Author Topic: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)  (Read 18343 times)

Ayoyo

  • Fast newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Karma: 1
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #200 on: 2019-02-19 11:35:11 »
Spoiler: show
Well, the difficulty of this battle depends on whether Ward is with you or not. If he is, Ruby Dragon will use Flare, Tornado and its infamous Breath attack. In the original game, it would be Firaga, Meteor and Breath - Meteor has been removed as it is clearly overused by enemies in vanilla late-game. If Ward is absent, the fight is noticably easier, but still more threatening than in vanilla due to Firaga instead of Fira being used, and the swipe attacks remain quite powerful regardless of party setup.
Ward?? Here? *looks it up* Wow. In all my years playing this game, I never knew that was even possible. Holy crap, what are the odds that I've never once not read the damn Timber maniacs issue. Still, Rubies are vulnerable to sleep so it's probably easy to control nonetheless.

Abadon can inflict Death with its tongue attack in addition to just Curse, but I guess you were protected from the status so you had an easier time (leveling up Edea as you said surely helps with the damage output too). Having Curaga at this point shouldn't be taken for granted either, since the only way to get full stocks at this point is by drawing it from the Tonberry King, who is an optional boss. For me it's always important to keep bosses defeatable even with less ideal setups and without having completed every sidequest prior to facing a certain boss.

If Abadon's stance changes, other attacks will be used, and his Vitality and Spirit will increase dramatically as usual, but as healing spells aren't affected by the Spirit stat (nor are they holy-elemental), you can still do full damage with them. What I could do is making Abadon go into Auto-Shell status when standing up, which would at least halve the damage by every healing spell thrown at him. I think that would be a reasonable change to prolong the battle so more of Abadon's potential can seen, even for anyone who already has Curaga and Triple at their disposal.
How did I forget about the instant death infliction! That's the very reason I had to get creative because I only have 2 stat-defs. This is where being a FF veteran came in handy because somewhere in the back of my mind I had this suspicion that Zombie makes you immune to death, so this might be the first time ever that I've used the status defensively with stellar results aside from FFX where one boss forces you to have Zombie status.
Oh, right, the curagas. Well, me being me, naturally I drew them from Tonberry. Slipped my mind that other enemies haven't carried those yet. Yes, I agree and addressed the balancing act earlier, the bosses ought to be manageable with less than ideal setups. I am making an effort to limit myself in that respect to get a better idea of the difficulty and some utilities I've flat out barred out such as card modding but still, knowledge is power. Autoshell sounds like a perfect way to circumvent the fact that SPR doesn't protect him from the barrage of curative spells. After all most players will be using healing magic since Squall flat out tells you to do that at the beginning.

Hm, do you remember the damage done by Mega Flare exactly? It should do around 6000-6500 HP damage that ignores Spirit, which makes it pretty much the most powerful AoE attack at this point of the game. The damage can be halved by having Shell on, that's correct, but also making it ignore Shell? Not sure. Getting a Game Over against Bahamut can be very frustrating, as the two preceding battles would then have to be done again. That's why I decided to not make this battle overly difficult. Compared to vanilla, Bahamut starts using Mega Flare quite a bit earlier, which I thought should do to spice this battle up a bit. I'd rather swap Tornado and Thundaga for something else than making Mega Flare do any more damage to be honest. As for the countdown thing you suggested, there's plenty of that very late in the game, but I'll see what I can do.
Exactly that: tad over 3000 which equated to around half my HP in damage. I mean you'd have to be a total madman to not have shell on everyone against freaking Bahamut. Yea I'm not saying make it go through Shell, that'd be pretty cheap. And yes, the game over here is punishing, I mean I'm the guy who begged you for additional save points to make the way back to bosses less tedious, but couldn't it be made less punishing by addressing the Via Dolorosa before Bahamut? I never got why the encounter rate has to be so damn high on the way to the pillar anyway, seems rather pointless seeing as they're just generic boring monsters from the beginning of the game and seem to add nothing except tedium to the whole ordeal. Are they really needed? Ruby drake and Behemoth at least make sense as they're formidable and tie in with the dialogue mechanic.

Thinking back, it's astonishing to me how well you've redesigned the game. I'm about as critical as they come and I find only a few loopholes, if you will, when it comes to bosses. These minor updates like slow resistance for J-Cactuar, shell on Abadon etc. is really all that's needed to make them super sweet and not that easily breakable even for players like me who enjoy experimenting and finding out the weaknesses. 
« Last Edit: 2019-02-19 11:39:04 by Ayoyo »

blankdiploma

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 2
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #201 on: 2019-02-20 05:27:31 »
Quote
Hey blankdiploma, and welcome to the forums. With crap, do you mean the in-built cheats, like getting full spell stocks automatically and the like? I guess you already know but I better say it just to be sure, but all these things are optional. Other than that, I don't think there are any real differences between the 2000 PC and Steam versions, besides the launcher. Still, I'm planning to make the mod compatible with other versions too, just not sure when.

Oh, I'm mostly referring to the horrible DRM launcher and (somehow!) managing to ship with WORSE controller support than the original PC release. Those other extras are kind of silly, but really it's just Square Enix's business practices that I don't want to support, not if they're going to treat their venerable franchises this poorly.

