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Covarr

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #325 on: 2015-08-19 22:30:40 »
That's the right idea. Historically, Square Enix's FF remakes have usually had additional dungeons. This is a much greater in scope remake than those, but new sidequest content would absolutely be in tradition with what they usually do.

StickySock

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #326 on: 2015-08-20 08:01:34 »
Not saying you are wrong here, but the storytelling and characters can be stale, boring, absurd, out of place, etc, at times too. As I've said before gameplay vs story ratio in the game is not well balanced at times (true for all games with story lol, so, shrug).
True... I see your point and really have no way of countering it lol. At the end of the day, the parts of the game cannot be objectively viewed as more integral to the game and make up the "core" of the experience, so debating what aspects are more suited for change is really subjective. The major point I see in favor of the old school fans that are upset about losing ATB is that this is supposed to be a "remake", which should be improving what is already there and not changing any of the fundamental components. So if Square was to do a "remake", they should be balancing the ATB already present in the game, working to make it more engaging, and simultaneously correcting any mistakes made on the storytelling side (such as detracting plot holes). When changing a part of the game such as ATB, instead of improving it, the process should be called a "reboot" or "re-imagining". What I hope is that, if ATB is removed, the reason why Square went with "Remake" is that they are being a faithful to the rest of the game as possible. From the looks of it though, the game (from the trailer) is looking like it might possibly round out the compilation, and tailor the story, gameplay, and the rest of the game to fit more in that universe rather than being faithful to the original (which would be very disappointing for me).

I just personally feel like (possibly irrationally), out of all the ATB/Turn based Final Fantasies, FF7 is probably the one that could most easily be converted to another "battle system" (I hate that term but I'm too dumb to think of something else). Games like FF4, FF5, FF6, FF9, and FF10 (the other games in the series I like and am most familiar with) just would not seem right if they were not turn based or ATB. I don't know quite how to articulate why I do not feel the same for FF7 other than the reasons I previously mentioned. I guess I really feel like the Materia system, it's uniqueness, and how it is central to the plot of the story really drives home the feeling that it stole the show and make the ATB aspect of combat irrelevant to my enjoyment. I don't get the same feeling from say FF9's accessories or FF10's sphere grid, for example. If any of those games were to be remade and not be turn based, I'd definitely be scratching my head.

Another game I am not quite as fond of but could easily be an action RPG is FF12, because the only difference would be making the free running you can already do actually meaningful, and eliminate wait periods for physical attacks.

Kaldarasha

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #327 on: 2015-08-20 08:36:36 »
Quote
Another game I am not quite as fond of but could easily be an action RPG is FF12, because the only difference would be making the free running you can already do actually meaningful, and eliminate wait periods for physical attacks.

Play Dragon Age Origin and Dragon Age 2 and see how terrible this idea is.

StickySock

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #328 on: 2015-08-20 09:41:31 »
Play Dragon Age Origin and Dragon Age 2 and see how terrible this idea is.
I own both but haven't gotten around to playing either. I'm assuming you're saying DAO's combat is essentially FF12 (which I have played), and DA2's combat is the most likely implementation of real time elements.

From reading metacritic reviews (both critics and users), it seems that the most common and severe complaints about DA2 is that it is linear, repetitive (both in terms of activities and in assets and locales that are being constantly recycled), and otherwise "streamlined". The first two complaints have nothing to do with combat, and the "streamlined" (or what seems to be removal of features) is also a direct cause of what appears to be at attempt to cut down on the budget of the game. My suggestion does not necessitate any of those complaints.

Changing positioning to actually matter, that is, that attacks could generally be avoided depending on your position, I would argue would make the gameplay more strategic, as there is another aspect of the combat to consider. Removing the timer for physical attacks on the other hand, might seem like "dumbing down" if the game was not balanced accordingly so that one may not simply whack away on enemies with physical attacks until their health depleted. Neither suggestion requires removing any features.

What I do know is that FF12's combat feels like a shallow attempt at MMO-combat, where there is constant grinding and an emphasis on enemies with overly-large health bars IMO. FF12's combat had only one saving-grace for me, which was the gambit system, which does not necessitate either of the features I suggested changing. The gambit system itself was not balanced well with the rest of the game either, because the simplistic combat and overly-long battles encouraged Gambit setups that basically auto-played the game until the battle was over (if you did it properly you could literally go make a sandwich or watch tv for an hour until the battle was over).

