[FF7PC-98/Steam] Multiple mods and Modding Framework-The Reunion [R06f]

[obesebear]

I've been around the US a good bit and can say that I've never heard like it or lump it. 

Well, that's not entirely true. I may have heard Lumpy Space Princess say it on Adventure Time, but that hardly counts

[Bryan244]

I uploaded a video for you guys if you want to see the mod in action before you download it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYkBb_VAd9Q&feature=youtu.be

[DLPB_]

Edit#1:
My earlier post about "Dr" requiring a full stop was correct by the way.  I should've clarified on this further, but I chose the American English option and it did NOT have a period.

It seems the change has been removed from the American option... by accident.  Reinstated.  Not sure how that happened.

Edit#2:
We know for a fact that weapons raise more than just the Attack stat.  Could it be possible to display that somehow (maybe when you're hovering over the item, and in parentheses)?

It's more effort than it's worth. It would mean adding quite a few other stats - the hidden ones - with added code.  And finding the space.  Weapon has done away with hidden bonuses btw   If I ever get round to completing it.

[DLPB_]

The 2 columns for item and summon are abandoned again but this time due to the fact it looks crap in battle.  The distances are too large. So that's that   Dziugo managed to code it though

[Kaldarasha]

Is it possible to code out the overwriting of the attack command by the limit attack? I would like it if we could have it sorted as in ffx, so if you move the cursor to the left the limit command would appear. The right box would need alteration, too. There should be the first command defend and under it the option to change the row. I simply hate that the game force me to use a limit over an physical attack.

[DLPB_]

Like always, it's possible - just a lot of messing about for a small reward.  Count me out   They really should have allowed An attack and limit separation.

[Kaldarasha]

Well I hoped that your new coding hand could  the job. 

[DLPB_]

Well I hoped that your new coding hand could  the job. 

It can certainly be handled, but when you;re doing something the engine doesn't do - it's a lot of work.  Gotta add everything in.  It would be easier to just allow Square button to change between attack / limit. But still a bit of work.

[WatashiWaZero]

I have heard "like it or lump it" in my daily life in the US. It also appears in The American Heritage Dictionary of Idioms, a US publication from American publisher Houghton Mifflin Harcourt.

It's definitely an American English thing as well, like it or lump it

I highly, highly doubt what you're saying.  Like Obesebear, I too have been around the States, and I've never heard it used.  Even if it is used somewhere in the States (God forbid), it is not common enough to justify using it in FF7's dialogue.  If you can prove its usage in any contemporary media, then you have a slight chance of being convincing; otherwise, I would have to disagree completely.

Here's an analogical example:
Gossypol is a word.  It's used in the scientific field.  Can it be said that the word is commonly used for an average adult?  No.

I'm not saying that it's never used.  My point is that an idiom like that has no place in current media; especially games in this era, and especially if this translation is suppose be close to 100% faithful while mimicking how everyday speech is nowadays for each respective character.



Edit:
On a side note... during the flashback, after you head towards Mt. Nibl, you can run back to town when you regain control.  The music doesn't transition properly when you enter town.  It still plays the music as if you are climbing the mountain, but if you choose to rest up at the inn, the music then switches to the town music.  Not sure if this is intended.

[Hyperthesis]

Time for more bug reports? Sure is:

I'm seeing some strange, hyper-exaggerated animations in battle when 60 FPS mode is enabled. First time I noticed this was during Reno/Leno's boss battle in Sector 7. When he goes to run away at the end of the fight, he...well...zooms away actually. Kind of like The Flash. With 60 FPS turned off, his running animation is normal. Cloud's Crime Hazard Limit Break is also affected. With 60 FPS disabled, the animation is normal (he impales the enemy and drives his blade up into the air with one continuous motion). However, with 60 FPS enabled, Cloud impales the enemy and retreats backward, usually off screen, before warping forward again to complete the second half of the animation.

I've been able to reproduce both of these scenarios several times so I know they're not flukes. I'm willing to bet this same bug effects other animations as well. Of course, the easy fix is to simply disable 60 FPS mode, and if I weren't so spoiled by the buttery-smooth battle menu, I'd be okay with that. Otherwise...halp?

There's also another bug regarding disappearing and reappearing battle messages. I can't with confidence say this is tied to the 60 FPS mode, but I've only noticed it when it's enabled. Essentially, when casting a spell, say...Blizzard...its name appears at the top of the screen and then disappears as you'd expect. However, that same battle message then reappears a second later before clearing again. Unlike the previous glitches, I've not been able to reliably reproduce it.