It's great to hear that you're planning on making it compatible with other versions of the game! I will gladly wait patiently for that to happen.
« Last Edit: 2019-02-20 06:38:22 by blankdiploma »

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #202 on: 2019-02-21 08:51:14 »
@Ayoyo:

Spoiler: show
The battles on the way to the Light Pillar inside Deep Sea Research Center can all be avoided by approaching it carefully while it doesn't emit any light. I would be all in for adding a save possibility somewhere there - if not in between the two mandatory battles against Ruby Dragon/Behemoth and Bahamut, then maybe at least right before triggering the pillar dialogue. I'll check that and see how it goes.


@blankdiploma:

You could also just give it a try and see if the provided mod files are compatible with the 2000 PC version as well (after creating backups of all original files, just in case). I've never tried it myself to be honest, since I've never owned this version. It could very well work, I just can't guarantee it.

Ayoyo

  • Fast newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Karma: 1
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #203 on: 2019-02-21 16:35:21 »
Spoiler: show
@Ayoyo:

The battles on the way to the Light Pillar inside Deep Sea Research Center can all be avoided by approaching it carefully while it doesn't emit any light. I would be all in for adding a save possibility somewhere there - if not in between the two mandatory battles against Ruby Dragon/Behemoth and Bahamut, then maybe at least right before triggering the pillar dialogue. I'll check that and see how it goes.

Never knew that. Guess I shouldn't be so stubbornly old-school and just look stuff up occasionally, would probably save me a lot of trouble. One additional point that calls for a save/menu possibility is that after you trigger the pillar dialogue(it's not our will to fight one), there's no chance to menu anymore and you just gotta fight Bahamut with what you have. Now this would be fine and makes players think ahead because they have 3 encounters to deal with, but it might be more fair and convenient to at least offer a save and menu option before the Ruby/Behemoth/Bahamut gauntlet to prevent cheap deaths to Bahamut only because you were junctioned for easier random encounters.

Well, this is it then - the final stretch and my last report for this playthrough.

Raijin&Fujin - I expected to walk over these guys after dominating Ultima Weapon, but they do actually pose a threat even for a geared party if you let them buff themselves. Once again the player is encouraged to use their head and dispel the Auras and the like away, because if you don't, they'll whoop yo ass. I like the scripted meteor, it's kind of like a wake-up call that you've entered endgame.

Mobile type8 - Goddamn, this thing just wouldn't yield the damn steals. Not gonna lie, I died twice to this boss trying to stubbornly mug everything even though it has been clearly designed to specifically make this kind of thing difficult with hard counters to every physical hit. In that respect, this boss is super unique and I quite enjoyed the challenge and being made to hesitate constantly hitting it.

Adel - Another unique boss experience. For one, a big chunk of your arsenal, mainly all AoE, is unusable in this fight and I think the Rinoa being drained away- mechanic has been made more relevant(less hp on her/Adel drains more?) so that you really have to support her almost constantly. Casting shell&regen on her right away gave me a lot of leeway in that regard though. I wonder if you can cast zombie on her? Wouldn't she be constantly healed then? Anyways, Adel uses pretty potent spells here and you better keep those shells active. Liked it overall even though it was nothing super challenging.

Ultimecia castle - Always a fun stretch of the game. I saw myself using regular attacks against Sphinx(duh), then triple casting magic took down Tripoint&Gargantua, then Irvine's AP ammo owned Red giant and so on - the whole spectrum of tools came in handy here. Especially liked how many of these bosses had such high defense, you truly can't just spam A to win no matter how overleveled you are. Trauma gave me trouble because I'm stupid and couldn't figure out that I'm already putting his HP to zero as he drained the little things; I thought I just need to grind him down and heal the little ones so as to prevent them from triggering mega super blast cannon or whatever. Doing a low level run, nobody in my party was able to survive that thing. Well, after spending about 10 minutes triple flare-ing him I finally scanned him and realized what was up. Triple Ultima to blow the whole bunch to smithereens.

Taking on the final bosses was exactly what I had hoped it would be; they're fat enough to let you throw your best stuff at them and not immediately keel over, and on the other hand hit hard enough to make you feel under threat of dying. It's a tricky tightrope for sure, balancing a long gauntlet like this, and well... I think it succeeds despite how I was able to beat the whole thing with a party of 2 (Squall, lvl26&Quistis, lvl19) because of bad luck in the beginning where my third party member with junctions died and immediately got sucked into time but I didn't want to give up, thinking this would be a great challenge to see if I can still beat it on the first try and 1 character short. So from that you can deduce that it certainly can't be too difficult or unfair at least, but still it should be threatening enough to keep players on their toes. I did have to delve into my supply of aura stones and elixirs to come out on top with my 2 guy party.
Honestly I can't say how the gauntlet could be made even better, or indeed even how I personally would improve it - there's only so much damage you can pump out at the player especially towards the end before it goes overboard and players are forced to plow through the very slow-moving first parts of the fight all over again before they get back to the hard part. However I must say that I found the experience enjoyable in the circumstances I experienced it(severely handicapped in multiple respects) and thus it would very likely fall flat on its face were I to play with normal expected levels and a full party.

