Author Topic: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change  (Read 9958 times)

ultima espio

  • *
  • Posts: 1357
    • View Profile
If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« on: 2011-12-14 17:59:36 »
This is an interview I read on KH Vids:
Quote
Many fans have been clamoring for a Final Fantasy VII remake for a while now, the classic PSone version available on PlayStation Network just isn't enough! In a chat with OXM, Final Fantasy XIII-2 producer Yoshinori Kitase says that, were a remake to happen, they would not be content keeping everything the same.

"If I may speak as a game creator," He said, "if we were to produce a remake of 7, for example, I would be really tempted to delete things and add new elements, new systems or whatever because if we were to make exactly the same thing now, it'd be like a repeat."

Kitase went on to say it wouldn't be as much fun to make a game like that, but also acknowledged that some of the fanbase might not be too happy with even slight changes.

"If we did that, the fans might be disappointed or [say] 'this is not what I was expecting' so in that sense maybe some might say that it's better to let memory be memory." He explained that, as developers, revisiting their old titles will often simply remind them of things that don't seem so cool now, or could have been better.

"But on the other hand, those slightly negative features and bits, for some of the really enthusiastic fans of these titles, that gives the game extra flavor or personality or whatever. So maybe they would rather we didn't do anything about it and we just leave it in as it is." He concludes, "It's very difficult to decide what we should keep in and what we should take out."

Square Enix isn't totally against the remake idea, as past revisions have proven, along with the upcoming version of Final Fantasy X for PlayStation 3 and PS Vita. Would you want a remake of Final Fantasy VII? If so, would you care if they made adjustments to the game?

Well...from that it's like they want to remake it, but don't want to screw it up, so they aren't doing anything.

I wouldn't mind it being remade at all, it's just the part where they say they would change systems and delete things. Adding optional things would be alright I guess...

Furzball

  • *
  • Posts: 612
  • Furzball happens...
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #1 on: 2011-12-14 18:32:36 »
I'm pretty much at the point of saying, "do whatever, just decide to get started and get to work." I bet as much as all of the fans argue so do the developers in Square offices. I mean, if I was on the original team for FF7 or a developer that would like to get my hands in that goldmine, both sides would have an opinion to voice. Heck I'd even go with an engine update or fan remake.

Jaitsu

  • *
  • Posts: 1067
  • DON'T FWOOSH ME BRO
    • View Profile
    • Jaitsu Studios
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #2 on: 2011-12-14 18:54:23 »
for me, i don't mind depending on what changes they make.

for instance, i wouldn't mind an updated materia system, but i don't want them to toss the materia system out.

another change i'd like to see? more boss fights with Rufus damnit!!

Plot changes are tricky, as they'd likely change some things to suit the cannon they've made. throwing in a genesis appearance or something, which, unlike many, i personally wouldn't mind, however i want the core of the game to follow the same path.

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #3 on: 2011-12-14 19:04:41 »
I don't trust enix with running a bath.  They will change too much, and not for the better.  I hope they never remake it with those guys on board.  FF7 didn't get praise just for its graphics, but that's all anyone seems to give a shit about now.

KaidenJames

  • *
  • Posts: 361
  • It's cuz of the !@#$ 'pizza'
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #4 on: 2011-12-14 19:10:23 »
I don't trust enix with running a bath.  They will change too much, and not for the better.  I hope they never remake it with those guys on board.  FF7 didn't get praise just for its graphics, but that's all anyone seems to give a sh*t about now.

Which is why i'm fine with a remake from here. Graphics do not make a game good! That's why I feel sorry for the new generation of gamers. Yeah, their games may be prettier, but it doesn't make them better. SE should just leave VII alone IMO.

msifreakster

  • *
  • Posts: 32
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #5 on: 2011-12-14 19:28:15 »
I do have to note here that they aren't remaking it for the very reason people worry about a Square remake. They know that they cant resist changing some "broken" things. Personally I would still love a remake as long as they left the core of the game alone and left the materia system in. I have always loved the materia system. My list of things for FFVII to change all would be

Improved materia management system, just the way the materia and equipment menus work
improved graphics (this one by itself would get my wife to play finally :))
fixed translations
Barret being who he was supposed to be instead of a stereotype

In my opinion it wouldnt need anything else.

