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Project forums => Team Avalanche => Topic started by: pyrozen on 2010-02-23 00:33:21

Title: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: pyrozen on 2010-02-23 00:33:21
Due to recent life events, i am finding it very hard to fit the WMRP into my schedule. Having just recently purchased a house, attending school fulltime, and working 40 hours a week i have almost no time left to work on this project. I apologize for leaving in a semi-finished state, but i just don't have the energy to continue this project. I learned alot about texture creation, and love the fact i made a lasting contribution to FF7.

Before i just run away though, i will leave you with my set of modding files. It includeds my layered PS and GiMP files, so someone can easily continue to pick up where i left off. I have also included my amended world.lgp file. I have removed any files in the LGP that i have already replaced, so it is a perfect road map for what it left to be worked on.
The PSP and GiMP files can still be altered at the layer level, meaning you can alter them to create new blends with the already created textures. These work prints, combined with the finished PNG files should be more than enough for someone to pick up without to much headache.

Sorry guys, but thanks for the experience and fun of working on this. I will still be active on these forums, but will be contributing significantly less. /if you need any other files i have, please let me know ASAP. They probably wont sit on my hard drive for too much longer.
Lee

http://www.mediafire.com/file/fmmmzz0ojow/PyROZen_work.zip
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Mako on 2010-02-23 00:58:32
Well that's sad news thanks pyrozen you made one of my all time favorite games even greater you are the man and your contributions shall be missed.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Timber on 2010-02-23 04:30:41
Nooooo this is so sad. I suppose I'll take a look at those files, but I don't think I have the design skills :(
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Soul on 2010-02-23 07:04:52
you can do it.. you can be pyrozen's successor..  ;D
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: pyrozen on 2010-02-23 19:17:50
Nooooo this is so sad. I suppose I'll take a look at those files, but I don't think I have the design skills :(

just a little encouragement, when i started this project i had almost skills. I had no idea how to create textures from scratch, much less use alpha maps, layer masks, and any other the other countless things i learned while working on this. At thispoint, anyone who is good at working with layers and alpha masks can use the textures i've created to fill in the blanks on the transistions i've missed. The only area that needs heavy work IMHO are the mountains.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Grimmy on 2010-02-23 19:49:03
I've taken up the call and have completed 6 0f the roughly 130 textures that are left. It won't take me long to finish the missing textures that have already been done by pyrozen. Excluding the beaches, gia's cliff area, and the forgotten city I should finish by next week.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: willis936 on 2010-02-23 23:03:15
Will this project include remodeling and retexturing cloud, highwind, tifa, and other models that are on the world map?
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Cloud1000 on 2010-02-23 23:22:27
I've taken up the call and have completed 6 0f the roughly 130 textures that are left. It won't take me long to finish the missing textures that have already been done by pyrozen. Excluding the beaches, gia's cliff area, and the forgotten city I should finish by next week.

Thats great news!
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Timu Sumisu on 2010-02-23 23:37:06
Will this project include remodeling and retexturing cloud, highwind, tifa, and other models that are on the world map?

Eventually, as far as i'm concerned. for those models similar to the field models, those'll get replaced when the field equivalents are done. there is a highwind in the works, but i don't have time for it right now.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: obesebear on 2010-02-24 02:08:26
Will this project include remodeling and retexturing cloud, highwind, tifa, and other models that are on the world map?

Eventually, as far as i'm concerned. for those models similar to the field models, those'll get replaced when the field equivalents are done. there is a highwind in the works, but i don't have time for it right now.

Why don't we use the textures from the FF7 International bonus disc...
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: sl1982 on 2010-02-24 03:41:47
Well the bonus disc is psx correct? So even if we did get them using some sort of texture dump they would be of fairly low quality compared to the standards we have now.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Timu Sumisu on 2010-02-24 13:35:10
Why don't we use the textures from the FF7 International bonus disc...

Because you need to make a uv map for the old models to wrap those textures on, so we might as well make new models that are easier to map :P
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Hellbringer616 on 2010-02-24 14:12:33
Pyro i'm sure on behalf of everyone here i'd like to say. Thank you, For all your work, effort, and time you've put in to enhancing this game to the state it is in now. It saddens me you are leaving, But i am happy you plan to stay on as an active member on the forums. You're guidance will be most appreciated here.

Maybe you will return. Maybe you won't. But thank you for all your hard work.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Grimmy on 2010-02-24 15:10:52
There is no need to make new models since most of the original models have been retextured already. They hold up against the WMRP and look great. Here is an example of my Tiny Bronco.

(http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv252/grimmy307/tinybroncopix.jpg?t=1267027604)

It comes down to a legal issue since the bonus disc textures were not included with FFVII PC. So you have to rip them to put them into the game, which breaks the no ripping rule.

