Author Topic: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods and Modding Framework-The Reunion [R06f]  (Read 2115892 times)

WatashiWaZero

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3125 on: 2016-10-07 21:57:44 »
Gonna be a long post...

So I finished the game today (finally), and I must simply say... bravo. *slow clap*

First off, the current issues:
==================
http://imgur.com/a/EsxJ5

The adjectives used to describe the key, after the first one, are capitalized.  Not sure if this is intentional or not, but they shouldn't be.

Is the bottom message in the controls dialogue box for the Steam FF7 removable?

You can only buy 6 stalls.  The fenced area comes free of cost.  The message needs to be revised to state that the stalls specifically cost 10k gil each while the fenced area can hold 4 for free.

I didn't take a screenshot of this, but only the Cloud model is corrupted in the chocobo mini-game.  Cid is fine.  Didn't check Tifa's model (lazy...).

Even after the date scene, there was still an action that affected Tifa's affection.  If you could double check this.

At the City of the Ancients, when Bugen goes to put the key in, his signature phrase, "Ho, ho, ho", has every iteration of the word capitalized...

The two bottom menu boxes in battle has a 1-2 pixel gap.

Just noting this, but the item menu has 24 extra slots, and the key item menu has 16 extra slots.  This is after considering being able to hold/contain every single entry in both menus.  Don't see the need for the extra slots (manual sorting should be removed from the game...).  I understand the space for materia since you can gain them indefinitely.

When trying to discard materia, you cannot quick nav with L1/R1 like all other menus.  This is a pain because the list can be very lengthy.

Cait Sith limit break reel sound persist even after you cancel out of it.

Not sure if you can do this, but some materia can use descriptions as they are not exactly intuitive (i.e. Swap, Aqualung).  A brand new player may ask what is being swapped, and they may confuse the enemy skill version of Aqualung vs. the actual materia.

When party splits up in the Northern Crater, there's no warning that the current party member's equipment was removed.  There should be a warning dialogue so players can know that it happened.

On map las2_4, when you grab the yellow materia at the top, it says obtained 'Multistrike' instead of 'Double Magic'.

Mentioned this before as well, but the interaction between the newer models and certain objects are weird/funky at times.
==================

Now for what I think can/could be improved in future revisions:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mini-games can and should be more enjoyable.  Not saying you should make it significantly easier, but the margin of error should be greater than what it currently is.  So say for the marching mini-game, 45-50 first prize, 40-45 second, 35-40 third.  This is considering how fast you can gain/lose points.  Top prizes shouldn't require a top 1% performance to be obtained.  I had some really hard tests back in school, but regardless of how hard it was, 90%+ was still considered in the 'A' range.

Models can be more refined much further.  Lots of clipping and lots of silly, out of context details like Cloud laying on his bed with his gigantic Buster Sword.  Some models also act really funky at times.  Obviously this belongs in Kal's thread, but you can relay the message. ;D

Not sure how this can be worked around, but Reeve's accent was played upon heavily.  Without voice acting, his dialogue was a bit difficult to understand immediately at times.  It required several rereads to become comprehensible (for me anyway).

I think you talked about this before, but perhaps one day you'd consider adding in the redone backgrounds into Reunion as well.  It'll be a nice addition to everything else that has been touched up.

Currently, gil almost has no value.  Resting at inns should cost a percentage of your total.  I was thinking at least 50% of your total.  This also adds value to the villa you can buy.  You should also increase the price for the villa to something much higher.  You should also remove a lot of the instances where the party gets a free restore to their HP/MP.  But all this should be under the Weapon mod I suppose.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Reunion has been a spectacular and warming experience for me.  I already told you this, but Reunion is no longer just a mod, it should be required if someone is a true fan of FF7.  Therefore, Reunion should be treated like so.  You've pretty much touched every aspect of the game, so I'm not sure why you'd want to separate things from Reunion.  Everything is and will be under the Reunion umbrella anyway. ;D

Like I mentioned earlier, I'll probably return when Reunion has been even further refined, but I'm done with FF7 for now.  I don't really want to burn myself out by playing the game too extensively.
« Last Edit: 2016-10-07 23:17:38 by WatashiWaZero »

White Wind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3126 on: 2016-10-07 22:08:56 »
When trying to discard materia, you cannot quick nav with L1/R1 like all other menus.  This is a pain because the list can be very lengthy.

That was on my 'to-mention' list. I was even thinking it could be a bug/an oversight in fact.