On a side note, Firefox underlines materia in red to tell me it is spelled wrong and it took me a minute to realize materia isn't a real word.  :P

Edit: Luckily we have Qhimm forums and a great modding community. It may not be as pretty as what a true remake would be but it sure is nice to have these mods around.
« Last Edit: 2011-12-14 20:37:07 by msifreakster »

ultima espio

  • *
  • Posts: 1357
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #6 on: 2011-12-14 20:23:09 »
I do have to note here that they aren't remaking it for the very reason people worry about a Square remake. They know that they cant resist changing some "broken" things. Personally I would still love a remake as long as they left the core of the game alone and left the materia system in. I have always loved the materia system. My list of things for FFVII to change all would be

Improved materia management system, just the way the materia and equipment menus work
improved graphics (this one by itself would get my wife to play finally :))
fixed translations
Barret being who he was supposed to be instead of a stereotype

In my opinion it wouldnt need anything else.

On a side note, Firefox underlines materia in red to tell me it is spelled wrong and it took me a minute to realize materia isn't a real word.  :P

Pretty much what I think. Square are usually pretty faithful with their remakes.

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #7 on: 2011-12-14 20:45:01 »
Like FFX-2 and Advent children and Dirge of Retcons?  Are you joking?  I think those 3 prove undoubtedly that graphics are king and a  good story is a plague to be avoided.  There are many improvements that can be made to FF7, but when people of qhimms are doing almost all of them (except full HD finished graphics), I lose interest in talk of FF7 remake. 

I made a list of things that could be done with a remake of ff7 but i suspect 90% of that list would be ignored, and instead I get to have the wonders of "Genesis" popping out of nowhere.
« Last Edit: 2011-12-14 21:30:45 by DLPB »

Covarr

  • Covarr-Let
  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 3941
  • Just Covarr. No "n".
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #8 on: 2011-12-14 21:34:39 »
Pretty much what I think. Square are usually pretty faithful with their remakes.
Like FFX-2 This is a sequel, not a remake and Advent children This is a sequel, not a remake and Dirge of Retcons This is a sequel, not a remake?  Are you joking?
Let's look at things they've done which have been REMAKES:

Final Fantasy III DS - added a story, where there previously was none. Not faithful, but frankly the original was kinda shit and needed it. I don't think ANYBODY complained about this.
Final Fantasy IV DS - Story is pretty faithful to the original. Exact dialogue words were changed, but overall meaning and tone were left alone.
Kingdom Hearts Re:Chain of Memories - Pretty faithful to the original. Most major difference is that the battles have been reimagined in the KH1 engine, but it still plays close to the same.
Kingdom Hearts Re:Coded - Gameplay doesn't even resemble the original, but the story is the same.
Final Fantasy Origins - Lots of bling added, FMVs, better graphics, and remixed soundtrack, but the gameplay is faithful save some balance improvements
Final Fantasy I & II: Dawn of Souls - see FF Origins
A bunch of Dragon Quest games: some minor gameplay changes, new classes, new items, new dungeons, but generally plenty faithful.

For as awful as Square-Enix has been about spinoffs, they do have a very good track record with remakes, and it's plain foolish to ignore that. Their history has given NO reason to believe that they would replace the world map with a Mario-3-style hub, add Angeal/Genesis as main characters, or any other such nonsense. More likely, we'd see stupid more minor details changed to match or prevent conflict with retcons (aeris into aerith, change a few definite statements into vague things that don't explicitly confirm or ignore their retcons), an extra dungeon because there's always an extra dungeon, and maybe some ill-advised costume changes with too many zippers. But nothing on the level you seem to be afraid of. It just doesn't match EVERY OTHER REMAKE THEY'VE EVER PUBLISHED.

