Author Topic: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)  (Read 2017684 times)

PokeFaize

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8775 on: 2019-12-01 21:12:22 »
I had tried slapping a ton of Counter Materias on Cloud with a x4 Cut and Barrier Materia, and the Life(/Force?) Stealer, and Zack still beat Cloud into dust. I dunno if I'll bother with beating Zack with how excessively powerful he is for a 1v1, and Cloud is, more often than not, dead weight when I'm forced to use him, compared to just about any other character. (Pretty pretty please consider letting us throw Cloud in the trash upon leaving Midgar in the final version of NT)

With everything (but the Zack Flashback) completed, I finally took on Sephiroth. Oddly enough, Pinnacle Sephiroth only wanted me to put together one team instead of 3. Very nice fight, keeping me on my toes the whole time. Keter Sephiroth is honestly laughable, much like Safer Sephiroth. A crippling weakness to Holy and low defense (Cid and Red were almost always hitting for 9999 with x4 Cut, and Long Range on Cid and Red proved useful here), and he was down pretty quickly. Cloud being the forced dead weight he always is in my run just slowed down the fight. Had I been able to use Aerith instead of Cloud, Aerith W-Casting Quad-Holy would've obliterated Kater Sephiroth even faster (yes, I could've done this with Cloud, but Cloud can't heal the gang's MP to full with a Slash All on the party)

jdhayward

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8776 on: 2019-12-02 07:45:19 »
Hey all,

Having a great time with this mod. It's exactly what I needed after 22 years of playing the same game.

Is there any way to re spec characters if you change your mind?

Thanks

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8777 on: 2019-12-02 08:26:51 »
Hey all,

Having a great time with this mod. It's exactly what I needed after 22 years of playing the same game.

Is there any way to re spec characters if you change your mind?

Thanks

Not currently; it can be done manually using a save editor by setting the Source values to 0 and then adding them back on. Each rank gives +5 to all stats, then you add on your rank choice to it. There's a set of new opcodes for field scripting that I'm going to implement with the final build that allows respecs in-game and which removes the need for sources in the first place.

jdhayward

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8778 on: 2019-12-02 10:36:31 »
Not currently; it can be done manually using a save editor by setting the Source values to 0 and then adding them back on. Each rank gives +5 to all stats, then you add on your rank choice to it. There's a set of new opcodes for field scripting that I'm going to implement with the final build that allows respecs in-game and which removes the need for sources in the first place.

Ok thanks for that. It's no big deal I just wondered.

Having a really good time with this so far. The touch up of the script in particular is really well done. You've managed to make ambiguous or weird sounding lines/plot points seem much clearer without sacrificing the feel of the original script. Great work.

Do you have an ETA on your final build?

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8779 on: 2019-12-02 10:56:50 »
Ok thanks for that. It's no big deal I just wondered.

Having a really good time with this so far. The touch up of the script in particular is really well done. You've managed to make ambiguous or weird sounding lines/plot points seem much clearer without sacrificing the feel of the original script. Great work.

Do you have an ETA on your final build?

Nothing concrete, but I want to get it released at least a month before the remake comes out.

jdhayward

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8780 on: 2019-12-02 23:08:42 »
Another question.

What are the requirements for learning limits for each character?

Would be handy to know the numbers.

Thanks

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8781 on: 2019-12-02 23:30:56 »
Another question.

What are the requirements for learning limits for each character?

Would be handy to know the numbers.

Thanks

The kills are total, so for Cloud to learn 3-1 he needs 180 kills total and not 90 kills for 2-1 followed by 180 kills.