Covarr

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3127 on: 2016-10-07 22:16:29 »
I have answers for a few of these things.

The adjectives used to describe the key, after the first one, are capitalized.  Not sure if this is intentional or not, but they shouldn't be.
Item names are always capitalized, including... *ahem* key items.

I'm sorry, I couldn't help it.

Don't see the need for the extra slots.
All sorts of reasons. Some people might like to use empty slots as spacers for sorting (keep in mind you CAN sort manually), whereas others might want to use them as swap space WHILE they organize.

On map las2_4, when you grab the yellow materia at the top, it says obtained 'Multistrike' instead of 'Double Magic'.
I sure could go for a "Last Elixir" right about now.

WatashiWaZero

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3128 on: 2016-10-07 22:24:56 »
Quote from: Covarr
Item names are always capitalized, including... *ahem* key items.

Had to reply, but technically the key isn't an item, much less a key item.  Doesn't exist within the game.  Could be argued that it's just a notification. ;D

Quote from: Covarr
All sorts of reasons. Some people might like to use empty slots as spacers for sorting (keep in mind you CAN sort manually), whereas others might want to use them as swap space WHILE they organize.

If anyone manually sorts their item list, they should burn in hell....  :x
« Last Edit: 2016-10-07 22:37:18 by WatashiWaZero »

obesebear

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3129 on: 2016-10-08 05:44:32 »
If anyone manually sorts their item list, they should burn in hell....  :x
Lol.  You're not wrong

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3130 on: 2016-10-08 17:51:17 »
Quote
http://imgur.com/a/EsxJ5

The adjectives used to describe the key, after the first one, are capitalized.  Not sure if this is intentional or not, but they shouldn't be.

It's still a joke item - so is still capitalized.

Quote
Is the bottom message in the controls dialogue box for the Steam FF7 removable?

Probably not without messing with their version of Aali's Custom Driver. I'll have a look.

Quote
You can only buy 6 stalls.  The fenced area comes free of cost.  The message needs to be revised to state that the stalls specifically cost 10k gil each while the fenced area can hold 4 for free.

Not sure how I missed this. Corrected.

Quote
I didn't take a screenshot of this, but only the Cloud model is corrupted in the chocobo mini-game.  Cid is fine.  Didn't check Tifa's model (lazy...).

I think Kal corrected this ages ago - but perhaps I made a mistake - or maybe Steam is to blame again. I'll check :)

Quote
Even after the date scene, there was still an action that affected Tifa's affection.  If you could double check this.
It can be ignored.  Not really important as no-one will know. White Wind will probably want to add it to the Bug thread though.
Quote
At the City of the Ancients, when Bugen goes to put the key in, his signature phrase, "Ho, ho, ho", has every iteration of the word capitalized...

Corrected.

Quote
The two bottom menu boxes in battle has a 1-2 pixel gap.

If you mean a gap side to side, this is deliberate.  It looks better.  Will need a picture.

Quote
Just noting this, but the item menu has 24 extra slots, and the key item menu has 16 extra slots.  This is after considering being able to hold/contain every single entry in both menus.  Don't see the need for the extra slots (manual sorting should be removed from the game...).  I understand the space for materia since you can gain them indefinitely.

This would be too much messing about to fix, I think.  I remember looking at this before. It can be ignored - It's not really intrusive or a problem.

Quote
When trying to discard materia, you cannot quick nav with L1/R1 like all other menus.  This is a pain because the list can be very lengthy.

This is a limitation with the original game. I am not sure how difficult it would be to fix this, but I can have a look and see how the normal cursor operates here.

Quote
Cait Sith limit break reel sound persist even after you cancel out of it.

I saw this too. I don't know what causes it and assumed it's an error that Aali would have to fix.  I don't know if it does it without Aali's driver, so if someone can check?

Quote
Not sure if you can do this, but some materia can use descriptions as they are not exactly intuitive (i.e. Swap, Aqualung).  A brand new player may ask what is being swapped, and they may confuse the enemy skill version of Aqualung vs. the actual materia.

The Enemy Skill Aqualung no longer exists - it's called Aqua Breath. As you say, this may cause slight confusion for a player who has played the original, but no more so than 100 other changes will. The materia also comes with a description bar.

Quote
When party splits up in the Northern Crater, there's no warning that the current party member's equipment was removed.  There should be a warning dialogue so players can know that it happened.

I'll look into it.

Quote
On map las2_4, when you grab the yellow materia at the top, it says obtained 'Multistrike' instead of 'Double Magic'.