Overall quite satisfied with disc 4, moreso than 3. Don't know how skewed my impression is due to low levels and other self-imposed handicaps. 
« Last Edit: 2019-02-21 21:02:08 by Ayoyo »

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #204 on: 2019-02-22 08:53:07 »
@Ayoyo: Another extensive report. Here we go.

Spoiler: show
One additional point that calls for a save/menu possibility is that after you trigger the pillar dialogue(it's not our will to fight one), there's no chance to menu anymore and you just gotta fight Bahamut with what you have. Now this would be fine and makes players think ahead because they have 3 encounters to deal with, but it might be more fair and convenient to at least offer a save and menu option before the Ruby/Behemoth/Bahamut gauntlet to prevent cheap deaths to Bahamut only because you were junctioned for easier random encounters.
Hm, I guess it would be best to just enable saving for this entire room, no matter where you stand. Would be very easy to implement and allow saving right before touching the pillar, which would eliminate the need to fly back to the island and sneaking back to the pillar every time your party dies there. 

Quote
Raijin&Fujin - I expected to walk over these guys after dominating Ultima Weapon, but they do actually pose a threat even for a geared party if you let them buff themselves. Once again the player is encouraged to use their head and dispel the Auras and the like away, because if you don't, they'll whoop yo ass. I like the scripted meteor, it's kind of like a wake-up call that you've entered endgame.
Agree about Fujin's Meteor. It was really important for me when changing this battle, so I made her cast it quite a few turns earlier than usual, so it's pretty much guaranteed the player will see it (in vanilla she would likely be defeated before getting the chance to cast it). Same goes for Raijin and his different attack pattern after using Aura on himself. All in all, this is one of the many battles that actually had potential and would have been interesting in vanilla already, if they just weren't doing so little damage, casting buffs on themselves repeatedly even though there's no need, and weren't skipping turns like crazy. Glad to hear you enjoyed the revised battle in this mod.

Quote
Mobile type8 - Goddamn, this thing just wouldn't yield the damn steals. Not gonna lie, I died twice to this boss trying to stubbornly mug everything even though it has been clearly designed to specifically make this kind of thing difficult with hard counters to every physical hit. In that respect, this boss is super unique and I quite enjoyed the challenge and being made to hesitate constantly hitting it.
Pretty much the same as above. I didn't change this boss much at all, besides making its behaviour and system actually matter by making it switch between modes much faster and fire counter attacks that are threatening enough to keep players on their toes, especially in regards to the other attacks this boss can do. Sorry for your trouble in regards to stealing the items by the way, I guess the probability should be increased as Laser Cannons aren't that unique at this point anymore, as they can now be farmed by keep doing the new battles at Lunatic Pandora Laboratory at the end of disc 3.

Quote
Adel - Another unique boss experience. For one, a big chunk of your arsenal, mainly all AoE, is unusable in this fight and I think the Rinoa being drained away- mechanic has been made more relevant(less hp on her/Adel drains more?) so that you really have to support her almost constantly. Casting shell&regen on her right away gave me a lot of leeway in that regard though. I wonder if you can cast zombie on her? Wouldn't she be constantly healed then? Anyways, Adel uses pretty potent spells here and you better keep those shells active. Liked it overall even though it was nothing super challenging.
Yes, the mechanic in this battle has been made more relevant by making Adel's Drains stronger and Rinoa's HP lower, so she can take up to 3 Drains without any player intervention. Rinoa is immune to Zombie in this battle, so she can't be healed this way. I don't really know how to make this battle more challenging to be honest. Adel's spells can be quite damaging already and many attacks can't be used because of Rinoa. Maybe by changing Energy Bomber? At the moment, it's nothing more than a standard physical attack. Maybe adding a status effect to it would be a good idea to spice things up a little.

As for the final battles, the fact that you managed to beat them on low levels with only 2 characters alive leaves room for some more changes for sure. I don't think I'll touch the very last phase again, as she is extremely fast there, using two new attacks than can be very devastating, but the previous phases are indeed a bit on the slow side. Attacks like Thundaga or Blizzaga during the first phase are a little underwhelming as well and feel more like wasted turns by Ultimecia. I'll see what I can do to add in some other attacks in there, and make Griever and the initial 3rd form a little faster. As always, suggestions are welcome.

I'll respond to your latest PM later, don't have the time right now. For now, all I can say is that you made some really good points that sparked interest in making certain changes :)



Robgatti

  • Fast newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #205 on: 2019-02-22 20:58:44 »
Just curious, is it still advised to keep your Party LV low using no encounters?

I'd like to just play the game casually, preferably without no encounters.

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #206 on: 2019-02-22 21:39:37 »
Hey Robgatti.

No, keeping levels low is definitely not advised in this mod, as bosses are at fixed levels and stat gains through leveling are higher than in the original game (and will likely be increased even more in future updates), so there isn't much to gain from low level runs, unless you are in for a tougher challenge. One of this mod's goals is to break with many of the conventions that have manifested over the years in regards to the game's playstyle to deliver a new experience to players that are bored by these conventions, making enemies more interesting by mixing encounter formations up, giving them new attacks etc. instead of just skipping them by having Enc-None activated all the time and breeze through the game, including bosses.