Also unless that rule is altered in someway to make bonus disc textures okay here don't ask me for that model.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Tekkie.X on 2010-02-24 15:34:52
They are still technically from FFVII though.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: obesebear on 2010-02-24 17:06:43
There is no need to make new models since most of the original models have been retextured already. They hold up against the WMRP and look great. Here is an example of my Tiny Bronco.
...pic...

It comes down to a legal issue since the bonus disc textures were not included with FFVII PC. So you have to rip them to put them into the game, which breaks the no ripping rule.

Also unless that rule is altered in someway to make bonus disc textures okay here don't ask me for that model.
Since that disc was released by Square as part of FF7 in Japan, the legality of getting the textures is the same as ripping out the contents of the lgp's.  It's not from another game like Crisis Core or Dirge of Cerberus...   Check your PM
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: willis936 on 2010-02-24 19:02:40
I still think we should get Halkun to sign off so there's no middle ground.
I'd love to get my grubby hands on those delicious models though.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: romeo14 on 2010-02-24 20:59:01
First Pyro, it sucks that you that you cant work on it as much as you did before. thanks for everything youve done :)
and Grimmy, if that disc was released in Japan with the game, i have to agree with obesebear on that one. but like willis said Halkun is the boss so its his call
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Timu Sumisu on 2010-02-24 22:43:49
Feel free to take this up with Halkun guys, but keep it out of here please, this thread is Pyrozen's goodbye, and this forum is for making quality /original/ mods for ff7. Take it to game tweaking :P
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Jari on 2010-02-24 22:59:08
They are still technically from FFVII though.

Since that disc was released by Square as part of FF7 in Japan, the legality of getting the textures is the same as ripping out the contents of the lgp's.  It's not from another game like Crisis Core or Dirge of Cerberus...   Check your PM

O RLY?

Riddle me this, then; let's assume I own album XYZ by artist PQR. The catch is that the Japanese release of the same album had x bonus tracks. Which is quite common.

Am I within my rights to legally download the said bonus tracks, considering I already own the said album?

[ ] yes
[ ] no

Well? Hint: there's only one correct answer.

Same logic applies to movies with different versions released in the west; single disc regular versions, two or three disc extended versions with extra materials. With your logic, I'd be entitled to the said extra features, even if I chose to get the regular version.


I still think we should get Halkun to sign off so there's no middle ground.

You seem to assume that the powers that be do not share Halkun's views. You assume wrong.


timu sumisu: OH YOU! Posting while I type, you silly person! ;D Well, split the topic if you'd prefer. :)
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Mako on 2010-02-24 23:34:26
They are still technically from FFVII though.

Since that disc was released by Square as part of FF7 in Japan, the legality of getting the textures is the same as ripping out the contents of the lgp's.  It's not from another game like Crisis Core or Dirge of Cerberus...   Check your PM

O RLY?

Riddle me this, then; let's assume I own album XYZ by artist PQR. The catch is that the Japanese release of the same album had x bonus tracks. Which is quite common.

Am I within my rights to legally download the said bonus tracks, considering I already own the said album?

[ ] yes
[ ] no

Well? Hint: there's only one correct answer.

Same logic applies to movies with different versions released in the west; single disc regular versions, two or three disc extended versions with extra materials. With your logic, I'd be entitled to the said extra features, even if I chose to get the regular version.


I still think we should get Halkun to sign off so there's no middle ground.

You seem to assume that the powers that be do not share Halkun's views. You assume wrong.


timu sumisu: OH YOU! Posting while I type, you silly person! ;D Well, split the topic if you'd prefer. :)

EL AMMO WAIT! So you mean tell me that I don't own all right's to FF7 and there games WHAT?!? Listen I have a right to mod FF7,
Crisis Core,FF8,FF9,Xenogears, even Crash Bandacoot (don't ask)...now thats just silly talk.

I also have to add prozen was one of the very few people on these forums that made a sensible noob feel welcome.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Jari on 2010-02-25 00:01:39
I believe I said you are not in within your legal rights to distribute copyrighted material.

I also believe - I haven't checked what exactly is distributed with them, that's why I didn't say I know - that technically many of the released FF7 mods are technically illegal to distribute as well. And mods for many other games.

Feel free to prove me wrong.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Mako on 2010-02-25 00:31:00
I believe I said you are not in within your legal rights to distribute copyrighted material.

I also believe - I haven't checked what exactly is distributed with them, that's why I didn't say I know - that technically many of the released FF7 mods are technically illegal to distribute as well. And mods for many other games.

Feel free to prove me wrong.

LOL I was just joking (couldn't you tell). You cannot under ANY circumstance backwards engineer or modify copyrighted items AT ALL so yeah its illegal. 

EDIT sorry for this post being off topic. Oh and Ammo I think one of your pic's is broken.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: obesebear on 2010-02-25 02:23:16
I believe I said you are not in within your legal rights to distribute copyrighted material.

