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Messages - SpooX

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276
General Discussion / Re: FF7 Map Analysis & Prerenders
« on: 2011-01-21 20:27:05 »

*squints*

     ...

*squints harder*

     .....

I have no idea how you noticed that and can barely read it, but I'll add it in anyway. Thanks!
PS don't quote images from previous posts, please do edit..... rules you know
lol  :-D
well this is my secret  8-)

Spoiler: show




apart from good eyes, I also have the book above....
and in there it is a bit more readable.

note; at the hotel, first stone to the right with station in large,
underneath it states "Tope Way" which I think should be "Rope way".... 8-)

277
General Discussion / Re: FF7 Map Analysis & Prerenders
« on: 2011-01-21 17:27:31 »
another addition for part 3

it's hardly readable, but in

there is a plaque behind the cashregister underneath the cabinet on the wall which depicts (from left to right):
a skull with bones followed by "Poison"

278
General Discussion / Re: FF7 Map Analysis & Prerenders
« on: 2011-01-20 16:23:56 »
Small addition for your analyses....

Quote
I can’t quite read the name of the hotel
in the original drawing of this background, the hotel is called "The Picman Hotel"

and Chocobo just states "Chcobo"
see also:


I'm still waiting for the Midgar part......could be usefull for my project.... 8)

279
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2011-01-10 21:06:22 »
Of course that's from a scientific view, I'm not so sure the developers thought of all of these things when making "Final Fantasy VII".

Personally I don't think there was a lot based on real science within FF7, the annoying flaws keep piling up within several backgrounds...impossible buildings, impossible sizes, impossible renderings.... etc etc.

but non the less, we'll keep having fun (when time permits)  8-)
Some small updates...


and did you ever wonder where to put the explosives, TA??  8)


PS Happy new year everyone.  8-)

280
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-12-05 23:56:20 »
Okay,

here's something to have a look at....


I don't know if it could ever snow in Midgar, but since it's FF, nothing is impossible.
Hope you like it.
 8-)
Hope you don't mind I do a double post.... :o

281
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-12-05 09:39:17 »
That sneaky bastard, hiding updates in there like that. Everyone should go check it out.  ;D

and I thought TA was a covert operation......   8)

282
Completely Unrelated / Re: The QHIMM Forries!
« on: 2010-12-02 15:47:12 »
Cool, I've got nominations :D

However,
I do miss one name which I expected to be in here somewhere....
...has something to do with Q-gears i believe.
the person i wish to nominate is Akari.
Along with all the others who started the work Q-gears ages ago of course

283
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-10-15 23:45:08 »
Haven't checked this for a while and just wondering but, are there any fields that are fully textured yet?
nope, not as far as I know at least.
I know there aren't any real lights, I also have a basic understanding of how the lighting is applied. What I dont know is what kind of information it uses to do this "lighting". For example, at the bottom of the northern cave there is a bright green light coming from the center of the field, how is this effect achieved?
I always thought lights were rendered as different layers within the background maps (visible with Palmer), I haven't looked at any bsx file yet, it might be interesting if there are any lights and positions in there....

284
Completely Unrelated / Biased forum?
« on: 2010-10-12 17:53:41 »
Well I think there are some weird spell check rules in place here...... :-o



(didn't know where to drop this, so dropping it here...)

285
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-10-12 16:45:11 »
Upon further pondering and studying some of the backgrounds, I do think it was modelled in 3d after all (at the same studio that did make the spirits within).
Quote
Final Fantasy VII was the first game in the series to use developers on both sides of the Pacific. The main game engine was developed at the Japanese offices of Squaresoft, supervised by Hironobu Sakaguchi, while the impressive video sequences were created at the new and expensive offices of Square USA in Honolulu, Hawaii. Squaresoft fully took advantage of the many talented and experienced computer animators and powerful computers this side of the Pacific.
Not really based upon reading some old articles, although...
Quote from: Yoshinori Kitase
There were a huge number of people we had never worked with before. Up until that point Squaresoft’s teams had only ever dealt with the traditional 2D medium. All of a sudden we had new people coming in working with software like Power Animator and SoftImage that we had never heard of before. From an industry point of view, it was unbelievable what we were trying to achieve. That is why we all had this strong feeling; this great enthusiasm.
but....
All the scenes which use FMV's are made in 3d, otherwise the camera line up would be very difficult to achieve.
furthermore, upon investigating NMKIN_2 for instance, when you take the pipes which go around the central tower, they have rendered reflections (that's why the corners are very hard to distinguish) same as with the left wall, you can see a mirror image from the stairs...
(take a close look at the original backgrounds)
Aside from the reflections, there's another hint in the way the materials are used, the pipe top left of the exit seems to have the same material as the wall behind, however it is really stretched.