Enc-None isn't available until late in the game, similarly to Final Fantasy VI and X,  and Enc-Half unlocks after Diablos reached level 32 (this level requirement might be reduced, as constant random encounters are just not for everyone). If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

Robgatti

  • Fast newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #207 on: 2019-02-22 21:47:25 »
Thank you for the prompt response!

Starting my playthrough now without Triple Triad or Enc - None.
After Dozens, possibly over a hundred runs, I'm so happy to play the game in a new setting and not spending 4 hours at Balamb Garden playing Triple Triad.

Thank you for the work you put in here, I'll do a write up as I progress through.

CeruleanSpirit

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 3
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #208 on: 2019-02-24 14:43:15 »
Hi,

Having played the PSX version about 5-6 times, I brought the Steam version just to try this mod. I am currently just before the 2nd dream sequence. I can already say i'm impressed. It is somewhat different. You really have to search every nook and cranny of the game again because things may be different. Example: some minor quest like the Dollet bone quest yield a Pet Pals magazine that you can't find in Timber. I like the approach where you remove from one hand but give with the other hand. A few points on my playing experience.

- You can't really break the game early on with Triple Triad. It will give you a nice start but that's it. The spells you will most likely be able to stack to a 100 early are: cure, scan, fire, thunder, blizzard and sleep.
- New: The fire cave can be challenged in a 5 min. run. That's really hard! If you beat it, you get a Elem Atk. J., which is really nice this early. My way of doing it was to draw double spells from the library draw point. Flee from every encounter. Use double it to double blizzards on Ifrit, that in conjunction with summoning Shiva. Even then, I had perhaps 10 sec. left.
- Enemies yield more good items through drops and mug. I have found out that if you know items and the alchemical process of refinement well, this is the way to really get stuff and spells. A few examples. I was able to easily stock hundreads of aero and water spells hunting down Fastitocalon and Thrustaevis for Fish fins and Shear Feathers. Also, refining a whisper from adamantoise now yield 100x curas. Get a few in your inventory and you've got a giant hoard of healing spells. I like that because the game becomes a type of monster hunt.
- Bosses are now tougher and you have to strategize more. Some examples:
- Raldos and Granaldos now all attack right off the bat. They will destroy you if you're unprepared. I had to clear the Raldos early with 2 big summons.
- Diablos now cast pain. I revolved my strategy around blinding him, having phoenix downs on hand, keeping my team hp low and using Squall's limit break repeatedly. If he cast pain, he will kill my character but the bad status will now stick. Then I revive my character.
- Gerogero is now a master of bad status effects and cannot be instantly killed with a phoenix down. On top of that, I hadn't found a good source of Esuna this early in the game. I killed him with 3 hi-potion+ (6000 dam.) which I refined from Biggs and Wedge cards.
- A lvl. 40 X-ATM092 can be challenged if you go up the Dollet hills after the Timber events. The thing is impossible to beat for me this early. I will wait til disc 2.

Overall very good mod, I am enjoying playing FF VIII again. I will keep posting my impressions as I keep playing.

SefiCompacto

  • Fast newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 5
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #209 on: 2019-02-24 14:45:42 »
Not sure if this has been reported before, but seems like any of the new revive abilities (renew and awakening moon at least have this, not even sure if there's any other) are slightly borked. It's not letting me target my party members after reviving them, shows the name in black text as if they were still dead

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #210 on: 2019-02-24 22:46:07 »
Hi CeruleanSpirit, and welcome to the forums. It's good to hear that you considered the new Fire Cavern reward appropriate. Adding items for sidequests rewards can be quite difficult as you have to be careful not make the rewards too underwhelming and not too good either. Thanks for the other impressions, it was an interesting read, and feel free to report back again.

@SefiCompacto: Well observed, I noticed this a couple of days ago as well. I've been working on fix, but it seems that creating new moves that can revive and heal at the same time isn't as easy as I thought. Guess I have to revert Revive and Awakening Moon to their standard effects for now (these are the only ones), or make Awakening Moon act like a Megalixir at least, since Invincibility that early in the game is broken balance-wise. I'll try to upload an update today or tomorrow. Sorry for the inconvenience.

CeruleanSpirit

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 3
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #211 on: 2019-02-25 23:50:37 »
Hey thanks for the reply.  :D I'll be sure to give details of my playthrough details and impressions:

Alrighty, so I am currently at the 3rd dream sequence at beginning of CD2:

- A good knowledge of the game can make strides. The monsters, items and spells are so closely linked that I go from the principle that every monster has a story to tell and something to give. Mugging, Carding, drops all work well if you know what to look for. I got my death spells hunting down Belhelmel for their Circular saw which I refined. I got my Berserk mugging steel pipes from Wendigo. Then I carded them to get Steel Orb refining them to Demi spells. I like this better than playing TT for hours to get cards or drawing boredom.
- Second dream sequence: The last 2 esthar soldiers, I call them esthar commanders, as they are tougher and can do 900 damage. I dealt with them with summons of Quetzal, Shiva and Ifrit. A little Suggestion: The Elastoid and Gesper enemies can only be encountered in Laguna's dreams, that's a pity because they are missable. I would put them in the encounters on the Esthar road along with the Gaylas.
- Minotaur Bros: The biggest challenge that I got was that Minotaur's morningstar induced confuse on hit. I didn't get a good source of confuse or Esuna at this point. I strategized and came up with a plan: Come in battle poisoned (Bio on my characters pre-fight). Yes! This way even if my character was going to act under confusion, the poison damage was going to end the confusion immediately. Tough battle but it worked along with Protect, Regen and Float.
- Iguions: No issue here, I knew I had to watch out for Petrification.
- Seifer duel: Hey, I used the new Ifrit's ability "Return damage". I let the half damage rebound, kept curing myself with draw and laughed. Suggestion: remove cure/cura/curaga from his draw list. Too easy.
- Edea: Her spellcasting damage was impressive (~1500 dam.). Squall was my main DPS, the other 2 were on standby. At one point, she tried using Zombie over and over on Rinoa. I knew a cure spell was next so I kept using spare holy waters. The problem was that she kept wasting her action trying to get the zombie to stick. Might I suggest a different AI for her: Remove dispel from her draw list. Let her cast reflect on herself then let her cast her -ga elemental spell on herself to rebound on to a character, just like a high level Buel. That will actually negate the usual strategy of using Carbuncle for reflect on everybody, then her wasting 3 turns dispelling the reflects.

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #212 on: 2019-02-26 10:01:47 »
Beefed up versions of Elastoids and Gespers can be fought again towards the end of the game, as part of the new sidequest at Lunatic Pandora Laboratory after the Lunar Cry, for as many times you like. They also appear as mini bosses during the last Laguna flashback on disc 3, as usual. Adding them before the Lunar Cry events for Squall & co. would conflict with the reason why they can be fought again later at Lunatic Pandora Laboratory at all, so I think that should do for now.

Esuna can be first drawn from Vysage near the Tomb of the Unknown King in the night areas, and Remedies can be first bought in Deling City instead of being available right after starting the game, to make all the shops more unique, as it is usually the case in all other Final Fantasy games, and also to give Antidote, Echo Screen etc. more relevance in the early-game. If you think the Remedy availability is too late, let me know, and I might add it to Timber Shop.

Seifer and Edea: Locking Edea into casting Zombie over and over by just using Holy Water immediately has been addressed and fixed for the latest version. If you are still on 1.1 try updating and see if that fixes it, or wait for the next update coming very soon (adding in a pretty big quality of life change will slightly delay it). I'll think about your suggestions in regards to Seifer and Edea - it seems she still uses Dispel too often if any character is under Reflect. No problems with Carbuncle being helpful here though, since he is the "new" GF at this point, so making Edea 100% anti-Carbuncle would be a little unfair :)
« Last Edit: 2019-02-26 10:09:38 by Callisto »

CeruleanSpirit

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 3
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #213 on: 2019-02-26 21:29:35 »
I only encountered the Vysage after my visit to the Tomb of the unknown king, which I promptly farmed for esuna. :( Oh well, no tears over wasted curas, bios and antidotes.

Seifer: I would probably replace the Cure/Cura/Curaga by a flat low level Cure or something less useful like Life or Esuna. Seriously, coming to this boss fight without any means of healing is like coming to gunblade fight with a nail clipper.

Edea: My bad, I forgot this was a balance mod for a second. If this she doesn't lock on Zombie in the newest version, then i'm fine with her. The usual rule of thumb in RPGs: The new stuff you've got is usually going to help you beat the next boss. Carbuncle in this case.

I downloaded v1.1a at the very top of the thread. Where can I download the newest version of the mod?

Thanks!

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1a)
« Reply #214 on: 2019-03-01 17:07:44 »
Version 1.1.2 now out.


Changes Overview


Balance changes
  • Natural character stat growth has been further increased.
  • HP Bonus, Strength Bonus etc have been removed and replaced with other Abilities.
  • HP+10/30/50% structure has been changed to HP+10/20/30%.
  • The base power of Irvine's Armor Shot has been reduced from 26 to 22.
  • Critical hit rate of Irvine's Shot types have been rebalanced.
  • Rapture, Fortify and Ultra Cure appear more often in Selphie's Slots.
  • Selphie's Calamity spell inflicts Poison, Darkness, Blind and Sleep (254/255 chance) in addition to its damage.
  • Quistis' Homing Laser ignores enemy Spirit.
  • Doomtrain and Bahamut summons inflict more damage.
  • Gilgamesh's Excaliber and Masamune inflict more damage and can break the damage limit.


Enemies
  • A non-escapable extra battle will trigger on the way to the Brothers inside the Tomb of the Unknown King.
  • Edea (1st) uses Dispel less frequently when the party is under Reflect, uses Astral Punch more often instead.
  • Adel's Energy Bomber has a chance to inflict Darkness.
  • Griever is noticably more agile now.
  • Abadon is under Auto-Shell while standing (thanks to Sega Chief for helping prevent file corruption on this one).
  • Propagators are immune against Silence.
  • Jumbo Cactuar is immune against Slow.
  • Bahamut's moveset has been changed in resemblance to what he uses in Final Fantasy V.
  • Ultima Weapon's attack pattern has been extended.
  • Elnoyle is no longer immune to LV Up/Down.
  • Base Soldiers now use Drain instead of Water.