I also believe - I haven't checked what exactly is distributed with them, that's why I didn't say I know - that technically many of the released FF7 mods are technically illegal to distribute as well. And mods for many other games.

Feel free to prove me wrong.

Well, to continue off topic, you make a good point about not everyone owning the disc from which the textures would come from.  I didn't think of that.

So what then of all the Gmod models people use?  Models ripped from countless games, yet available for anyone to download and do with as they please.  I realize that is a different scenario entirely, but there have been no repercussions there that I'm aware of.  The point is, that taking models from the exact same FF7 game and applying it in-game should definitely not be breaking a rule here.   

If it is, there are some screens of the weapons from the bonus disc posted on this site that should be taken down POST HASTE!  We wouldn't want to be distributing information like that to people who don't own the disc... ;)
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: willis936 on 2010-02-25 02:26:42
I apologize for derailing this thread completely.

HAIL THE GREAT PYROZEN AND HIS SICK WORLD MAP WORK!  YE SHALL BE REMEMBER'D!
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: sl1982 on 2010-02-25 02:30:03
I am hoping this is not a goodbye, but a 'until we see you next.' Your work has been amazing and we all appreciate all the time you have spent with the project. FF7 has never looked better. I hope you do decide to stick around though. Even if you don't work on anything you are still a member of avalanche and we will need your opinions on things at least.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Timber on 2010-02-25 12:20:30
There is no need to make new models since most of the original models have been retextured already. They hold up against the WMRP and look great. Here is an example of my Tiny Bronco.

(http://i689.photobucket.com/albums/vv252/grimmy307/tinybroncopix.jpg?t=1267027604)

That tiny bronco looks really good grimmy :)
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: pyrozen on 2010-02-25 19:21:19
I am hoping this is not a goodbye, but a 'until we see you next.' Your work has been amazing and we all appreciate all the time you have spent with the project. FF7 has never looked better. I hope you do decide to stick around though. Even if you don't work on anything you are still a member of avalanche and we will need your opinions on things at least.

not a goodbye, but i amsort of stepping back into the shadows. I'd still be happy to look at anything if you need another set of eyes,and i will probably do asmall bit of image editing, though it will probably be limited to tweaking old textures, and maybe helping grimmy fit his new textures into the overall WMRP "feel". I will still be active, but not actively contributing as i had been before.

lee
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: Jari on 2010-02-26 05:36:17
LOL I was just joking (couldn't you tell). You cannot under ANY circumstance backwards engineer or modify copyrighted items AT ALL so yeah its illegal. 

EDIT sorry for this post being off topic. Oh and Ammo I think one of your pic's is broken.

Awww, sorry. :-P

Well, no, considering the context, I wasn't sure at all. :)

Really? Which one? I haven't touched them, but I suppose it's possible the host has messed up. Although a temporary connection error is probably even more likely.


So what then of all the Gmod models people use?  Models ripped from countless games, yet available for anyone to download and do with as they please.  I realize that is a different scenario entirely, but there have been no repercussions there that I'm aware of.  The point is, that taking models from the exact same FF7 game and applying it in-game should definitely not be breaking a rule here.   

They are counting on the copyright holder to turn a blind eye. Which usually works - but not always. With Gmod there's probably the additional factor that the way they are using the models is something the owner would never do, so there isn't even theoretical loss of income related with it.

Still, the blind eye-thingy does not hold up in court, or more importantly wouldn't be of much help if Square decided it wasn't going to do it anymore, and sent a cease and desist. The thing is that they could send a cease and desist to the forums, which is bad. Sure, you could go to a court over it, but most people are not made out of money or time.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: obesebear on 2010-02-26 06:01:50
I can understand the ripping and porting of models from Crisis Core.  And especially from games that aren't even from the FF7 universe.  But from the exact same game?  To me that's on the same level as the PRP or Team Avalanche updating the graphics.
It's not legal.  But it's also not illegal enough to warrant any attention.

Agree to disagree I guess.  I don't make the rules here.


Pyrozen, your work will be missed.  Hopefully Grimmy can fill those big shoes you've left.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: halkun on 2010-02-26 23:24:08
I'm going to weigh in on this...
If you look at the textures for the "bonus models" from the International edition, they are full of fail. We can do a lot better than that. (No I'm serious, look at them once) From a simple texture standpoint they can be a lot better, and modeling a machine is not *that* hard.
Title: Re: Stepping down from WMRP
Post by: sl1982 on 2010-02-27 00:46:05
I'm going to weigh in on this...
If you look at the textures for the "bonus models" from the International edition, they are full of fail. We can do a lot better than that. (No I'm serious, look at them once) From a simple texture standpoint they can be a lot better, and modeling a machine is not *that* hard.

Good opinion.

*Puts on his i'm right shirt*