Author Topic: Interesting........... (Read 29318 times)

Sephiroth 3D · « **Reply #25 on:** 2002-05-30 05:48:32 »

My 450mhz PC with my 64meg GF2 & 256mb of RAM can out perform a PS2 with no problems.

However, that's assuming that I'm running the game, and ONLY the game. No OS or anything. Just the game.

It's when you run an OS on your system that you suddenly need a 3Ghz+ processor with 1GB or RAM. Because suddenly, you need the processing power and memory for the OS, and all of it's sub-systems. Windows alone nearly taxes my system.

Can modern computers outperform a PS2? Yes. Can it do so with modern equipment & an OS? Not yet, but that level of technology is coming, and coming soon...

In the meantime, the PS3 should be coming out in a year or so...

Sephiroth 3D

"I don't understand..." "You don't have to understand." - Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within

Sephiroth 3D.com
[email protected]

Aaron · « **Reply #26 on:** 2002-05-30 12:40:12 »

Yeah, that's an advantage of consoles, they really don't need that much of an OS...

Qhimm · « **Reply #27 on:** 2002-06-01 09:23:39 »

The OS does account for part of the PC dragdown, but it's not the sole source of evil for PC gaming. We're still left with the fact that there's hardly two identical PC configurations in the world, a lot of subsystems, drivers and generalization is needed. The game has to be written at a very generic level, or have specific versions for specific hardware. Either way, programmers can't (or doesn't have the endurance to) take advantage of certain hardware-specific features fully. The result is that they only use the stuff supported by the average card, but use more and more of it. For some types of games, this produces a good result, but it's hard to create these subtle effects for atmosphere using only these... I mean, even motion blur still isn't widely supported and has to be pseudo-implemented by say, double-rendering each poly at offsets. This was supported from the start on the PSX, and that's quite a while ago now. That is one of the consoles' primary strengths, the universal hardware configuration. But now that console expansion kits are getting more common, I have a nagging suspicion in the back of my head...

dgp9999 · « **Reply #28 on:** 2002-06-03 18:55:54 »

::gargles with tongue hanging out:: Oooh. I think I should marry my PS2 instead. I already knew that the PS2's bandwidth was enoumous, but not THAT much. I'm glad that people of your knowledge have clarified this for me, and everyone (especially my m8 who think his future XBOX is gonna rock. All I can say is LAAAAAAAAG!) He was complaining about lag on Blood Omen 2 on the PS2, I don't think he understands games have to LOAD!

Who manufactured the Emotion engine and the GPU?

EDIT: Also, I think he should look at the post above mine from Qhimm. Here John, here's your answer to why PC-converted XBOX games look better than the PC equivelent. Develepers have to cater for those without Athlon XPs.

atzn · « **Reply #29 on:** 2002-06-03 19:58:44 »

Quote from: dgp9999

::gargles with tongue hanging out:: Oooh. I think I should marry my PS2 instead. I already knew that the PS2's bandwidth was enoumous, but not THAT much. I'm glad that people of your knowledge have clarified this for me, and everyone (especially my m8 who think his future XBOX is gonna rock. All I can say is LAAAAAAAAG!) He was complaining about lag on Blood Omen 2 on the PS2, I don't think he understands games have to LOAD!

These are my PERSONAL OPINIONS.... please do not start shouting at me for no reason

You can post your opinion if you want.
XBOX. Why I hate it?
Reasons:
(vs. PS2)
1. Graphics? Am I sarcastic or what... well this is my personal opinion about Xbox's graphics: It's crap. I don't know. Everybody's hyping about Halo, which I don't see anything special at all. Also, you don't play FPS on a console, do you?? I've tried playing UT on Dreamcast, it was a horrible experience. I feel that PS2 has better graphics than Xbox, I might be wrong.
2. Gamepad. Awww... just look at XBox's gamepad! For heaven's sake. I am going to be 18 next year, and yet I feel that my hands are too small for the bulky gamepad. The button designs are..... ok I think. But I don't really like it. I prefer PS2's, it's more simplistic and comfortable to hold. (Also the nice ol' Dual Shock

)
3. Lack of good games. Well, I don't play consoles, but I must admit that Xbox has not many games to offer. And look at the pricing of the games, it's ridiculous! 45 quid for a XBox game. A PS2 game would cost 10 pounds cheaper. Huh.