Anything to make FF12's gameplay not so monotous would be a godsend for my opinion on the game, and at the very least an elimination of the wait time on physical attacks would give you something to do while your characters prepared for another summon or spell cast.

If I was to use a similar retort I would say: Play The Witcher and The Witcher 3 and see how great of an idea this is.
« Last Edit: 2015-08-20 09:43:53 by StickySock »

Kaldarasha

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #329 on: 2015-08-20 12:32:23 »
I don't see where FF12's battle system is like The Witcher.
I played The Witcher and The Witcher 2 and they actually only changed the semi action battles to full action. Nevertheless the player has always to hit a button to trigger an attack. I think both battle systems work, but for realism is the full action system better. And you have only to maintain one character.

Anyway Dragon Age was well balanced and has brought the old western RPG genre to this age. So the main reason to play DA2 was to go on with the great experience you got with DA, but for some reasons EA thought more action more sells, so let the player trigger the attack which would normally automatically be played. But there is no tactical advantage for this. Other in TW2 where they rebuild the battle system for a better action experience, instead to slip over a silly pseudo interaction.

olearyf2525

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #330 on: 2015-08-20 19:46:57 »
Mass Effect?
Please NO! I don't want to see Barret and/or Vincent try to flirt with Cloud.

Well you can go on a date with Barret, but that was a joke/ easter egg(y?) thing, and I found it funny. But I agree please Square Enix, no politically correct social just warrior agenda in my games. I don't think they will, Japan's media hasn't been infiltrated to the same extent as ours in America,Europe, etc.

Do you guys think they might go with a Kingdom hearts 2 type battle system except with the addition of Materia? I think that would make the most sense, and if done right it wouldn't be bad, the only bad thing about it is would you only be controlling cloud? That would kind of suck, especially since I'm assuming you'd miss out on using the limits of other party members or maybe you can give them orders like in dragon age origins tactics system? That might actually be neat on PC, but don't see it working with a controller.
« Last Edit: 2015-08-20 19:50:06 by olearyf2525 »

Kaldarasha

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #331 on: 2015-08-20 20:21:55 »
I don't think that Nomura will do that. It will be a more controllable version of the FF13 battle system.
I would love it if they make it like Chrono Trigger.
« Last Edit: 2015-08-21 12:10:52 by Kaldarasha »

hian

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #332 on: 2015-08-21 01:43:06 »
Very dry :)

I think the game needs to grow up.

That means, real physics, real characters.

I know the game is essentially fantasy, but it still needs to be somewhat plausible, especially in today's more adult audience.

This is a horrible sentiment.

Nothing "needs" to do anything when it comes to art and media - Art and media is not made because of needs, it's made because of wants and desires, often the express visions of the artists, not the demands of the people who feel entitled to engage with the product.

Today's audience is no more "adult" than it was back when the original was released, and the ratio of adults vs young adults vs kids playing the remake is not necessarily going to be different from the original.

To say that fantasy needs to be plausible is ridiculous. Fantasy is essentially and necessarily implausible. The only factor important to writing fantasy is consistency.
FF7 is consistently implausible, which makes it consist with itself. The more "realism" you add to it, the more glaring the absurdities of the game becomes, because it's now being inconsistent with what is realistic and what isn't, and it's being so selectively and arbitrarily.

You always have to suspend disbelief or conventional ideas of realism for fantasy to work within a narrative. You want Cloud to stop using swords in combat against people with machine-guns because it's unrealistic? Then why stop there? Why not remove the Buster Sword entirely?
After all, wielding the Buster Sword is physically impossible given Cloud's size.
It doesn't actually matter if Cloud is super-strong etc. because the weight of the blade, and the momentum created by swinging the blade would literally launch Cloud up into the air and send him flying off into the horizon unless it hit a solid object capable of withstanding the blow mid-swing.
So, why does one aspect demand realism but another does not?

I'd also make the argument that the sentiment of wanting games to "grow up" is essentially a childish and immature sentiment.
An adult doesn't feel insecure to the point that they can't engage with or enjoy with whimsical and fantastical narratives.
Case in point, plenty of adults enjoy Pixar and Disney movies.

while Materia would be a genuine scientific product as hinted at in the original game with some sort of electro chemically focused energy.

Where exactly is this hinted at? Sephiroth clearly explains that materia is a natural phenomenon, and not a scientific product.

"Summons" are superfluous and unnecessary and detract from the overall game IMO.