:P I accidentally left in the Weapon mod version of the text.

Quote
Mentioned this before as well, but the interaction between the newer models and certain objects are weird/funky at times.

Yeah, gonna be hundreds of those issues and they're likely going to remain there due to effort v time v people working to fix the issues.

==================


Quote
Mini-games can and should be more enjoyable.  Not saying you should make it significantly easier, but the margin of error should be greater than what it currently is.  So say for the marching mini-game, 45-50 first prize, 40-45 second, 35-40 third.  This is considering how fast you can gain/lose points.  Top prizes shouldn't require a top 1% performance to be obtained.  I had some really hard tests back in school, but regardless of how hard it was, 90%+ was still considered in the 'A' range.

The only minigame I have altered in the normal game is the marching one - and that one is staying as-is. In the Weapon mod, the difficulty will be as difficult as that across the board for the highest achievements. Some areas in Weapon are actually easier (the speed round) - but nearly all will be much harder.

Quote
Models can be more refined much further.  Lots of clipping and lots of silly, out of context details like Cloud laying on his bed with his gigantic Buster Sword.  Some models also act really funky at times.  Obviously this belongs in Kal's thread, but you can relay the message. ;D

The sword issue has been fixed - and those kinds of things are relatively easy to fix.  But as I said above too, a lot of issues will remain and there's no way I'll be here in 2020 still doing this :P I am finalizing stuff very soon - and then moving on to Weapon and Soldier quest.  Kal or someone else will have to deal with models from that point on.

Quote
Not sure how this can be worked around, but Reeve's accent was played upon heavily.  Without voice acting, his dialogue was a bit difficult to understand immediately at times.  It required several rereads to become comprehensible (for me anyway).

Nothing can be done about it, really.  In fact, that Scot dialect is toned down from what full Scot looks like.

Quote
I think you talked about this before, but perhaps one day you'd consider adding in the redone backgrounds into Reunion as well.  It'll be a nice addition to everything else that has been touched up.

If you mean the totally updated backgrounds, I wouldn't add them because they don't fit in with the original game style. They'd need many other things to look correct, like totally new models. If you mean upscaled backgrounds, tbh I think they all look terrible in one way or another.  I did see one recently that looked pretty decent - can't remember where - but the rest look plastic and have introduced more problems than fixes.

Quote
Currently, gil almost has no value.  Resting at inns should cost a percentage of your total.  I was thinking at least 50% of your total.  This also adds value to the villa you can buy.  You should also increase the price for the villa to something much higher.  You should also remove a lot of the instances where the party gets a free restore to their HP/MP.  But all this should be under the Weapon mod I suppose.

Yup - that's a Weapon mod thing and is being worked on. I certainly couldn't make that kind of change mandatory.

Quote
Reunion has been a spectacular and warming experience for me.  I already told you this, but Reunion is no longer just a mod, it should be required if someone is a true fan of FF7.  Therefore, Reunion should be treated like so.  You've pretty much touched every aspect of the game, so I'm not sure why you'd want to separate things from Reunion.  Everything is and will be under the Reunion umbrella anyway. ;D

Thanks :)  Some things should be separate because people have preferences. Some people will not want upgraded models for example. In fact, I'm on the fence with whether to use them personally, as there is a style and charm to the original blocky characters.
« Last Edit: 2016-10-08 19:59:11 by DLPB »

DLPB_

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3131 on: 2016-10-08 17:56:55 »
You probably already know this, but Sega Chief made a Mouth Replacer mod that simply swaps open mouths with mouths for the main cast. It looks great, I never play without it.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/dn4ujcbgglxuzj4/FF7+-+Mouth+Replacer.exe

I did not.  Thanks a lot. If I get permission, I will add the mod to The Reunion.

Ansem

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3132 on: 2016-10-08 18:04:38 »
Tifa's affection value is still relevant because it is used one last time to determine which dialogue you get in the hill scene at the end of Disc 2.

Jotaro

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3133 on: 2016-10-08 18:11:02 »
Yeah, if her value is 50 or above then that scene has different dialogue and a more humorous aftermath in the Highwind. The chance to raise her affection is most likely there as a last-minute chance to get that version if you didn't raise it that high to get her date scene.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3134 on: 2016-10-08 18:16:23 »
Ah ;)  of course.  But it could still be an error then.
« Last Edit: 2016-10-08 18:17:56 by DLPB »

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3135 on: 2016-10-08 23:48:46 »
I have also added WatashiWaZero to the credits, since he did a full walk through test :)

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3136 on: 2016-10-09 01:27:17 »
Quote
Is the bottom message in the controls dialogue box for the Steam FF7 removable?