Games which were enhanced ports rather than remakes, such as FF Anthology/Chronicles, Chrono Trigger DS, or IV, V, and VI Advance were deliberately not put on the list. But they too are pretty faithful.

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #9 on: 2011-12-14 22:48:16 »
The truth is the trend isn't good.  I can't imagine them redoing FF7 even near competently. It is a different animal, and I imagine pacing being as sh*te as AC.  i.e. story and genius sacrificed for graphics.

Most of their remakes have been simple upgrades.  FF7 would need a full make over.  Maybe I am wrong (it has happened one or twice), maybe they will surprise me.  But I'd rather this bunch don't bother.  I'd rather nothing than a major disappointment.

For now.. luckily Qhimm's rules.
« Last Edit: 2011-12-14 22:51:10 by DLPB »

xLostWingx

  • *
  • Posts: 801
  • No Comment
    • View Profile
    • FFVII Lost Wing Mod/Hacks
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #10 on: 2011-12-14 23:47:26 »
Like FFX-2 and Advent children and Dirge of Retcons? 

Hey X-2 was just as good as FFX!  :P Not very.

I agree that Enix shouldn't be feeling up good ol' Square games with their grimy paws though.

Jaitsu

  • *
  • Posts: 1067
  • DON'T FWOOSH ME BRO
    • View Profile
    • Jaitsu Studios
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #11 on: 2011-12-15 16:29:27 »
although i'd kill for an HD release of the Drakengard games...

sedef122003

  • *
  • Posts: 20
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #12 on: 2011-12-18 01:13:07 »
A remake may not be a bad thing, of course the game would be changed and things would be added but I would be interested to see what they would do. Also if this remake were to happen no matter how good it is someone would be unhappy (probably dlpb) as it is different to their beloved ff7, but it doesnt matter as they will still have the game they love

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #13 on: 2011-12-18 01:45:49 »
Difference isn't what I have an issue with.  Crap difference is.  It is possible to make FF7 better, we do it all the time here at qhimm's and if I had an issue with change I would not be the creator of 2 huge mods that change the game, with 1 other not even started.

The problem is that the games these days are getting worse and worse, more and more dumbed down.  FF13 is not even an jRPG anymore, it has been stripped bare of what made it so.  I have seen the trend with FF12,13,spin offs and advent children.  The trend is graphics and nothing else matters.

I would strongly suspect that a remake of VII would end up having no world map, tons of extra cutscenes that bloat the game and ruin the pacing, additional story elements that interfere and retcon, changes to the main gameplay so that it is more to the current generation (i.e. less things to do, and gearing toward fps). 

I did not get into FF7 originally because of graphics or hype or fight scenes that last 20 years.  I did not get into FF7 originally because it had fps-like gameplay.  I got into it because it had a great story, it had a good pace and balance, it had addictive gameplay and minigames and exploration. 

I do not want a remake that is a dumbing down and reduction, masquerading as "improvement" and "innovation".   I do not trust this lot to deliver a game I will like, so I don't want one.  The number of people who told me Advent Children was great is scary, I expect they would love anything that Enix fired out, but I don't.

KItase above is talking out of his arse.  It isn't hard to know what to keep in and leave out at all.  You keep the gameplay and story and cutscenes the same.  You update graphics to be 720p and you make sure translation is better, you add more minigames to Gold Saucer, you add in things that were removed due to time first release, you add in option for difficulty level.  These things enhance a game.

Already they are saying they want to change core things, so no I don't want these retards touching it.