Superfluous in comparison to what? Again, things like these aren't there because they have to be - they're there because someone wanted them to be. The same can be said for absolutely anything in the system. The limit breaks don't have to be there either. Do they objectively add something important to the game-play the summons don't? Not really.
They're just there, because it's fun and interesting.

Also, how do they actually detract from the game? Care to qualify or elaborate?


Likewise the "Weapons" should have been constructed by the Cetra, and not the planet.

Why?

Ultimately what  would like to see is  a story with more depth and credibility. More science, less ridiculousness and real-time combat done correctly. I.e swords are useless unless close up, so cloud should use a gun for the most part unless he employs some sort of shield, i.e mass effect

Then go play a science-fiction game like Mass Effect.

Cloud uses a sword because he's a person who's enhanced by Mako and Jenova cells, who also knows how to use magic using materia. What use is a gun to him, when he can outmaneuver any ordinary human that might try to shoot him with a gun, and spend most of his time fighting huge monsters?

A gun runs out of ammo, and a gun's damage capacity is limited to its core components and ammunition (I.E facing an enemy like Jenova, clearly Cloud's sword will do more damage than a hand-gun will, for instance).
Melee weapons in the FF universe are clearly the better option for most battle scenarios these people face. It's also pretty clear that the vast majority of characters who rely on firearms usually do so because A.) they don't know how to use materias, or B.) are too weak to use melee weapons.
(Barret clearly didn't know how to use materia prior to meeting Cloud, and Vincent carries a gun because he's a former Turk)

Of course, this is post-hoc rationalization on my part. The only reason FF7 features both guns and swords, is because it fantasy, and the creators thought that would be cool. You can justify it though, just as you can make arguments that it doesn't work.
My point here though, is that this is a matter of taste, not of objective quality.

If you don't like that aspect of FF7, then you don't really like FF7 for what it is - and that point my question would be, why should the remake be catering to people like you? You'd be better off just playing Mass Effect.

I don't think that Nomura will do that. It will be a more controllable version of the FF13 battle system.
I would love it it if they make it like Chrono Trigger.

I am hoping for something similar.
On map, no transition entry for a menu-based combat system.

Have the enemies on screen, and the encounters triggered by touch - like Chrono Trigger.
Then, I'd like the rest of it to be more or less like FFX-2, regular ATB, but livened up by having the characters move about a bit,
and perhaps added variations to the attack animations etc. to make the combat seem more fluid and alive.

This way the game would play a lot like the original, but look and feel more up-to-date and probably satisfy younger and new fans as well. It would also mean that you could keep the battle theme, and the victory theme in as well.
After all, if it ends up being like FF15, the soundtrack transitions wouldn't work very well.

Imagine the FF7 battle theme cross-fading in and out constantly as you move in and out of range of enemies on the map, and the victory theme being cut off abruptly if another enemy walks into range just as you defeated the last ones to be in range previously.
Wouldn't work, and they'd likely cut it out, or make new themes entirely, and that would be just another stylistic change to the game that nobody really wants.

DLPB_

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #333 on: 2015-08-21 02:06:57 »
Taking one of your examples: Let's say the Cetra did create the Weapons.  How would that be more realistic?  It's LESS.  The idea is that the Weapons were born of the planet, like a rare mineral, and you can accept that.  The  second you state that the Cetra created them you have left yourself a massive problem:  How does a nomadic and primitive race create such technological wonders?  How?  It just makes your brain grind to a halt, which is what good fiction hopes to avoid.  It also isn't necessary.

Don't get me started on "scientific" explanations to materia. We all saw what happened when that bone head Lucas did that with the Force.  It cripped the whole mythology. 

This is a game.  You cannot strip out absurdities from battle or you would have no battle.  You can strip it out of cutscenes as much as possible.  And they did.
Quote
If you don't like that aspect of FF7, then you don't really like FF7 for what it is - and that point my question would be, why should the remake be catering to people like you? You'd be better off just playing Mass Effect.

Precisely. But the FF7 team don't see it our way, and so it will do its best to be as all-encompassing as it can.
« Last Edit: 2015-08-21 02:11:45 by DLPB »

hian

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #334 on: 2015-08-21 03:22:27 »
Precisely. But the FF7 team don't see it our way, and so it will do its best to be as all-encompassing as it can.

We'll see. As I've said - A lot of the changes that make the game more friendly to the general populace will probably come
about due to financial concerns, more so than fan-concerns.

Even if the entire FF7 remake team though that a true remake is the way to go, as long as the department gauging public
opinions on games, and the financial backers think otherwise they're left with little real choice but to mainstream it.