New feature: Easy card rule abolishment



Most players probably know about the NPC pictured above - he is the one who can reset all Balamb rules by just challenging him to a card game. As part of this update, more such NPCs have been added in other regions as well, to allow easy card rule abolishment everywhere, not just Balamb. Using this new service won't be free in most cases though, in order to prevent abuse and also to give players more opportunities to spend their money. Costs vary between 20,000 and 100,000 Gil, depending on an area's default ruleset. I have tested this new feature at least once for every area, and it seemed to work flawlessly, but I can't guarantee it's 100% bug-free. Please report if you discover anything off regarding this feature, like rules not resetting despite having paid for it. The NPCs in question can be found at the following locations:

Dollet | Galbadia | FH | Centra | Trabia | Esthar | Lunar 1 | Lunar 2
 


Other changes
  • New mini quest: At Lunar Gate, keep challenging the right guard to a card game until he agrees, then play to earn some items (can be done again after Lunar Cry).
  • Due to a glitch, Revive/Renew has its standard effect restored, Awakening Moon has the same effect as a Megalixir for now.
  • In order to compensate for the missing Recover Ability, Treatment now restores HP in addition to curing status changes.
  • Defeating the 3 Cyborgs at Lunatic Pandora Laboratory yields two additional Friendship items.
  • Another Friendship is now rewarded at Chocobo Sanctuary in addition to the Chicobo Card.
  • A new enemy Ability, Mind Blast, is now used by a few select enemies; inflicts magic damage that ignores Spr and can inflict Stop.
  • The game can be saved in the room where Bahamut awaits.
  • Diablos' level requirement for the Enc-Half Ability has been reduced from 32 to 24.
  • Flare can break the damage limit when used under Angel Wing.


Many thanks for all the user feedback lately, it has been very helpful :)

@CeruleanSpirit: 1.1a was the latest version before this one, so I guess you just had a bad RNG and saw her casting Zombie a little too often. The probability of her using Zombie has been reduced for this update as well.
« Last Edit: 2019-03-01 19:25:04 by Callisto »

Nikito

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #215 on: 2019-03-10 21:45:23 »
Hey, i bought FF8 for PC to try out this mod and i have to say i'm loving it so far.

I have a question though, How early is it possible to get a steel pipe for squall's first weapon upgrade? I found out the hard way that Elastoid doesn't turn into a steel pipe anymore.

On that note, is there a list of where to get items in this mod?

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #216 on: 2019-03-11 02:34:19 »
Hey Nikito, and welcome to the forums.

The first opportunity to get a Steel Pipe is in Timber, right after completing the train mission on disc 1. Make sure to stop by the Town's Gate near the inn and help the two guards dealing with the Galbadian soldiers. Unlike the original game, this will be rewarded with a Steel Pipe and some screws, which is just enough to upgrade to Squall's second weapon. Even if you miss this opportunity, you can still get Steel Pipes shortly after by mugging Wendigos in Timber Roshfall Forest on the world map.

There is no list that contains all the item information yet, but there will be one soon for those who are interested.

Nikito

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #217 on: 2019-03-16 12:40:03 »
Thanks, the mod is really something so far.

Did you by any chance change the queen of cards side quest? I just reached her in Dollet and she's asking for a Quezacotl card and didn't say the mini mog card is with the old guy's son, which i've never had happen before.
« Last Edit: 2019-03-16 13:25:25 by Nikito »

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #218 on: 2019-03-16 15:50:08 »
Yes, the Queen of Cards sidequest has been slightly changed indeed. The chain now starts with losing the Quezacotl card instead of the Minimog card, to move this entire quest to disc 2 and onwards, as most of the cards that can be won from it still refine into something very useful.

Make sure to ask the Queen about her artist father whenever she is in Dollet to always get hints about where new cards appear (in the original, these hints are very easy to miss) - the Kiros card holder has been changed as well and is now found at Winhill inn rather than Deling City streets. Other than that, the Queen now requests the Pandemona card instead of the Sacred card, but the rest of the questline remains the same as in the original game.

By the way, here's a full guide on how to get Squall's weapons as early as possible. The other characters will soon follow.

Spoiler: show
[Shear Trigger]

Steel Pipe x1
Screw x4

Notes: A Steel Pipe and 5 Screws can be received in Timber by helping the guards dealing with the Galbadian Soldiers near the inn (first visit only). Otherwise, mug Steel Pipes from Wendigos in Timber Roshfall Forest or on dirt ground near Deling City and get the Screws from Geezards.


[Cutting Trigger]

Betrayal Sword x1
Screw x8

Notes: Betrayal Swords are dropped by low level Forbiddens that can be first encountered inside the Tomb of the Unknown King. A fixed encounter that consists of 3 Forbiddens (all at level 18) has been added there, so it's pretty much guaranteed the player will get a Betrayal Sword on the way to beating the Brothers. This is the only weapon that can be acquired early by modding cards right after the beginning of the game - disc 1 Lion Heart is no longer possible in this mod.