Spoiler: show
Cloud
1-2: 8 uses
2-1: 90 kills
2-2: 7 uses
3-1: 180 kills
3-2: 6 uses

Barret
1-2: 9 uses
2-1: 60 kills
2-2: 8 uses
3-1: 110 kills
3-2: 6 uses

Tifa
1-2: 9 uses
2-1: 60 kills
2-2: 7 uses
3-1: 110 kills
3-2: 6 uses

Aeris
1-2: 8 uses
2-1: 50 kills
2-2: 6 uses
3-1: 100 kills
3-2: 5 uses

Red XIII
1-2: 8 uses
2-1: 50 kills
2-2: 7 uses
3-1: 100 kills
3-2: 6 uses

Yuffie
1-2: 8 uses
2-1: 50 kills
2-2: 7 uses
3-1: 100 kills
3-2: 6 uses

Cait Sith
1-2: 4 uses (Transform)
2-1: 30 kills

Vincent
2-1: 6 kills
3-1: 12 kills

Cid
1-2: 7 uses
2-1: 30 kills
2-2: 6 uses
3-1: 60 kills
3-2: 5 uses

jdhayward

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8782 on: 2019-12-03 22:24:36 »
Thanks for the info!

And am I being stupid or is there a hidden character to unlock? The SP status menu seems to suggest that there is.

Apologies as I'm probably asking for a massive spoiler.

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8783 on: 2019-12-03 22:45:39 »
Thanks for the info!

And am I being stupid or is there a hidden character to unlock? The SP status menu seems to suggest that there is.

Apologies as I'm probably asking for a massive spoiler.

I'm afraid not, that was me being stupid and copy-pasting debug text/script over to a hundred or whatever it is fields that have Save Points in them and not thinking ahead to what a huge pain it would be to remove it from every single one.

tjlg1377

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8784 on: 2019-12-05 17:58:06 »
Hey Sega Chief,

Playing through New Threat in Arrange Mode. Excellent job. Really enjoying it. Thanks so much for the hard work you've put in.

New to Qhimm so I hope this post isn't breaking any protocols but encountered a soft lock in my play through and was wondering if you could help me out.

So again, I'm playing in Arrange Mode. Leaving Shinra HQ with Aeris, Barret and Red XIII. When starting the battle with ?Thousand Gunner? in the elevator, the battle screen loads with Thousand Gunner and his two chopper gunner supports on either side. Thousand Gunner shoots the elevator glass. The camera re-adjusts to the standard battle view and the two chopper gunner support enemies then kind of re-enter the battle frame by flying down from above. At that point the soft lock occurs. All battle gauges are frozen and no amount of time or button mashing seems to rectify the issue.

I've tried using both elevators (left and right), shuffling character order and materia and still can't seem to get it to budge. I am playing through 7th heaven via a steam Final Fantasy 7.exe with the following mods in the following load order:

Dynamic Cloud Weapons
Battle Models - Weapons
Field Models - Objects
Animations
Battle Models Characters
Battle Models Enemies
Field Models Main Characters
Field Models Non Player Characters
New Threat
Gameplay Tweaks and Cheats (Only using Always Run and Save/PHS anywhere)
Menu Avatars and Backdrops
Minigames Collection
Spell Textures
Word Models Vehicles

Any help you could offer would be greatly appreciated!
« Last Edit: 2019-12-05 18:06:10 by tjlg1377 »

PokeFaize

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8785 on: 2019-12-05 19:02:36 »
Something I wanna note real quick is that early to mid game, Mage Character builds are very starved of Materia slots if they stick to Magic+ weapons and armor, while physical and tank builds are drowning in Materia slots with no real purpose for most of them, aside from throwing in Command and Summon Materia to improve their Strength, Vitality, and Dexterity.

Also the Elemental and Added Effect materia have pretty harsh penalties, especially for early game where people will be the most experimental with their builds.

I also find it odd that Magic Materia would lower your Spirit Stat instead of Strength when, typically, Mages are notorious for having high Magic Defense. Even at endgame, Spirit in general is super easy to end up dropping to 0, while getting Strength anywhere close to or even below the character's innate Strength value is more difficult than trying to take on Zack.

Would you consider tweaking these problems for the final version?

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8786 on: 2019-12-05 22:01:19 »
Hey Sega Chief,

Playing through New Threat in Arrange Mode. Excellent job. Really enjoying it. Thanks so much for the hard work you've put in.