Well that's it really. If I was given the chance to buy a console, I would definitely go for a PS2. It's cheaper than Xbox, after all. (Although GameCube is the cheapest latest console)

Aaron · « **Reply #30 on:** 2002-06-03 20:33:01 »

Quote

XBOX. Why I hate it?
Reasons:
(vs. PS2)

I'm also gonna go vs. Gamecube.

Quote

1. Graphics? Am I sarcastic or what... well this is my personal opinion about Xbox's graphics: It's crap. I don't know. Everybody's hyping about Halo, which I don't see anything special at all. Also, you don't play FPS on a console, do you?? I've tried playing UT on Dreamcast, it was a horrible experience. I feel that PS2 has better graphics than Xbox, I might be wrong.

PS2 has been around longer and developers have had more time to get used to it. I remember when PS2 was new (in Japan), most all the early games weren't that impressive. Gamecube and X-Box are both definately capable of better graphics than PS2.... give 'em a year.

Quote

2. Gamepad. Awww... just look at XBox's gamepad! For heaven's sake. I am going to be 18 next year, and yet I feel that my hands are too small for the bulky gamepad. The button designs are..... ok I think. But I don't really like it. I prefer PS2's, it's more simplistic and comfortable to hold. (Also the nice ol' Dual Shock )

Very true. PS2's gamepad is better (and Gamecube's is cool too).

Quote

3. Lack of good games. Well, I don't play consoles, but I must admit that Xbox has not many games to offer. And look at the pricing of the games, it's ridiculous! 45 quid for a XBox game. A PS2 game would cost 10 pounds cheaper. Huh.

PS2 and GCN both have some impressive games. The only X-Box game that I've heard is really good is Halo. PS2 has FFX, GTA3, MGS2, etc.... and GCN definatley has SSB:M (enough said).

Quote

Well that's it really. If I was given the chance to buy a console, I would definitely go for a PS2. It's cheaper than Xbox, after all. (Although GameCube is the cheapest latest console)

Um... I dunno about where you are, but here, PS2 and X-Box are both $199.99 and GCN is $149.99. Games all sell for about the same price ($50 for new games).

atzn · « **Reply #31 on:** 2002-06-03 20:59:59 »

The reason why I didn't compare it to a GC is because I didn't see a GC b4, so I guess I better shut up about GC. What I know is that GC is cheap compared to PS2 and Xbox.

And er, you're right; Xbox and GC definitely can beat PS2 in graphics, guess I made a mistake there.
Made another mistake in pricing, yeah both Xbox and PS2 are at the same price. I was thinking about a few weeks ago, where Xbox costed 299 pounds vs. PS2's 199 pounds

As about games... I don't really think I am making a mistake here, Xbox games do cost a bit dearer than PS2's or GC's........

But I'm definitely not mistaken about this one:
GC doesn't have a DVD drive, but it uses a special CD drive instead (1.5gig capacity? or something like that)

Aaron · « **Reply #32 on:** 2002-06-03 21:39:19 »

Quote

GC doesn't have a DVD drive, but it uses a special CD drive instead (1.5gig capacity? or something like that)

Not entirely correct. Gamecube does have a DVD drive... it's just only big enough to hold 3 inch DVDs (1.5 gig). Since normal-sized DVDs cannot fit in it, obviously you cannot use it as a DVD player.

Advantages to the smaller DVDs: Well, they're harder to burn (I've never seen 3-inch DVD-Rs on sale) so this has killed piracy of GCN games, at least for now. It's also just... smaller. Not to mention that the track that the actual data is on is only like an inch wide, meaning extremely low seek time (which probably contributes to GCN's amazingly fast loading speeds).

Disadvantages... well you can't hold as much data (1.5 gig compared to DVD 4.7 gig) but 1.5 gig is still plenty for most games. They can always go double-disc or double-layer or maybe even double-sided (or some combination of the three). And of course, you can't use your GCN as a DVD player :-p Some people care about that, but I don't.

If you REALLY wanna use your GCN as a DVD player, you can buy that thing from Panasonic (Q-something) that is a DVD player Gamecube combo. Unfortunatly, you have to get it modded to play US/Europe DVDs/games (I dunno if it'll do PAL, actually) and it ends up costing like $400. Ow.

