04-04 15:11:00 »
Possibly, but not in a way that can be easily found.  What you fight in the overworld, for example, depends in exactly which area you are, what terrain you're on, and all kind of factors that can change in a heartbeat.  Best you could do is find the timer, but that wouldn't help you in finding the encounter info itself, since it's likely just a table of some sort that might even be kept in memory all the time.

Your best bet is probably sifting through the field data, and seeing if you can find something that looks like an encounter list in there ^_^


Aaron

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« Reply #16 on: 2001-04-04 19:17:00 »
I know a good bit about how the random encounter thing works in Final Fantasy VI, that might help?  I've gone into editing the ROM and such.  Tell me if you'd like me to explain it...

The Skillster

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« Reply #17 on: 2001-04-04 20:39:00 »
please, any help is much appreciated.
my ultimate goal would be to completly munipulate the ff7 battle system, but for now, im content with infos about how the encounter rates and the battle infos are stored / loaded

Aaron

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« Reply #18 on: 2001-04-04 23:15:00 »
Ok, here's how it works.

There are a number of different memory allotments for sets of random encounters.  Each area has four combinations.  As in, any area on the overworld, there are four possible sets of enemies you can fight there.  There are memory values that show the relative possibilities of encountering each group, too.

For the overworld, it is divided into sections, and for each section, there are four groups of four encounters I think - one for grass, one for desert, one for forest, and one for... something else, been too long, I can't remember.  Depending on what terrain you're standing on when the timer runs out, you get one of the four possible encounters for that terrain.  For some cases, there is more than one terrain possibility for other areas besides the overworld map.

Did I confuse you?  There's a program - its called FF3usME - you can get it from http://www.zophar.net" TARGET=_blank>www.zophar.net  .  It lets you go in and look at all this junk and edit it too if you have a ROM file.


The Skillster

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« Reply #19 on: 2001-04-05 16:45:00 »
hmm been there done it saved it and runned it!  :D
seriously i see the logic, but we really need to find how hey r stored...

Aaron

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« Reply #20 on: 2001-04-05 19:19:00 »
Yeah, I don't think I can help you figure out how they're stored, but I bet they WORK a lot the same ... .... ... maybe that will help you a little?  Maybe not, I dunno.

I bet it loads the possible encounters when you enter a scene.  FF6 even decides WHAT the next fight will be in how many steps when you enter a scene (it has to change its decision though if you step into a different terrain).  I think it also goes ahead and makes decisions about what the enemies will do first when you enter an area (when I do save state, at the beginning of an area, ALWAYS I walk the same amount of spaces for a fight and ALWAYS the enemies pull off the same first moves).

Oh well I'll shut up now.


The Skillster

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« Reply #21 on: 2001-04-05 22:50:00 »
no dont stop u ARE CORRECT in ff7 terms too.
qhimm and terrence will confirm this too, ive been testing ficedulas ff7music patch and i used the same save (on the world map outside corel towards gold saucer) and it takes EXACTLY indentical amount of steps to the next fight which is either with 2 joker/card dealing things or (more often) this sea horse dragon things that thru boomerang thingys (very BAD desciption ) and theres always 3 of em. yes the battle "formations" are loaded into memory, only prob is hunting them and changing them, then say record the value, make a patch or a trainer? then move to editing the formations etc till we now what that segment of the memory stores, and i bet the way its in the memeory is the way it is stored on disk? you ll notice the same for save files, they are simply uploaded to a certain portion of ram, my my, can u think of setting up your next fight with diamond weapon? THREE times in a row? with the boss music playing? sounds good doesnt it? thats what we want to acheive in terms of battle munipulation!

Aaron

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« Reply #22 on: 2001-04-06 01:36:00 »
Ah, so you've gotta locate where in the RAM or in the save file this battle data is stored, and then change it around for a while and see what possibilites you can come up with... sounds fun, haha.

Oh yeah, in FF6, each battle "formation" of enemies you can fight, in addition to having data about which monsters there will be, also specifies the music that will be played and there are references to special triggers and such that can occur during the fight (only for boss or special battles).  Probably sometihng similar in FF9.


The Skillster

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« Reply #23 on: 2001-04-06 14:30:00 »
yep. but the battle data aint stored in the saves, they are loaded up to memory when u enter the world map, must be something to do with the world map files? besides, ff7 uses about 50mb of ram (varies on each system) so where the hell do i starT? ive looked b4 but to no avail, i need to nail down its location , could someone tell me the area in the memory that it might be stored in? then i could refine my search?