New to Qhimm so I hope this post isn't breaking any protocols but encountered a soft lock in my play through and was wondering if you could help me out.

So again, I'm playing in Arrange Mode. Leaving Shinra HQ with Aeris, Barret and Red XIII. When starting the battle with ?Thousand Gunner? in the elevator, the battle screen loads with Thousand Gunner and his two chopper gunner supports on either side. Thousand Gunner shoots the elevator glass. The camera re-adjusts to the standard battle view and the two chopper gunner support enemies then kind of re-enter the battle frame by flying down from above. At that point the soft lock occurs. All battle gauges are frozen and no amount of time or button mashing seems to rectify the issue.

I've tried using both elevators (left and right), shuffling character order and materia and still can't seem to get it to budge. I am playing through 7th heaven via a steam Final Fantasy 7.exe with the following mods in the following load order:

Dynamic Cloud Weapons
Battle Models - Weapons
Field Models - Objects
Animations
Battle Models Characters
Battle Models Enemies
Field Models Main Characters
Field Models Non Player Characters
New Threat
Gameplay Tweaks and Cheats (Only using Always Run and Save/PHS anywhere)
Menu Avatars and Backdrops
Minigames Collection
Spell Textures
Word Models Vehicles

Any help you could offer would be greatly appreciated!

Have you ever had 60fps mod installed or in use at any point? It seems to leave alterations behind when uninstalled as there was a user recently with the same issue; the Gunners battle would specifically freeze at that point (it's probably something to do with frame interpolation).


Something I wanna note real quick is that early to mid game, Mage Character builds are very starved of Materia slots if they stick to Magic+ weapons and armor, while physical and tank builds are drowning in Materia slots with no real purpose for most of them, aside from throwing in Command and Summon Materia to improve their Strength, Vitality, and Dexterity.

Also the Elemental and Added Effect materia have pretty harsh penalties, especially for early game where people will be the most experimental with their builds.

I also find it odd that Magic Materia would lower your Spirit Stat instead of Strength when, typically, Mages are notorious for having high Magic Defense. Even at endgame, Spirit in general is super easy to end up dropping to 0, while getting Strength anywhere close to or even below the character's innate Strength value is more difficult than trying to take on Zack.

Would you consider tweaking these problems for the final version?

I went more with defensive penalties over offence penalties because when you load up on Magic materia it can badly affect characters built for strength. Spells like Revive and buff/status magic are a good fit for strength-builds/tanks so they can take some of the MP/slots burden from the casters, but strength penalties make that less attractive. There's also hybrid builds that can use both, say spell + added cut, that benefit from not having strength penalties to deal with.

As for the slots, I knew that casters would want for them so I had the other type of gear have slightly better slots to make it less of an easy decision; the magic buff comes at a cost of less versatility in their slots in most cases. Strength-based characters can use their extra slots for utility Materia, like Sense or Barrier+All for instance.

Elemental and Added Effect offer a really good defensive buff if used properly against special attacks, so the defence loss helps account for it. I think it's the way to go with it, but I'm thinking of tweaking the elemental damage reduction itself in the final, which means I'll be adjusting the penalties on the Materia accordingly. I might make the Added Effect one different from the Elemental one.

PokeFaize

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8787 on: 2019-12-06 06:18:56 »
Quote
I went more with defensive penalties over offence penalties because when you load up on Magic materia it can badly affect characters built for strength. Spells like Revive and buff/status magic are a good fit for strength-builds/tanks so they can take some of the MP/slots burden from the casters, but strength penalties make that less attractive. There's also hybrid builds that can use both, say spell + added cut, that benefit from not having strength penalties to deal with.
I personally found the Enemy Skill Materia to be the best option for Hybrids since it gave a ton of options for a mere single Materia Slot, and didn't ruin their defenses. Though I do see your point for them. As for Strength/Tank builds, I find the Status Effect Materia and Summon Materia work perfectly fine for Elemental Materia pairing and providing solid buffs to their important stats.