Hopefully they'll be smart and release a US version.

Interesting thought... I wonder if the GCN can read 3 inch CD-Rs? I've seen them at stores. Would be kinda interesting, b/c then it would be possible for the average user to program for the GCN (like some people have come up with Game Boy or PSX demos).

Sephiroth 3D · « **Reply #33 on:** 2002-06-04 03:53:29 »

Unforunatly, they wanted to release it in the US, but decided against it. Probably because the most piracy in the world come from the US. With a PGQ (Panasonic Game Q) you could easily make a DVD-R copy of your favorite Gamecube game and play it. (That's a theory, I haven't heard of anyone doing it.)

In Short, you can get a univerally modded Panasonic Game Q for about $400-450, but there are currently no plans to offically released in the US.

Sephiroth 3D

"I don't understand..." "You don't have to understand." - Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within

Sephiroth 3D.com
[email protected]

Caddberry · « **Reply #34 on:** 2002-06-04 07:20:13 »

I actually thought that most of the piracy came from other countries.. like uh.. like.. well just other poorish countries.. people dont have the money to buy software so they pirate it.. this is what i heard.. not alot of crackers in the U.S. mostly script kiddies.. i am talking the hard to pirate stuff.. nevermind i will shut up now..

Sephiroth 3D · « **Reply #35 on:** 2002-06-04 13:34:51 »

hey... I could be wrong about that piracy thing...

Sephiroth 3D

"I don't understand..." "You don't have to understand." - Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within

Sephiroth 3D.com
[email protected]

Aaron · « **Reply #36 on:** 2002-06-04 14:01:17 »

Maybe some day they'll put out 3-inch DVD-Rs... there are 3-inch CD-Rs around now (approx 150 meg I think). I wonder if any gamecube games can fit on 150 meg?

dgp9999 · « **Reply #37 on:** 2002-06-04 18:11:47 »

FFTacticBoy: I know. I wasn't being sarcastic about my PS2. XBOX is s***e on a stick

atzn · « **Reply #38 on:** 2002-06-04 18:16:47 »

Quote from: Caddberry

I actually thought that most of the piracy came from other countries.. like uh.. like.. well just other poorish countries.. people dont have the money to buy software so they pirate it.. this is what i heard.. not alot of crackers in the U.S. mostly script kiddies.. i am talking the hard to pirate stuff.. nevermind i will shut up now..

haha lol Malaysia is well-known for piracy. One PC game only cost like 1.7 USD?
Even funnier is, if u buy more CD, they reduce the price. LOL haha.

VCDs are even cheaper, they cost like erm.. 0.80 USD? ridiculous prices. Not only that, it is DVD quality. Sharp 'n' clear.

Aaron: Thanks for clearing that

I thought GC uses their own tech for their own drive..... heh.

Aaron · « **Reply #39 on:** 2002-06-04 21:26:29 »

Um... VCD's are definately not DVD quality, or "sharp and clear." Let's compare:

VCD: 352x240 pixels
DVD: 720x480 pixels

DVD is twice the resolution! I dunno about you, but I definately noticed this the first time I saw a VCD.

There are "Super VCD's" (SVCD) and those are 480x480 (I think it stretches it horizontally to fit on the screen). Not quite there yet though...

BTW, I think SVHS tapes are higher quality than VCDs, if I remember correctly. You can't really give a resolution to them though, since they aren't digital.

Sephiroth 3D · « **Reply #40 on:** 2002-06-05 02:20:57 »

Hmm... How much is a PS2 in Malaysia, in USD? I wonder if I could import it & play it... :wicked:

Also, how much is a Gamecube? Just curious...

Sephiroth 3D

"I don't understand..." "You don't have to understand." - Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within

Sephiroth 3D.com
[email protected]

The SaiNt · « **Reply #41 on:** 2002-06-05 07:36:32 »

Quote from: Sephiroth 3D

Hmm... How much is a PS2 in Malaysia, in USD? I wonder if I could import it & play it... :wicked:

Also, how much is a Gamecube? Just curious...

We have no "pirated" PS2's in Malaysia, so it'll probably be more or less the same price.

atzn · « **Reply #42 on:** 2002-06-05 17:21:24 »

Quote from: The SaiNt

Quote from: Sephiroth 3D
Hmm... How much is a PS2 in Malaysia, in USD? I wonder if I could import it & play it... :wicked:

Also, how much is a Gamecube? Just curious...