---

In other news, I live in Northeast United States and I've heard "like it or lump it" my whole life. Sure, it's not common, but it is an American colloquialism as much as it is an English one - albeit regional. That being said, I strongly disagree with the notion that because a certain phrase or idiom is not endemic to the entire nation, that it should be stripped from the dialogue. The world of Final Fantasy VII is in fact a world, comprising varied and diverse peoples and cultures. That's why Reeve's parents speak with a Scottish accent. I mean, should DLPB rewrite all their lines simply because most Americans don't say "och, stop it will ye"? No, of course not. Same with Barrett: Most Americans do not talk with such an...urban...vernacular. Should we change his lines too? No. So I'm not sure why everybody is fussing over a Bartender in Kalm saying "like it or lump it." Unless that line is completely out-of-character for that particular individual, it should stay as is.

[DLPB_]

There are numerous issues with 60fps battles.  They will either be fixed or... they won't, sadly.  It's just how it is - given how I've had to limit the speed.  I think dziugo is having a look at things at some point - but if he can't do it - there's no way I can fix it.  The other issue you have is already in the Bug Tracker  it probably affects the title as well as the help text.

On the "like it or lump it"  I agree.  Changing all lines like that to "like it or not"  makes the localization sound flat and dull.

@Watashi

I don't change music with this mod at all or anything like that - so if there is an issue there it's not the fault of Reunion.  It's likely the fault of original game or Aali's "driver".  But it may be worth adding that issue to a separate thread that people can add to.  A lot of these bugs and issues need to be written down.

[Hyperthesis]

The other issue you have is already in the Bug Tracker  it probably affects the title as well as the help text.

My mistake. I did glance at the bug tracker before writing my post, but I apparently failed to realize that "Certain Summons/Magic will cause help bar text to flash" described exactly what I was experiencing. There's no status noted for that particular bug...can I assume it's another "may or may not be fixable" sort of deal?

[DLPB_]

Everything 60fps is either will be or won't be or can't be

[Shasta McNasty]

I've been around the US a good bit and can say that I've never heard like it or lump it. 

I'm with him.  I was born and raised here in the US and I have never heard that phrase in my entire life.

On the "like it or lump it"  I agree.  Changing all lines like that to "like it or not"  makes the localization sound flat and dull.

But changing it to "like it or lump it" makes it sound nonsensical and goofy.  If you're not going to change it to 'like it or not' (which I honestly think would work fine), do you think you could use an equivalent to 'like it or lump it' that would make more sense to an American audience?

[DLPB_]

There doesn't seem to be a concensus here, though.  Even some Americans here are saying they've heard of it. Changing absolutely everything to conform to what everyone has heard of doesn't seem very logical.

Although this phrase may be much more acceptable in British English.

[Hyperthesis]

Shasta McNasty, the American idioms "going cold turkey" and "feeling under the weather" are just as nonsensical and goofy. That's what idioms are: a group of words whose meaning cannot be ascertained by examining the individual words. Almost all idioms are nonsensical and goofy if you really examine them.

Regarding American usage of this idiom, whether you or anyone else here has heard of it is irrelevant. While chiefly British, it can be cited in at least two American dictionaries:

Slang definitions & phrases for like it or lump it

like it or lump it

adverb phrase

Whether or not one wishes: We have to go now, like it or lump it (1833+)

The Dictionary of American Slang, Fourth Edition by Barbara Ann Kipfer, PhD. and Robert L. Chapman, Ph.D.
Copyright (C) 2007 by HarperCollins Publishers.


Idioms and Phrases with like it or lump it

like it or lump it

Also, if you don't like it you can lump it. Whether or not you want to, as in Like it or lump it, we're staying home this summer. The origin of lump in this idiom is unclear; one writer believes it to be a euphemism for stuff it, a not unreasonable conjecture. [ Early 1800s ]

The American Heritage® Idioms Dictionary
Copyright © 2002, 2001, 1995 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company.

If that isn't enough to convince you it's appropriate for Reunion's American English dialogue, I don't know what is.

[Shasta McNasty]

No need to be a dick, Hyperthesis.  Obviously "going cold turkey" and "feeling under the weather" are as ridiculous as "like it or lump" it objectively.  But I meant that "like it or lump it" would sound as ridiculous to our American ear as "going cold turkey" would sound to a British ear, in my opinion.  I have never heard anyone use that idiom in my entire life.

But whatever.  It doesn't really bring down the quality of the translation, it's just a personal annoyance to some of us.  Maybe I'll fix it with Touphscript in my personal copy.