Quote
As for the slots, I knew that casters would want for them so I had the other type of gear have slightly better slots to make it less of an easy decision; the magic buff comes at a cost of less versatility in their slots in most cases. Strength-based characters can use their extra slots for utility Materia, like Sense or Barrier+All for instance.
early to mid game, there's not a whole lot of Materia that physical characters really want, so a Physical Aerith can easily do an Elemental=Status/Summon Materia, Added Effect=Status Materia, and Time/Barrier=All and have plenty of room to spare, while a Magical Cloud with the Mythril Saber and Silver Armlet has just enough for Recover=All, 3-4 Attack Spells, and 1-2 Command Materia depending on how many Magic Materia you give him.

Quote
Elemental and Added Effect offer a really good defensive buff if used properly against special attacks, so the defence loss helps account for it. I think it's the way to go with it, but I'm thinking of tweaking the elemental damage reduction itself in the final, which means I'll be adjusting the penalties on the Materia accordingly. I might make the Added Effect one different from the Elemental one.
At endgame, you're better off using Shield, so using Elemental defensively is kinda moot. Not to mention using Elemental defensively is fairly tricky outside of boss battles, since there's rarely, if any, locations where monsters primarily use one element.
Meanwhile Added Effect has strong usage both offensively and defensively with Contain and Hades being a thing. Though both of those are fairly late game, so Added Effect isn't very useful defensively until then. Lagomorph and Seal Materia keep it useful offensively, though.

Torus

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8788 on: 2019-12-06 16:04:18 »
Are there any plans to update the documentation for the mod? I've had a big headache today because I was trying to learn the now non-existent Magnitude8 from the Gaea Dragon as per the documentation... Only to realize it was changed to Time Flare after googling it... Only to realize an hour later it was, yet again, changed to Dragon Force and not even available from Gaea Dragon as it was immune to Manipulation. Not fun times. :p
« Last Edit: 2019-12-06 16:19:08 by Torus »

tjlg1377

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8789 on: 2019-12-06 16:47:51 »
Have you ever had 60fps mod installed or in use at any point? It seems to leave alterations behind when uninstalled as there was a user recently with the same issue; the Gunners battle would specifically freeze at that point (it's probably something to do with frame interpolation)

Hey; thanks for getting back to me.

I have not. I do however configure the animations mod with Faster battle animations, enemy deaths and summons.

I removed all mods besides New Threat and was able to progress through the battle. Switched all the mods I listed back on for the bike chase and have encountered no problems since.

OhGodAnOwl

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8790 on: 2019-12-07 21:06:02 »
Hey! New to this forum, made an account just to post here;

Great mod! Definitely spruces up the game and gives it enough freshness to last a while :D
Downloaded it and started my first play-trough, currently I am before Gongaga but after the Desert Prison, sitting in the battle square and trying to get myself some of those sweet accessories.. but there is a problem that I ran into, The game either bugged out and keeps giving me slots that are impossible to win or the mod is trying to prevent me from getting too powerful too early.

To elaborate a bit more, each time I enter the Arena, the first series of slots will all be the "Break Magic Materia", next one will all be "Break Accessory" after which will come all "Disable Items", then all "Poison", then all "Minimize" etc.
My question is, is this mean to be some sort of a block to stop people from abusing Reflect Ring&Cursed Ring too early? Is this A bug?
My game is the Steam version, NT was installed directly with no other mods, on a fresh copy of the game.

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8791 on: 2019-12-07 22:05:57 »
Are there any plans to update the documentation for the mod? I've had a big headache today because I was trying to learn the now non-existent Magnitude8 from the Gaea Dragon as per the documentation... Only to realize it was changed to Time Flare after googling it... Only to realize an hour later it was, yet again, changed to Dragon Force and not even available from Gaea Dragon as it was immune to Manipulation. Not fun times. :p

I think there's a link to a more up to date version on the front page; the files in the download itself are old though.


Hey! New to this forum, made an account just to post here;

Great mod! Definitely spruces up the game and gives it enough freshness to last a while :D
Downloaded it and started my first play-trough, currently I am before Gongaga but after the Desert Prison, sitting in the battle square and trying to get myself some of those sweet accessories.. but there is a problem that I ran into, The game either bugged out and keeps giving me slots that are impossible to win or the mod is trying to prevent me from getting too powerful too early.