Not make battles hack and slash and non turn based.
Not add in Genesis
Not retcon story elements.
Not remove minigames and sidequests
Not change the music
Not remove world map
Not add in lengthy cutscenes
Not show ridiculous fight scenes in cutscenes.
Not leave broken translation in tact

You stick to what enhances and ADDS to the original, not take away.  I can see it now..  get to reactor 1 "Heads up here they come"  4 minute cutscene with the scorpion stomping about, fight scene realtime hack slash. And that would be me putting it back in the box.
« Last Edit: 2011-12-18 01:56:36 by DLPB »

royalmurder

  • *
  • Posts: 61
    • View Profile
    • Ian Merryweather
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #14 on: 2011-12-18 11:27:18 »
a 4 minute cut scene would be taking the piss... but surely it makes sense for there to be -some- explanation of how that massive ass scorpion got to them? or was even hidden?

I do completely agree with you about Enix though. I was sorely disappointed when they merged with Square, as the only decent Enix game I could find was DQ (which, IMO, is only good because the artwork is by Akira Toriyama)

I have to point out to you though, that Advent Children was awesome. I don't see the validity of your statement that it has no story...

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #15 on: 2011-12-18 16:16:48 »
Both times I was using hyperbole.  It did have a story, a shallow one.  40% of the film was fight sequence and when you see that in a film, you know it is because they are having trouble making a proper story.  The story itself was basic. "There is virus".  Of course, they had to use retcons too, so we have sep back, jenova back, rufus back.  Even more ridiculous to see Cait Sith in action, as if Reeve would use the thing in the first place.

There is little to no character development and if you haven't played FF7 beforehand, the whole of AC is a mystery. Who are these 3 silver haired freaks?  Loz and the rest?  Who are they?  What are their backgrounds?  Where do they fit in?

These things are not answered, merely glossed over with 1 line explanations.  This is story telling at its worst.  Then we have the destruction of suspension of disbelief due to the melding of game play elements and story based elements.  You cannot do that with film.  The same way you can't put snowboarding events collecting balloons-for-points in a film.  Seeing Cloud and Sephiroth fight by performing feats that would kill either of them in seconds is ridiculous.  At 1 point near the start, cloud is shot in the face and only loses his sun glasses.

Cloud is out of character, after FF7 he had changed, he had already developed as a character and reconciled his past and faults.  Now suddenly he is is Mr. Emo.  Not even the main character is right in this film. 

The whole thing was awful.  Let us not forget the absolutely pitiful translation and voice acting job for the English either "Dilly Dally Shilly Shally"  LOL "Does he know?" > "Well, one would think" 

It is broken.  There is hardly a story there.  I could write what you learn in this film on the back of a stamp. Sure, some people liked it (I have no idea how), but as always that does not make up for the numerous flaws, mistakes and poor writing.

I would not have made a sequel to VII because it was a finished story, but of course I am not  a money grabbing organisation.  Let us assume I did make AC, the difference would be that there was a story and character development.  It would be 90% dialogue and 10% fight sequence.  Properly paced.  There would be scenes where people actually sat down and talked, scenes were people joked, laughed, cried.  Scenes where we get to know and care about the characters.  Scenes where we see characters develop and change, scenes where we get logical explanations to questions, and the main theme is not "bad ass sephiroth is back, and there is virus11!!11!"  I also wouldn't have trampled on peoples intelligence by having Rufus (scorched to oblivion in his office) back or retcons whatsoever. 

Retcons like this are done because the writer has no idea how to make a proper self contained, original story.  The minute I saw that Sephiroth and Rufus were back, I knew the story was going to be convoluted and a ridiculous fan service.  In short, I could write a better story than they did in 1 day.  These guys sat down for weeks (I assume) and that story is what they came up with??  Or maybe they just said "right, whip something up, we will shove loads of graphics to it and it will sell" , and they were right.  But that pile of crap won't stand the test of time.