To sum up it's not that big of a deal, so stop making it one.  I'm done trying to sway the author about it anyway.  The only one perpetuating the argument over this right now is you.

[DLPB_]

Nah Going Cold Turkey is fine here   We share a ton of idioms and sayings.

It's likely that "Like it or lump it" is regional to parts of the US and parts of Britain.  But the more people use it, the more common it will become.

[Hyperthesis]

No need to be a dick, Hyperthesis.  Obviously "going cold turkey" and "feeling under the weather" are as ridiculous as "like it or lump" it objectively.  But I meant that "like it or lump it" would sound as ridiculous to our American ear as "going cold turkey" would sound to a British ear, in my opinion.  I have never heard anyone use that idiom in my entire life.

But whatever.  It doesn't really bring down the quality of the translation, it's just a personal annoyance to some of us.  Maybe I'll fix it with Touphscript in my personal copy.

To sum up it's not that big of a deal, so stop making it one.  I'm done trying to sway the author about it anyway.  The only one perpetuating the argument over this right now is you.

Did I touch a nerve, Shasta?

[Hyperthesis]

By the way, if anyone else wants to make this personal and call me a dick because I disagree with your position, by all means have at it. I won't apologize for attempting to present a sound, logically-consistent argument supported by evidence. 

[DLPB_]

There are a few things in every localization that people won't get, I'd wager.  It's not an epidemic at any rate.  Anyway, final word on it - I'll keep an open mind on its inclusion... but for now, it stays. 

[Shasta McNasty]

By the way, if anyone else wants to make this personal and call me a d*ck because I disagree with your position, by all means have at it. I won't apologize for attempting to present a sound, logically-consistent argument supported by evidence. 

That's fine to do, you were just being rude about it.  Knock it off, hair trigger.  Not that big of a deal.

[lionheart82]

Ill just chip in as non US/UK english speaker, ive also never heard of lump it expression and could only get the meaning after reading or not alternative. Though i heard under the weather frase, lump it is strange and awkward sounding with me. But as was mentioned its not worth making a big deal, if it's one tiny phrase in the whole game, just go along with it or use toughscript to adjust it to your liking, like i will for rising blade climbing hazzard disaster.

[Hyperthesis]

That's fine to do, you were just being rude about it.  Knock it off, hair trigger.  Not that big of a deal.

If you'd like send me a PM and point out which part of my post was "rude" - in a way that does not involve name-calling (like you're still doing, by the way) - I'd be more than willing to listen and have a real conversation. Otherwise, drop it. This whole issue is petty and does not belong in this thread.

Ill just chip in as non US/UK english speaker, ive also never heard of lump it expression and could only get the meaning after reading or not alternative. Though i heard under the weather frase, lump it is strange and awkward sounding with me. But as was mentioned its not worth making a big deal, if it's one tiny phrase in the whole game, just go along with it or use toughscript to adjust it to your liking, like i will for rising blade climbing hazzard disaster.

I understand where you are coming from, and I consider this "like it or lump it" business to be lumped. However, I bet 1,000,000 gil that more lines of dialogue will be contested in the near future. With that in mind, it's important we realize idioms and colloquialisms vary considerably depending on which dialect of English one speaks and - perhaps more importantly - where one lives geographically. In my neck of the woods (← another goofy idiom), we call drinking fountains "bubblers." If you live anywhere else in the U.S., this makes no sense, and you'd probably live your entire life without hearing them called that. Likewise, some of the southern States refer to soft drinks as "pop" rather than "soda." Neither one is objectively wrong, but as a northerner, "pop" just sounds awkward.

My position is that expressions such as these shouldn't be discounted simply because they're not in common usage in the region one resides. Quite the contrary: preserving odd-sounding speech really breathes some extra life and culture into otherwise flat, cookie-cutter characters. Just look how much more interesting Reeve's parents are after DLPB restored their Scottish accents. Now imagine running into a host at Gold Saucer that uses the word "bubbler" or an inn-keeper in Niblheim that says "pop." How delightfully foreign-sounding! You certainly wouldn't confuse them with NPCs from Midgar, and I think that's the whole point. While the dialogue should definitely maintain a sense of normalcy, so that it's understood by the greatest number of players possible, there is plenty of room for nuance and eccentricity.

(I'm not seriously suggesting adding "bubbler" or "pop" to the script, by the way, but you know what I mean.)

[lionheart82]

Hmmm you do have a point, cait sith sounds refreshing even after basic rerun, wo reunion beacause touch. Oh and as for money, lemme check my wallet... How bout 50k upfront and the rest in payments?