Author Topic: which side of the fence are you on  (Read 14017 times)

xLostWingx

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #25 on: 2011-08-09 02:56:45 »
I know a guy who knows a guy who knows a guy who knows the president.  I also know a guy who knows a guy who was a friend of a brother of the CEO of a big Pharma Corp.  See how silly that sounds?  I have never once said that your intent wasn't to help people or that your methods wouldn't work.  I just expressed scepticism of the information you've provided.  I most certainly agree that living a healthy lifestyle and keeping a good diet etc. are good for you.  Hell, I would even agree that such a lifestyle probably reduces your likelihood of developing cancer.  But it definetely does not prevent cancer.  And you are not working on something that eliminates cancer from any person with any cancer.  The prescence of corruption is not the prescence of absolute corruption.  Once again, I agree there is corruption and sinister motives for many establishments.  It has been proven time and time again!  But you do not assume absolute corruption indicriminantly.  "Trust no one" may be a beneficial motto to live by for some, but that does not mean that there are not those worthy of your trust.  Do you think these people emerged from the womb as CEOs of Medical/Drug/etc. companies?  At some point, some of them also decided they would help people.  Mother nature may have her blueprints and her laws, but a blueprint is far different from the product is represents and laws only have power over that which they govern.  Many cancer survivors would argue that emotional support, family ties, and faith in God are responsible for their survival.  Many of these people were given a prognosis of death.  Certainly they aren't subject to the same set of laws that you speak of.

yarLson

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #26 on: 2011-08-09 21:09:26 »
Thats not even close to what I said. one my friend's dad has a bachelors in electrical engineering, bachelors in computer science and a masters in physics.he worked for the nsa for twenty years. Thats just one example. My mentor specialized it cancer treatment for 30 years. Never once has he administered surgery or chemo. Hes got something else that works. Ive seen it. I dont have time right now to break down all my connections as I am typing from a phone. But instead of mocking me why not look into it yourself and " prove me wrong if you can." As far as god family and faith, thats part of nature. There is no stepping outside of mother nature, no matter our attempts to distort her image. Proven fact, a sense of community boosts anabolic hormones which in turn help your body fight much better. Its all part of the same cycle. I am not demonizing pharms. Nor the world at large.
« Last Edit: 2011-08-09 21:17:46 by yarLson »

sl1982

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #27 on: 2011-08-09 22:33:43 »
I dont think that is the way it works yarLson. If you are trying to convince skeptics of something making them prove you wrong is not the way to go about it. You need to prove yourself right. Telling us that you have seen these treatments work is not proof either. As it stands I cannot make an honest opinion on the matter, i have no evidence either way. I did look at that link you posted but the site is not very well designed and I was not able to find what I was looking for.

At one time people believed the sun rotated about the earth. It took more then a few people just saying it was the other way around before belief changed.

xLostWingx

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #28 on: 2011-08-10 01:25:36 »
Well I hope you're right man.  Sorry for communicating so strongly, but if your cure for cancer does not do what you claim, it would do some serious psychological, and therefore physiological, damage to those fighting cancer once they heard these claims and it did not cure them.  <--- This is the only reason I asserted my skepticism so strongly.  If I saw your mentor on the news with his cure and took my mom to go try it out for $XXXXX.xx and it failed to work, we would be in a much weaker position to fight the cancer than we previously were.  I'm sure you can understand this, and I hold no hard feelings towards you personally.  I understand that you wish to help people, and that is admirable.  Good luck with your cure, I hope it becomes commercially available sooner than later (if it works as you say it does).

*I don't think we can escape the hold of Mother Nature, but I do think that we, as a species, have a fatally flawed understanding of such things.  Language itself is partially responsible for this - some of the things that you include in the category of mother nature, I include in the category of human existence, which I do not consider the same.  Thoughts, beliefs, and emotions exist because humans create them; mother nature just created the potential for them to exist.

I often disagree with your Philosophical position, but I think your projects are great and I share a deep interest in the types of topics you post about.  I'll try and keep it more objective next time a good discussion comes up, maybe you should too.
« Last Edit: 2011-08-10 02:01:50 by xLostWingx »

Template

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #29 on: 2011-08-10 05:31:05 »
Sorry to hear about your dad, Template.

Thanks so much, sincerely. I think that's what I was secretly hoping to get from posting that, anyway, just some empathy. Which is kinda selfish, I guess.

Not that you'd bother to find out for yourself, right? I'm sick of lazy people like you just eating from the hand that kills you. Be my guest, DON'T BELIEVE ME. Go ahead and choke on all those pharms for all I care. I have no regard for unscientific opinions boy.

have a nice day :]

p.s.
science = organized experimentation

not senselessly believing in popular opinion

good luck. you're gonna need it

But yah, we wont be zapping my dad with any sound waves so he's probably as good as dead. Anyway, pharmaceuticals aren't really an issue here because there aren't any being offered. Chemo-therapy isn't a good option because it tends to weaken the immune system. For a merkel-cell patient that generally just kills them faster. 
« Last Edit: 2011-08-10 08:26:33 by Template »

zoostation

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #30 on: 2011-08-10 07:16:00 »
Template, you totally have my sympathies and need not feel selfish for it. (I have to admit this thread got so long-winded that I missed your post the first time around -- since Opine is the only one who properly responded to it I assume I'm not alone). I'm pleased to hear that your dad's case is presenting hope for himself and future patients. I'd recently wondered the viability and effectiveness of transferring or replicating extraordinary T-cells -- sort of like an immune system transplant. Keep us (or me, at least) updated on both your dad's condition and the treatment's development.