But that's just my humble opinion  :-\ ???

Refs:
The Making Of: Final Fantasy VII, Edge, June 9, 2009
The making of Final Fantasy VII and how Squaresoft conquered the RPG market, Gek Siong Low, 2001

Now back to the subject at hand, I don't think it is that difficult to find the postion of the lights based on the highlights and shadows in the scenes, that should be doable.

Quote from: Cyb
Honestly I think this stuff would look incredible in POVray
I haven't seen impressing renders out of POVray (that doesn't mean there aren't, but I haven't seen any (haven't searched either :wink:)
just googled some, and well I've seen a few. As my experince is much better with 3d Max as with any other 3d program, and looking at the way POV works, I think it will take too much time for me to spend some energy in doing so. The renderer(s) I use are pretty capable of making extreme realistic renderers, depending on the settings, materials and lighting, so I'll stick to those. The exeption I'm willing to make is the Gears engine (Ogre), but for that I have to optimize most of the models, otherwise you get a lot of artifacts on-screen. And with earlier discussion with Akari in mind (going for FFVII RT-3D  ;D).

Quote from: Aali
Do you know if it would be possible, from this data, to extract and/or extrapolate enough information to create "real" light sources in field?

Well, the coordinates of the walk mesh are known, my models are based upon the walkmesh, so technically speeking, the lights I use do have coordinates and can be exported, they only have to be transformed into FFVII coordinates, but that shouldn't be too hard.

Well that's all from me, sorry no pictures this time...  ::)


286
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-10-10 20:08:43 »
Then I assume all scenes will be rendered then recompiled for the FF7 engine?
I am assuming a lot probably :D
pretty much I guess.

Well the original backgrounds were hand drawn (starving anime artists of the late 90's likely), scanned then pixel edited to make the backgrounds look good. The data then was carved up (cells were used for certain parts) into blocks and stored accordingly.  Since TA plans on using the original FF7 engine this is your process (accept you are generating 2d files from 3d scenes) and you need to use the original background information to put the animated data back in.
Yes I know, well the drawing part. Actually it was done by Kusanagi some of it can be seen in here (group of artists) and drawn in 3d (well in perspective that is :-))
Nice drawings I must say. Unfortunately there are only a few drawings of Midgar in those books...  :-(

Down side to some of that is the animation rates may need some correlation so you don't have a speeding background (LOL) torches shoot fireballs type stuff (like any game that's animated faster than it originally was designed for).

I had wondered about the lighting, now I know, FF7 I believe rarely used actual lights (more like overlays to brighten sections). This was debated, I am sure Akari or Mickey knows far more than I do.

All the lighting was done by the 'artist' who drew the original scene. So it may be necessary to adjust the lighting so it's correct.

Cyb
If the background really are rendered as 2d, and it seems to be that way, then the lighting is indeed painted in or over, but it seems that it is possible to to reverse engeneer the lights in the backgrounds.

287
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-10-09 22:00:07 »
Remember it's just a hobby! (or something like that)
What modeler and data set type are you using? OBJ set (wavefront)?  I've just recently been abusing sketchup by exporting the data using SU2POV. Interesting stuff.

Am I right in assuming you are using meshes and no finite solid primitives?

I've also been using GCAD3d for taking models and moving them too POV using PoseRay. Nifty stuff. Unfortunately it's not like I have a lot of time but might be interesting to see if I can do a few animations. That will have to wait :D

There doesn't appear to be any use of radiant light surfaces either so radiosity isn't in the picture likely either. Hmmmm.

Cyb - will speculations never cease LOL
To answer your questions, I'm using Max as a modeller, therefor the dataset would be max-files  :)
On occasion I use a primitive, however most of the time I start with a single face and push vertices around to create an object.
Oh, and no lights yet, just a skylight of the renderer.

The hardest part is to guess the right position, some backgrounds are easy and detailed, but the current one is a real b*tch. I think many backgrounds do have faults in them. Probably due to time constrains (for instance compare NMKIN_2 with SMKIN_2, the upper right corner with the crane (or whatever it might be). The placement of the objects are overlapping, and not consistent with real space, but I guess that's why it's called Final Fantasy  ???

So without further delays, here's the update, enjoy. 8-)




288
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-09-12 13:42:19 »
Is there grass in the original?
Haven't played in a while, don't remember it :P

Hmmmm.....
perhaps I should stop making Hi-res renders....  ::)

Well actually there is no grass, it is moss.

in the original it is just a brown greenish something.