[Flame Saber]

Mesmerize Blade x1
Dragon Fang x8
Screw x8

Notes: Fight Mesmerize for the Blades and Blue Dragon for the Fangs after getting control over Balamb Garden on disc 2. They can be both encountered on the Trabia continent, albeit Blue Dragons are rare (the highest chance is the snow covered forests). Dragon Fangs can also be bought at the new shop in Deling City with Familiar Ability unlocked. I am aware of this weapon's availability being quite far away from Cutting Trigger and too close to Twin Lance, so it will likely be changed to an earlier point in the game soon.


[Twin Lance]

Orihalcon x2
Red Fang x2
Screw x12

Notes: One Orihalcon can be stolen from BGH251F2 (2nd), and they drop from med-high leveled Adamantoises, as usual. Red Fangs can be stolen from Hexadragons that now appear in forests on the Centra continent (instead of Ruby Dragons that in turn have been moved to Grandidi Forest) or won as a high level drop. Hexadragons also appear in Galbadia Garden on disc 2 now, alongside Tri-Faces and Death Claws.


[Punishment]

Dino Bone x2
Chef's Knife x1
Laser Cannon x1
Screw x8

Notes: For getting Dino Bones as early as possible, use LV Up on the T-Rexaurs on the Balamb continent until they reach LV 40+, then mug them or get them as a drop. Chef's Knife is dropped by Tonberries, as usual. As for the Laser Cannon, it's still possible to get it from high leveled Belhelmels as a rare drop, but there are other options that are more convenient. For one, it can be stolen from the Elastoid that appears during the final Laguna flashback and also from the Elastoids that can be fought as part of a new sidequest at Lunatic Pandora Laboratory after the Lunar Cry events, for as many times you like.


[Lion Heart]

Adamantine x1
Moon Stone x4
Pulse Ammo x12

Notes: Get the Adamantine as a drop from high leveled Adamantoises at various beaches on the world map, as usual (I would recommend the one near Cactuar Island, at which they are most common). Two Moon Stones can be acquired as part of sidequests (Winhill vase quest, Chocobo Forest) - the remaining two can be most easily won from Toramas after the Lunar Cry events. Not much has changed about the Pulse Ammo availability, other than the new possibility of farming them at Lunatic Pandora Laboratory, by refining the Elastoid's Laser Cannons into Pulse Ammo.
« Last Edit: 2019-03-19 16:03:24 by Callisto »

Nikito

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #219 on: 2019-03-16 18:52:09 »
Thank you so much for that guide, it will surely come in handy. I'm looking forward to the zell one as well.

On a kinda related note, is it not possible to change weapons so that they give magic too? Weapon upgrading on Sephie, Quistis and Rinoa feel kind of underwhelming if not useless with them giving only strength boosts.

Callisto

  • Crazy poster
  • *
  • Posts: 150
  • Karma: 9
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #220 on: 2019-03-19 16:02:37 »
Ok, here's the guide for remaining characters. Also made a correction to Squall's Twin Lance (I confused Orihalcon and Giant's Ring in the description).

Spoiler: show

Zell's weapons

[Maverick]
Dragon Fin x1
Spider Web x4

Notes: One Dragon Fin can be found as part of the Dog sidequest in Dollet when doing it on disc 1 or 2. Two more can be stolen from the Iguions at the end of disc 1. Note that Dragon Fins can be also used to create the valuable Double spells, so if there are only a few Dragon Fins in your inventory, think carefully about what to spend them on. Spider Webs are won from Caterchipillars, as usual.
 

[Gauntlet]
Giant's Ring x2
Fury Fragment x2

Notes: Only a few options are available for getting a Giant's Ring before they become available in Esthar. One can be found in the Chocobo Forest of Fun on the Centra continent, while another can be received from Zone in exchange for the Girl Next Door magazine. Fury Fragments can be stolen from Blue Dragon in the snow covered forests on the Trabia continent, on any level.


[Ehrgeiz]
Phoenix Spirit x1
Dragon Skin x4
Inferno Fang x2

Notes: At the moment, the only way to get a Phoenix Spirit is by refining 20 Phoenix Pinions using GFAbl Med-RF, which can be costly and requires Eden to be unlocked. A Phoenix Spirit will be very likely added as a sidequest reward soon. Dragon Skins are most easily won from high leveled Anacondaurs around Dollet's mountain range, and Inferno Fangs from high leveled Ruby Dragons that appear at their usual places in the late-game (if you want to fight them as early as possible, check out Grandidi Forest on disc 2).



Irvine's weapons

[Ulysses]
Steel Pipe x1
Bomb Fragment x1
Screw x2

Notes: I think the materials are unchanged from the base game. Steel Pipes can be stolen from Wendigos in Timber Roshfall Forest, on dirt ground near Deling City, and in D-District Prison a little later. A Bomb Fragment is sometimes dropped by Bombs, even the low level Bombs inside Fire Cavern. An encounter that has Bombs in it will be likely added somewhere on the Galbadia continent soon, in case they didn't drop one in Fire Cavern or the player doesn't want to use Card Mod.


[Bismarck]
Steel Pipes x2
Dynamo Stone x4
Screw x8

Notes: Dynamo Stones can be stolen from med-high leveled Blitzes that are common on the Centra Continent. It's not a guaranteed steal, but chances to get one are high.