The end.
« Last Edit: 2011-12-18 16:22:38 by DLPB »

Vgr

  • Global moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 2163
  • If it quacks like a duck, it must be a duck
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #16 on: 2011-12-18 16:23:21 »
I liked AC for one reason : There was fighting. I like fighting. Oh, wait, they meant a story to be in that? Rufus was killed 2 years earlier. Sephiroth, while dead, still plays a major role. "Ur ded but were gonna make you play the biggest role in da film caus youve got style lol." Basically what Square (would have) thought when making AC.

sedef122003

  • *
  • Posts: 20
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #17 on: 2011-12-18 18:29:07 »
I never saw the point in a sequel fo ff7, the story always seemed pretty much done. I remember enjoying advent children the first time I watched it purely because I was seeing the blocky lego characters I loved so much in these amazing graphics we were presented with but when you get past that you really notice the flaws like the very basic plot. Advent children seemed like square was creating something just so they could go ¨look what we can do¨ rather than creating a sequel because they thought it was needed

I have to say though that it is unfair to blame all the problems with recent final fantasy games on the merger with enix, while you may not like the dragon quest games people who do like myself still rate the games in the series that have been released since the merger like dq 8 and 9 while games like ff13 doesnt even play like a final fantasy game in my opinion.

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #18 on: 2011-12-18 20:19:07 »
I liked AC for one reason : There was fighting. I like fighting. Oh, wait, they meant a story to be in that? Rufus was killed 2 years earlier. Sephiroth, while dead, still plays a major role. "Ur ded but were gonna make you play the biggest role in da film caus youve got style lol." Basically what Square (would have) thought when making AC.

"how can we have AC without sephiroth"  , well you can have him in flashbacks.  That's how.  Not "Hey!  Looook behind you!"  "where?" "HE'S BEHIND YOU!!!!"

"Hey I know what, if we make this about Cloud v Sephiroth (again) it will sell."

Giullio

  • *
  • Posts: 66
  • Where is the love?
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #19 on: 2011-12-19 11:41:42 »
Bullshit.

Legend Of Zelda Ocarina Of The Time, one of the best RPG's ever made were remade to a new version into Nintendo 3DS. The change? Only the graphics, the game remains the same. And I must say, It's gorgeous, I'm trying everyway to play that. The real thing is: Nintendo makes their fans happy while Square-enix don't.

When Nintendo released Zelda Wind Waker, a lot of fans were unhappy about graphics, so what did Shigeru Myamoto did? He made Twilight Princess, a game with cool graphics and mainly with adult link as a protagonist. And besides, they don't need to do only one remake, if they want they can make a remake exactly with the same things only better graphics and then another game as a sequel. It's a game they can do whatever they want with it...

DLPB_

  • Banned
  • *
  • Posts: 11006
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #20 on: 2011-12-20 15:11:07 »
Commendable of them Giullio but Nintendo DS did not give them a 50GB blu ray and it is not a PS3, nor are Nintendo, Senix.

A remake of FF7, would likely be a bloated mess for the reasons above.  The more power you give someone, the more responsibility they need. 

If you think back to FF9 and even FF12, although they were state of the art graphics at the time, a CD or a DVD would not allow them to do as they pleased.  They had to be much more conservative with how they went about design.  Now, they have a surplus, and they seem to want to fill the game with as much as they can, regardless of whether that is good for gameplay or pacing, or not.

Imho that is the primary reason for these graphic fests we are currently getting.  They can spend less time planning a good game, and can bloat it up with spectacular sequences.  Graphic wise, less is sometimes more.  Pacing and spending your effort and time on gameplay and story instead, is preferable.
« Last Edit: 2011-12-20 15:23:13 by DLPB »

xLostWingx

  • *
  • Posts: 801
  • No Comment
    • View Profile
    • FFVII Lost Wing Mod/Hacks
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #21 on: 2011-12-20 17:20:32 »
So, the problem is that at some point FF built itself a crystallis, and emerged a pop-rpg.  I call that crystallis FFX.  Enix grabbed hold of the newly formed moth (a butterfly is too pretty for this metaphor) and ripped its wings off, and created the abominations we see today.