Going by one Nomura interview, it seems to be the case that several of the people on the team are FF7 conservatives. Too bad that Nomura in the very same interview pretty much said that those opinions won't be the ones holding the most definitional power in the development of the remake.

Fischkopf

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #335 on: 2015-08-24 10:02:10 »
I hope they don't 'orchestrate' the whole soundtrack... The original soundtrack had  a lot of electronic touches, which I know probably have been brought by technological limitations at the time, but still I think the electronic side was such a integral part of the soundtrack, it would be sad to hear everything just 'orchestrated'.

DLPB_

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #336 on: 2015-08-24 16:08:00 »
If they were half decent, they'd offer a "old" and "new"... but there's very little chance of that.  Even if it isn't orchestrated, they'll redo the soundtrack, which will further piss people off.  It did me with FFX (they added option later, but it was much easier to do that with FFX update).

gjoerulv

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #337 on: 2015-08-24 17:24:43 »
They will most likely 'techno', 'pop' and 'rock' up the soundtrack. Victory fanfare with lead guitar and all. Actually I'd rather they keep each tune within its original genre. I don't mind improving the quality, and seeing how these things tends to be butchered I would prefer it if SE kept the soundtrack within its safezone instead of 'j-poping' it up haha. I never heard the FFX remake, thus I cannot comment, but still, if it's one thing I'm somewhat positive of is that they don't fuck up the soundtrack too much. 'Advent Children' it up?

Fischkopf

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #338 on: 2015-08-24 22:06:52 »
They will most likely 'techno', 'pop' and 'rock' up the soundtrack. Victory fanfare with lead guitar and all. Actually I'd rather they keep each tune within its original genre. I don't mind improving the quality, and seeing how these things tends to be butchered I would prefer it if SE kept the soundtrack within its safezone instead of 'j-poping' it up haha.

Oh god I hope they don't add j-pop songs... Not in FF VII.

I wouldn't mind some rock themed tracks, but only where it's appropriate like in "Opressed People" (more reggae than rock, really) the Boss Theme or "Birth of a God".

There some are tracks off course that would benefit from orchestration, like "Shinra Company","Shinra Wages A Full Scale Attack", "Weapon Raid","Hurry Faster","Jenova Absolute".

The more quiet and moodier songs like "Flowers Blooming in the Church", "Desert Wasteland","You Can Hear the Cry of the Planet", "Parochial Town" should be left pretty much unchanged. Just use higher quality instruments but leave the arrangement as it is. And they need to keep that beautiful characteristic E-Piano. They need to have it in every track that had it originally... Hell, if they want a higher quality version of that piano, they can accurately recreate it on most modern software synths, which I even did myself in the free "Synth1" VSTi.

Yes, I'm extremely pedantic with this kind of stuff, this is FF VII we're talking about after all.

hian

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #339 on: 2015-08-25 01:20:39 »
They should just use the instruments that were intended for the tracks to begin with. Yes, the original soundtrack was entirely based on the electric synths of the PSX sound-chip - however, each of the melody lines were composed completely with specific instruments and synths in mind that they didn't have the resources to use or make at the time.
Most of the songs, like the songs in FF8 and FF9, use a combination of orchestral instruments, el-guitars, modern percussion and synth.

Point in case - The boss battle theme obviously employs synths, el-guitars, bass and modern percussion. The battle theme on the other hand employs almost purely orchestral instruments.

If they want to make the soundtrack true to the original, they should just use the original midi tracks, and replace each respective instrument or synth with a high-end VST (or real audio recording) and more modern high-end synths.

That being said though - they're going to have to make some changes due to presentation differences between the new and the old game.
In movies you never have one track just running on repeat in the back-ground with no care for what's actually going on in the scene.
The structure and flow of each pieces is tailored to the structure and flow of each scene. You see this kind of audio-structure in the old FF FMVs already.
Problem with the new game is that essentially any scene is now going to flow much more closely to the PSX era FMVs than the events of the original game.

To illustrate - While in the original characters just stood around and talked to each other rather statically with the camera locked in one position, that's probably not going to be the case anymore. Scenes will be designed to be more cinematic, with angles changing, panning, etc.
and more movement from the characters etc. for dramatic effect.
In that kind of cinematography the old-school set-up and use of the score won't work very well. It will feel very unnatural.

For that reason they're probably going to have to create a lot of rearrangements of the original themes to fit with the new cinematography - meaning they'll probably redo the entire soundtrack.