This has now been fixed to "PRESS CTRL & F4 TO EXIT THE GAME."

The string is a Wide String and found in strings.dat

Galm

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3137 on: 2016-10-09 13:07:04 »
Just finished with no other major probs.

No completionist stuff, but did breed a Gold Chocobo, got Omnislash and all the minor optional Char events. No problems with Battle square, since you said you were expecting trouble there.

The game did just close after the 500 years later FMV, without showing the star field outro I remember from the PS1 game. But not sure if this is perhaps inherent to the PC version.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3138 on: 2016-10-09 13:09:58 »
Yeah I changed a load of jumps and stuff there... cleaned up code.  So surprised there isn't at least something wrong :P Must have done a good job.

Covarr

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3139 on: 2016-10-10 15:25:28 »
If anyone manually sorts their item list, they should burn in hell....  :x
Lol.  You're not wrong
Disagreed. There is a very strong use case for this. If ATB is set to "Active," it's better to sort items by frequency of use/likelihood to need quick access, so as not to waste time getting to what you need. I could easily see putting Hi-Potions, Elixirs, and Phoenix Downs near the top later in the game, while leaving Potions near the bottom as they're hardly useful anymore. Neither an alphabetical nor type-based sort method will be able to accomplish this. Further, having manual spacing allows for quick glimpsing where you are in the menu without having to actually read item names, very handy for quickly paging through items when you need something that you use less frequently.

Not that I generally need this, since I usually play on "Recommended" or "Wait", but there is DEFINITELY a good reason for manual sort in the game, and the extra spaces can only help with that.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3140 on: 2016-10-10 15:34:28 »
I also use manual sort. When you need to feed a Chocobo you need the greens to be at the top, if you don't feed them quickly they simply scape.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3141 on: 2016-10-14 10:13:27 »
Isn't that how it was in the original, though?  What if you made it an optional thing that you could check or uncheck in the installer?

Nope. PSX versions have a mouth.  I've added Sega Chief's fix :)

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3142 on: 2016-10-15 03:20:05 »
Nope. PSX versions have a mouth.  I've added Sega Chief's fix :)

There are no mouths in the PSX version. To confirm, you can boot up the game and have Cloud run towards the camera after he jumps off the train. It's also clear to see that Sephiroth and Hojo don't have gapping holes for mouths.

Glad to hear you used Sega Chief's fix.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3143 on: 2016-10-15 09:04:35 »
I checked psx version on a walkthrough online and he does have a mouth. A closed mouth- basically a line.

JBedford128

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Ansem

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3145 on: 2016-10-15 12:39:37 »
According to Makou, only the main characters have a mouth on PSX. Still, it's true that in-game, I remember clearly commenting on the lack of mouths even on Cloud, and not nearly just once.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3146 on: 2016-10-15 17:31:34 »
That's not how I remember it.

The mouthes are disabled by the engine but they are present on the models. If I remember it right there are a few scene where the mouth is drawn on the face (the scene at the end with Tifa and Cloud).

Green_goblin

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3147 on: 2016-10-15 17:33:34 »
Search in Google Images "cloud final fantasy", some of them have mouth and some don't.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3148 on: 2016-10-15 17:45:50 »
Search in Google Images "cloud final fantasy", some of them have mouth and some don't.

Yeah that scene above doesn't have it - but as he's walking about he does. At least in the walkthrough I saw.  I think it's safe to say that a mouth was intended but accidentally left out in places and on certain models. They also buggered up the blinking a lot too.  Some models only blink with one eye and so on.

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods - The Reunion (R05b)
« Reply #3149 on: 2016-10-16 07:15:20 »
Yeah that scene above doesn't have it - but as he's walking about he does. At least in the walkthrough I saw.  I think it's safe to say that a mouth was intended but accidentally left out in places and on certain models. They also buggered up the blinking a lot too.  Some models only blink with one eye and so on.

Cloud doesn't have a mouth walking about in the PSX version. Here's a screenshot from me:
http://imgur.com/DU3KnQM

Here's another example I found online:
https://html5img1.s3.amazonaws.com/f_7j_ScreenShotFF7.jpg

And you can also check by running Cloud towards the camera in the Junon Harbor.

The only special scene I can think of when a character is given a mouth is Tifa outside of the Highwind at the end of Disc 2.
« Last Edit: 2016-10-16 07:21:49 by cold_spirit »