289
Team Avalanche / Re: Bombing Mission Cinematics
« on: 2010-09-12 11:07:22 »
Mind you that we're going for original and improve, not implementing/injecting CC or AC parts within FF7.

290
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-09-12 11:03:46 »
I was a little sad after seeing a video on youtube with these modifications & then finding out it's not yet released..

Well, here's something to take away some sadness...

A render test... (mostly technical research in improving quality and lowering rendering times..  8-))




291
Small update....


another update missing from here...


small update again...


292


Here is the first test....
Yeah, I know it's 3D, I meant geometry. But you gotta get the feel and depth of the original right. What you've got so far is way better than my first try, but it's almost too enclosed - the depth isn't right. Also, there are too many particles, I think. I'll post what I have so far up when I can. The original uses many particle systems, one for the close up depth, and one for the further away particles. At least, that's what I can tell.
I only used 1 (static) particle system (yes it is made in 3ds max) pflow, but not all particles are visible (yet). at this time all particles are flat (and the same size (you can see that in the end) and some particles are doubled, i haven't cleaned up the scene yet, also it can be scaled up to create more depth.  :)
but I thought I post it anyways as a first try.

293
euhm... ::)
particles is 3d...
check the repo for now....

294
Amazing dude, looks pretty much spot-on to me!

Also, here's a test of that particle stuff I was talking about (when it finishes processing)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NG7vCpJBGQ

What do you think? or would you prefer to do it yourself in Max?

It's a beginning, try to add additional layers (3d cam perhaps) to create more depth.
(if you want some very good after effects tutorials, take a look at videocopilot. They've got some amazing stuff there :-) )
Do it in Max? Not really if I don't have to, it is quite intense to do in max, unless...particles... well it could be done, but if you know a way to do it easier, than do it. Movie making is all about cheating.....

The opening movie consists pf 3 parts:
  • Particles (starry sky)
  • fade to Aeris, with flowers, zoom out until (almost) all of Midgar is in view,show TA Logo (if there is one, otherwise use FF VII logo  :-D) zoom in to Midgar trainstation, otherwise known as NMSKIN
  • Close up view of train, with sparks
These are the parts needed for opening.


I wonder if the animation information can be abused in something like POV.

Cyb

if pov has some form of scripting, or file-format , which can contain a camera, animation, mesh....
I think it should be possible, but I'm not quite at home with povray. :-)

295
I think it's a bit to light and smokey, needs to be a bit more pressurised, like it's being really pumped out, not just vented.

thought so too, more pressure coming up, and also more smoke..  ;D

This is going to be the part of the effects in the opening FMV, right?

that's the plan, and everywhere else where mako's pump out poison...

....your particles should decay into gray/brown.
stay tuned after these messages....

Actually this is probably a good 'start' before the big BOOM. I'll have to watch the original to see what they did. Need to do a comparison :D

actually I was looking more at the opening movie, not the major explosion of the reactor....

Here included some references...

(click image to see animation) ::)

Target:
  • bottom left, reactor (frame from opening), reactor at the right side.
  • Top Left, Tech demo PS3
  • Reactor 01, just for reference
  • NMKIN_4, the source of inspiration for looking for the right effect (raw mako?)

Oh, almost forgot, center, current state of effect... 8-)

<<Edit; animation included>>

296



Here a little test rendering on the Mako Reactor (click image to see animation)

Please C & C.

Also testing a way to upload video, due to bad quality of imageshack.

297
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-08-19 23:09:43 »
Actually that would be quite humorous to make a LEGO version of the FF7 models :D

Cyb

hmmmm chibbi minifigs, I do wonder....
Next time I'll throw some real bricks into the scene...

but for now, some light test...


I don't like the volume lights yet, nor the water surface...
but at least you can see the effect of the light on the bricks..... more like the original I think.

298
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-08-19 18:54:47 »
Looks great! Just noticing that the bricks on the walls are of a different color then the original. Are you planning on changing these?

I'm not yet concerned about the actual textures, for now they're most temporary placements.

I think I'll replace everything with....

 ;D

299
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-08-18 23:04:00 »
This kinda reminds me of the "Lego" Video Games.


Some more Lego bricks added... :-o



So far it's a creepy reactor, we could create some kind of silent hill feeling..... :evil:

Working with mako made my computer crash, somehow he doesn't like the radiation... :|

300
Team Avalanche / Re: New Project: Bombing Mission!
« on: 2010-08-17 22:27:58 »
Here comes an other one....


just some more detailing.....never mind the lighting setup....  8)

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