Opine

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #31 on: 2011-08-10 17:41:40 »
Thanks so much, sincerely. I think that's what I was secretly hoping to get from posting that, anyway, just some empathy. Which is kinda selfish, I guess.

Not at all. It's hard to have someone close to you go through something, without knowing of a way to help them. I hope he is able to fight the "infection" off.

Template

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #32 on: 2011-08-12 01:03:02 »
So the plan is for infusion of replicated blood cells mid September... really good news. There has been some recent success in fighting Leukemia this way. They will follow this up with something called interferon, which I don't know much about. I guess it's supposed to help the immune-system recognize cancers as a threat. The team is also planning to use some sort of radiation following the infusions.

Also, I looked into it a little bit, and radio-frequency ablation is certainly not BS, it's just not for every situation. I think that was the Rife machines' technology? Similar anyway. This was specifically what I was referring to when I said something sounded like BS, just seems far-fetched, but it isn't. Honestly the website you pointed to made it look really hokey. Sorry :D

/cheers
« Last Edit: 2011-08-12 01:19:55 by Template »

willo182

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #33 on: 2011-08-12 17:42:37 »
Most pharmaceutical companies make their money by treating symptoms not the illness itself, no money in healthy people.

Template

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #34 on: 2011-08-14 04:47:25 »
Most pharmaceutical companies make their money by treating symptoms not the illness itself, no money in healthy people.

No money in letting people die when you could offer a treatment, either.

yarLson

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #35 on: 2011-09-02 22:26:14 »
for the record, sounds waves do not zap anything...
in any case. I give up for now. I'll come back this when I have my doctorate and am more thoroughly informed on the inner workings of the process

Opine

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #36 on: 2011-09-04 03:54:52 »
Isn't there some sort of rule about not trying to sell stuff on here?

pdub2520

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #37 on: 2011-09-04 05:26:19 »
Although I'm not good with arguments, personal experience is my point here. In many ways am I effected by the Pro's and Con's of pharmaceuticals.

Pro's being that personally, my mother has recently undergone surgeries and such to help her deteriorating body to at LEAST prolong the inevitable. The fact that it is working is good enough for me to be able to have that extra time with someone I love dearly. The fact that she can live this life with as little pain as possible through the medical achievements that she is able to benefit from makes it that much more worth while.

The Con's Being that I personally went through many years on different medications for ADHD. Ritalin, Adderall and such. Even Medications for Depression ( as they believe that goes hand in hand with ADHD, Which i personally believe ADHD to be a personality trait not an ailment.) Zoloft ( HA... one of the side effects is depression go figure...) Dexidrine and more.

My point being, We can't exactly say that pharmaceuticals are for health alone. Everyone's gotta make money somehow. Medications that are helpful, and medications that are created just for monetary gain are just a way to make money whether or not its purposeful.

All in all, Given the chance, I would support Pharmaceutical companies completely in all aspects. May be strange, but I believe in a portion of the work that comes out of there and that portion has actually been proven to work.

I'm not trying to argue for, nor am I arguing against. Just stating opinion and I'll leave it at that

xLostWingx

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #38 on: 2011-09-04 05:47:46 »
That sucks about your expereiences with ADHD medication as it is one of the more research-rich areas in psychotopic pharmacology.  The different types of medications are because certain companies will procure patents on certain chemical combinations.  Also, as new generations of "cleaner" medications are developed, they may have had you try them out in an effort to reduce the number of side effects you were experiencing.  While as many as 1 in 4 individuals with ADHD have comorbid depression, they may have been prescribing anti-depressants because many anti-depressants have similar effects to stimulants likes Ritalin and Adderall, but require fewer maintanence doses and once the serum levels plateau in your system offer a more consistent pattern of symptom reduction.  Or it could be that you had a PCP prescribing your Psychotropic medication instead of a Psychiatrist which, unfortunately, occurs ~85% of the time. 

I know that was a bit unneccessary, but I saw an opportunity to use some info from a recent grad course so I took it. 

yarLson

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #39 on: 2011-09-05 18:33:47 »
I'm not selling anything either. In fact I went out of my way to keep my companies name a secret. I dunno about you, but if somebody I loved was in trouble I would at least be willing to look into any possible treatment available from a scientifically objective viewpoint.  Rather than just making uneducated remarks and tasteless jokes and just assuming that I am wrong.  But hey, to each his own.  I'll say one more time.  I don't care if you believe me.  This information was intended for anybody with a little bit of courage to step outside the box of what is traditionally accepted.  If you don't have any faith in the miraculous capabilities of the planet that miraculously gave birth to our entire reality... then honestly I can't argue with you and you win. At least in your own little way.  Hopefully personal satisfaction is worth forsaking something that might be of value to you.
« Last Edit: 2011-09-05 18:41:58 by yarLson »

yarLson

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #40 on: 2011-09-25 18:58:32 »

Template

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #41 on: 2012-11-24 09:04:15 »
was looking back to see when i originally got into this conversation, which my only attempt at support from the internet about the subject (which obviously shows i wasn't really looking for it on the web, but that I have some genuine respect for the level of minds and compassion found on this forum)

because my dad finally lost his battle with Merkel-Cell Carcinoma a few hours ago.

hurts when you lose a friend.

sl1982

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Re: which side of the fence are you on
« Reply #42 on: 2012-12-08 18:08:21 »
I am very sorry to hear about your loss. I hope that his life was rich and fulfilling.