With my recent exposure to the Suikoden series, I am rapidly restructuring my list of favorite rpgs.  Why?  Because Konami found agood recipe for a game, and for each sequel added a few new spices, or a little less salt and pepper.  I mean, Duels, War Battles, Helmets, Armor, Shields, Runes, massive lists of characters, set in different regions and times in the same world.  If Konami revolutionized this series in order to attract more idiots to give them money, the series would die.  Final Fantasy had the advantage of claiming the best freaking game ever made, and many millions of copies of their games floating around...this just means that FF will take longer to die, or will lost 99% of its former fanbase to replace it with Lady Gaga and Obama fans.

Really...I would have played FF till I die if all the games' systems were variations of FFT, FFVII, FFV, FFVI, FFVIII, and FFIX.  I give FFX credit for being the last addition to the series to consider the former fanbase, but it was also the first to attract all the heretics that walk among us today.  AKA, the end of Final Fantasy.  Had Enix not merged, then maybe Square would have realized the error of their ways, but Enix did come along to hammer the nails into FF's coffin. 

Furzball

  • *
  • Posts: 612
  • Furzball happens...
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #22 on: 2011-12-20 21:01:13 »
My mind just popped through two or three subjects with pop connections with the last post. Let me see if I can retrack myself
-for one, it is a really sad day when bethesda and epic games (any company using unreal engine to make rpg style games) are making better rpg's then the final fantasy series.
-But I think that perhaps Square sailed that boat (being looked at as the top rpg maker) for so long they forgot what it was like to make that first final fantasy. The first one was intended to be the company's last game before they closed up. So they created the best game they possibly could pouring all of their remaining resource into it. Hence they got a good hit and their company got it's legs back. And they did similar with final fantasies up through 9. But 10 and after, they've taken on the policy of not throwing most of their eggs in one basket, so the quality in final fantasy has been lacking since then. I think if they again viewed their final fantasy games as if it were the last games their company would make and that they had to leave their best legacy behind them, the quality would go back up.

and this is where my mind started jumping to other conclusions
-with that maybe I should reconfigure my order of best fantasies in current standards.
-Well so far thats bethesda's oblivion and fallout games(my opinion, probably should get a gamefly account and rent some games. What makes them cool is fans get to delve into the process and use the construction editor tool to make mods to the games.
-Hey what if it were possible to make a game out of just releasing a construction editor.
-Is it possible to create a company within a cloud, p2p, basically online.
-Make a stream like service to download the main of the game and all of it's mods. Search through mods and all that. Have mods be turned on and off/installed through a checklist. Have the program have a backup of the original files that cannot be messed with. etc. etc.

to me, it would be interesting if it were possible to rally game players and people more experienced in modding/game development, into basically creating the whole of a game.(( and of course for a company to make a profit off it  :evil:   ))
Mainly I got this whole idea out of the question "why doesn't square make a development kit and ship it out to fans." and of course there is the thought of directing the people who pick up the kit, to develop the game in a certain way. So yeah, my mind tends to jump around alot during my first cup of coffee.

-Ric-

  • *
  • Posts: 321
  • .
    • View Profile
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #23 on: 2020-04-06 06:03:06 »
When the special kid loses control and bumps 8 year old topics to compliment his own IQ...

Damn, shite, Nomura and his remake, triggering them folks on the spectrum. ASSASSINATE!!!!!

3 days till I can play the damned thing.
« Last Edit: 2020-04-06 06:09:58 by -Ric- »

EQ2Alyza

  • 7th Heaven Crew
  • Global moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 3200
  • Dilly-Dally Shilly-Shally
    • View Profile
    • EQ2Alyza - YouTube Channel
Re: If FFVII were to be remade, things would change
« Reply #24 on: 2020-04-06 07:04:53 »
I wonder if this guy still shares the same opinion....

They haven’t visited the forums in 10 months. This topic is 8 years old. No one cares.