To elaborate a bit more, each time I enter the Arena, the first series of slots will all be the "Break Magic Materia", next one will all be "Break Accessory" after which will come all "Disable Items", then all "Poison", then all "Minimize" etc.
My question is, is this mean to be some sort of a block to stop people from abusing Reflect Ring&Cursed Ring too early? Is this A bug?
My game is the Steam version, NT was installed directly with no other mods, on a fresh copy of the game.

The reels come in 'sets' that are supposed to be randomly chosen but the RNG in some cases can repeat if the game is reloaded from a save file (as it's a hard reload). Are you closing the client and then reloading the save when you see that particular reel set? Try going in, then escaping, then going in again. That should get you past that reel set.

jdhayward

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8792 on: Yesterday at 00:32:39 »
How do you beat the sub bosses in the northern cave? Getting my arse whooped repeatedly.

Just want to be able to access the new end game stuff!

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8793 on: Yesterday at 13:17:02 »
How do you beat the sub bosses in the northern cave? Getting my arse whooped repeatedly.

Just want to be able to access the new end game stuff!

Spoiler: show

So there are three routes which means 3 bosses. To reach the bottom and unlock the Disc 3 stuff, you only need to beat one. You can also teleport back out once you're at the bottom, so the left-down path isn't mandatory for exiting like in default. To make things easier, set Random Encounters to Off at a save point so you can quickly traverse the place.

The bosses are:
Left-Down: Tyrant
Left-Up: Protoroth
Right: Abyss

Tyrant is weak to Earth and while he starts off relatively weaker he gets stronger at the end of each attack cycle before 'enraging' and gaining a significant buff. The trick to that one is to go hard early to take full advantage of his lowered defences early in the fight. Establishing a speed advantage can help a lot using Haste/Slow, and having a super solid tank is a good idea as he has a lot of single-target physical attacks. I've an unlisted video of a team fighting him which may be useful for reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wu_nvU3lpgw&feature=youtu.be

Protoroth can be a bit awkward because both halves are aspected to physical/magical attacks and will become stronger when hit by the type they are weak against. There's also a kamikaze ability to watch out for if the Magic side is destroyed. Both sides are weak to Holy, so get that equipped onto weapons and come in with Planet Materia leveled to make use of the new Pearl spell. You can bypass their buff to an extent using Counter Materia as these won't trigger it.

Abyss is essentially a Malboro so there are a lot of status ailments flying around. I think you can get it to waste turns casting Esuna on itself if you inflict statuses on it so try using Bad Breath or similar. This one is also weak to Holy, so tee up on that element. Wind, Water, and Poison were elements that it uses I think, as well as Shout; you can block Shout by combining a Bahamut Summon with Elemental Materia.

I can provide more detailed info when I get home if that doesn't help.

jdhayward

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8794 on: Yesterday at 20:48:07 »
Hey Sega Chief,

Thanks for the help.

I actually managed to beat Tyrant not long after posting!

I'm now going through and beating all the 'New Threats' and getting ultimate weapons.

Is there something up with steal? I've been trying to steal from armoured golems in the northern cave and even after trying 20+ times I cant steal anything.

Thanks.

Karsh Highwind

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v1.5)
« Reply #8795 on: Yesterday at 21:25:25 »
Hey Sega Chief,

Thanks for the help.

I actually managed to beat Tyrant not long after posting!

I'm now going through and beating all the 'New Threats' and getting ultimate weapons.

Is there something up with steal? I've been trying to steal from armoured golems in the northern cave and even after trying 20+ times I cant steal anything.

Thanks.

For stealing, do you have the Sneak Glove equipped? If not, stealing stuff from the North Crater is practically impossible to do. If you need the Sneak Glove, it's in the same place as it is from the base game (You need the Sector 5 Key from Bone Village and 127k Gil).

Hope that helps!