We have no "pirated" PS2's in Malaysia, so it'll probably be more or less the same price.

Yes we do have it in Penang, Saint. It costs around RM1300 (~USD 300)
But it has some mods, first is the lens (obviously...) <to play DVD> and a VG mod for the memory card as well lol

And one DVD costs RM12 (that would be 3 USD?)
Anyway PS1 games are dirt cheap now in msia... like 0.80 USD for a CD?
However, it has a setback though. Abuse the modded PS2 (i.e like playing 10 hours a day) and I think the modded PS2 will easily wear off in a year or two. Control yourself, and I think it should be able to last for 5 years?..

Aaron:
Yeah, I know VCDs have lower resolution than DVDs, I am just trying to mean that the quality of the VCD is nearly the same as DVD? (Although they can't be as sharp?)
Kinda hard to explain it to you, ..usually VCDs don't look sharp, ermm..

Anyway .... umm.. PC Games price dropping as well... heh if I'm not mistaken, since I left Malaysia the price has dropped from RM7 to RM6(~1.55 USD)?

Zophixan · « **Reply #43 on:** 2002-06-05 21:59:08 »

He means that the pirate vcds in Malaysia now use mpeg4 encoding which makes it fit on a disk, The Pirated Tomb Raider is dvd quality on a vcd disk.

atzn · « **Reply #44 on:** 2002-06-05 22:15:53 »

Quote from: Zophixan

He means that the pirate vcds in Malaysia now use mpeg4 encoding which makes it fit on a disk, The Pirated Tomb Raider is dvd quality on a vcd disk.

Yeah! You catch my drift. That's what I am thinking.... heh thanks for clearing stuff up.

Joey · « **Reply #45 on:** 2002-06-06 08:59:10 »

Usual... pirated DVD apiece costs bout RM20 and its much more expensive compared to VCDs RM5 apiece.

PC games cost RM10, RM5 or RM8 apiece depending on where u buy it.

Zophixan · « **Reply #46 on:** 2002-06-06 10:24:29 »

I thought you could get dvd fakes for about 13rm and games for 8rm? At the klcc.

J* H***** · « **Reply #47 on:** 2002-06-06 14:20:02 »

Message.

The SaiNt · « **Reply #48 on:** 2002-06-06 18:06:59 »

Quote from: FFTactic_Boy

Yes we do have it in Penang, Saint. It costs around RM1300 (~USD 300)
But it has some mods, first is the lens (obviously...) <to play DVD> and a VG mod for the memory card as well lol

Uhm, you sure about it?
Who would buy it if it costs just as much as the original?

atzn · « **Reply #49 on:** 2002-06-06 19:27:38 »

Quote from: The SaiNt

Quote from: FFTactic_Boy

Yes we do have it in Penang, Saint. It costs around RM1300 (~USD 300)
But it has some mods, first is the lens (obviously...) <to play DVD> and a VG mod for the memory card as well lol

Uhm, you sure about it?
Who would buy it if it costs just as much as the original?

Well yeah I am pretty sure 'bout it; because I have a friend from Imperial London who has just went back to KL, he bought himself a PS2 (His is original though) and he told me that it is possible to mod it. I've also got a few Penang contacts in my ICQ (my ex-schoolmates) who told me that it is possible to mod PS2 as well.

I don't understand the bit where you say about price.. I mean if it costs RM12 for a game (DVD), wouldn't you save more than buying an original DVD (Probably RM170 for new titles??<Conversion from UK pounds>)

And a PS2 costs RM800 now (that's according to my Imperial friend heh

)

Well anyway I won't be back to Malaysia till.... end of next year heh. So probably prices will continue dropping.....

Jari: well, er... yeah true a VCD will never reach DVD quality.... heh

Joey: Pirated DVDs for RM20? hmm I thought it would be RM50...

Zophixan: Well it depends on where you buy your CD though, if its in places like KL probably they will hike up the price a bit.. in my state (Penang), they sell games for like RM6.

Since I've moved to UK, I've stopped gaming. Good news? Yeah. Probably. Thinking of getting a Gamecube here, but er.. I'll just wait.

Author Topic: Interesting........... (Read 29318 times)

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