[Exeter]
Dino Bone x2
Shaman Stone x1
Star Fragment x2
Screw x18

Notes: For getting Dino Bones as early as possible, use LV Up on the T-Rexaurs on the Balamb continent until they reach LV 40+, then mug them or get them as a drop. Shaman Stones are rare, but one can be stolen from the final sorceress at the beginning of disc 4. Can be also won by modding the Bahamut card in this mod. As for Star Fragments, fight Iron Giants or get a few by doing the Dollet Dog sidequest on disc 3. This weapon is the only weapon that has received an inherent crit bonus that is entirely independent on Irvine's Luck stat.



Quistis' weapons

[Slaying Tail]
Magic Stone x1
Sharp Spike x1

Notes: Magic Stones are dropped by low level T-Rexaurs and by Granaldo on disc 1. Sharp Spikes can be dropped by Geezards in this mod as well, but it's not a guaranteed drop.


[Red Scorpion]
Ochu Tentacle x4
Dragon Skin x8

Notes: Ochu appears in Timber Forest (most frequently towards the end of the area) when playing as Laguna, so you might want to take advantage of that to get some Ochu Tentacles. For the Dragon Skins I would recommend fighting high leveled Anacondaurs near Dollet or med-high leveled Blue Dragons in the snow covered forests around Trabia Garden.


[Save the Queen]
Earth Stone x8
Malboro Tentacle x2
Energy Crystal x4

Notes: Earth Stone is one of the new items and is sometimes dropped by Armadodo and Abyss Worms. It can be also stolen from T-Rexaur on any level, or bought at the new Deling City Shop with the Familiar Ability unlocked. Malboro can be encountered at the usual places and the Energy Crystals can be still farmed by doing the scripted Elnoyle battle in Esthar over and over.



Rinoa's weapons

[Valkyrie]
Magic Stone x1
Shear Feather x2

Notes: Magic Stones are dropped by low level T-Rexaurs and by Granaldo on disc 1. Shear Feathers are a common steal/drop from Thrust Aevis that is pretty much everywhere around Timber and Deling City.


[Rising Sun]
Wind Stone x1
Saw Blade x4
Screw x8

Notes: Wind Stone is the other new item and is sometimes dropped by Thrust Aevis and Abyss Worms. It can be also stolen from Death Claws that can appear in the forest near the orphanage, in Balamb Garden during the Norg scenario and in Galbadia Garden on disc 2. Saw Blade is a guaranteed steal from Belhelmel that can be found around Galbadia Garden on disc 1, and is also usually dropped by them.


[Cardinal]
Cockatrice Pinion x8
Mesmerize Blade x4
Curse Spike x2

Notes: The earliest opportunity to fight Cockatrices is around Dollet (grassland area) or Timber Roshfall Forest. Mesmerizes are found pretty much everywhere on the Trabia Continent. For Curse Spikes, I would advise stealing some from Tri-Face that now appears in a scripted encounter during the Norg scenario in Balamb Garden, or waiting until reaching the MD Levels where they can be encountered as well.


[Shooting Star]
Windmill x2
Regen Ring x1
Force Armlet x1
Energy Crystal x2

Notes: Same as in base game, nothing has changed here. Windmills are a little harder to come by in this mod though. The first opportunity is likely by fighting high leveled Abyss Worms in Kashkabald Desert on the Centra continent. A Regen Ring is now rewarded for helping out Balamb Garden students during the Norg scenario, so you might want to save it for Rinoa's best weapon later.



Selphie's weapons

[Morning Star]
Steel Orb x2
Sharp Spike x2

Notes: A few Steel Orbs are dropped by Diablos, and Sharp Spikes are sometimes dropped by Geezards. If you don't want to use Diablos' Steel Orbs for upgrading the weapon, you can fight Wendigos in Timber Roshfall Forest to get Steel Orbs as well (as a drop only).


[Crescent Wish]
Wizard Stone x2
Life Ring x1
Sharp Spike x4

Notes: 5 Wizard Stones can be found as a treasure in one of the Chocobo Forests on the Trabia continent. They are generally rare until the mid-late-game, so you might want to take advantage of this relatively early opportunity. Life Rings are sometimes dropped by Mesmerizes, also found on Trabia. As for Sharp Spikes, fight Geezards or Grand Mantis on the Centra continent.


[Strange Vision]
Adamantine x1
Star Fragment x3
Curse Spike x2

Notes: Same as in the base game. Adamatine from high leveled Adamantoises, Star Fragments by doing the Dollet Dog sidequest on disc 3 or by fighting Iron Giants, Curse Spike from Tri-Faces in Balamb Garden disc 2 or Deep Sea Research Center on disc 3 or 4.



I would love to add more bonuses to weapons, such as giving some a Magic Boost, as you suggested. Unfortunately, it's one of the harder changes to make. FF8 tool support is still relatively young though, so it might be possible more easily at some point - fingers crossed.

Nikito

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • Karma: 0
    • View Profile
Re: [FF8PC-Steam] Ragnarok Rebalancing Mod (v1.1.2)
« Reply #221 on: 2019-03-24 20:49:26 »
Thanks for the guide it's coming in real handy. I just finished Disc 1 due to me being a bit busy. So far i'm really enjoying everything though i feel Irvine is a bit weak compared to Squall and Zell when it comes to overall usefulness, maybe i'm misusing him though.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 17:45:59 by Nikito »