Just saying.

luksy

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #340 on: 2015-08-25 02:52:36 »
Quote
For that reason they're probably going to have to create a lot of rearrangements of the original themes to fit with the new cinematography

So what you're saying is...dubstep.

hian

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #341 on: 2015-08-25 03:15:45 »
So what you're saying is...dubstep.

No, what I'm saying is that you'll have to restructure the compositions and the arrangements - not necessarily the entire style or the melodies.

However, that's a lot of work and if you're going to go down that route, chances are you'll feel tempted to do more changes - at least that's my experience working with audio production. If I have to rearrange an entire track from the ground up, and I'm going to start chopping it up, fading, cross-fading with other tracks etc. changing the dynamic of a tune to fit a scene - then it's no going to take long before I start thinking "well, maybe this track don't work as well as I though... Maybe I should add some more percussion, or remove a synth and replace it with a guitar" etc.
Suddenly the end product is something else entirely, even if the base melody line(s) is/are the same.
« Last Edit: 2015-08-25 03:18:15 by hian »

luksy

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #342 on: 2015-08-25 04:03:03 »
Sorry I was being sarcastic, I'd rather poke my eardrums out with a hot poker than have another franchise jump on the dub-bandwagon.

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« Reply #343 on: 2015-08-25 15:28:09 »
.
« Last Edit: 2021-10-28 16:10:05 by dkma841 »

DLPB_

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #344 on: 2015-08-25 15:51:51 »
Quote
“Since there’s a possibility that the command battle system of the old days might not work today, we’re thinking hard about what kind of direction we can take it.

Yeah, because the old battle system is just impossible to program these days, isn't it *sarcasm*. "Might not work today" - what nonsense.  It would work very easily, but it wouldn't have the mass appeal your sell-out company now wants. 

It's a real shame that the ff7r didn't come about at same time as FFX for PS2...  it would have been the perfect time and would have maintained its roots. 

gjoerulv

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #345 on: 2015-08-25 22:45:42 »
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“Normally, when you do a remake, it becomes somewhere along the lines of a familiar action RPG, so we’re looking at how we can put out something like Final Fantasy VII while still surprising players.

Is... this translated correctly?? iirc all other FF remakes were made into action RPGs as well. Please, correct me if I'm wrong...

hian

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #346 on: 2015-08-26 04:51:31 »
EDIT, I went and did some fact-checking, so here's the original quote in Japanese and my translation -

Question
(リメイク版FF7について。リメイクしつつハイエンドにするのは相当ハードルが高いと思うが?)

In relation to/on the topic of the remake.
While/in remaking, I think it's safe to say the hurdle is pretty high to make everything high end, right?


北瀬「ビジュアルの方向性は見えてきている。

Kitase :
We can see the visual direction of it/the visual direction it's going to go in


一方でバトルシステムなどは試行錯誤しながら詰めている状態。

On the other hand, things like the battle system are in a state of being put together through trial and error.

当時のコマンドバトルは今は通用しない可能性もあるので、どういう方向に持っていくかに気を遣っている。

Because there is a possibility that the command battles of back then (in the original) won't be popular/won't resonate/carry through (with people) now, we're concerned about what direction to take it (the remake) in.
 
普通にリメイクすると、どこかで見たようなアクションRPGになってしまうので、
いかにFF7らしさを出しながら驚きのあるものにするか、を追い求めていく


If we [just remake it/remake it ordinarily/make a common remake] it'll just end up like [some typical action RPG/like an action RPG you've seen somewhere before],
so we're pursuing how to bring out the feeling of (the original) FF7 whilst also making it something that contains surprises.


開発度などは聞かないでください(笑)」

Please don't ask (anymore) about the direction of the development (laugh/smile)

So this is how I interpret this -

He is not saying they aren't doing a menu-based combat system, or that it won't work - He is saying that there is a possibility that a menu-based system won't be well-received anymore, and that this a concern they're thinking about at the moment.
He's qualifying this by saying that despite this, the primary concern for the development is to keep the feeling of the original, whilst adding something new and fresh that can surprise people.
He does not want it to become just another action RPG - He's specifically saying that if they were to simply "remake it", most likely meaning if they were to just follow conventional design trends etc. it would end up like just another typical action RPG, and the "natteshimau" verb-ending at the end of that statement denotes that that's not something he considers to be positive or desires.

So from this what we can gather is -
A.) they've decided the visual direction of the game, and the general design, but not on the specific game-play mechanics, such as how to do the battles, so they're slowly trying different variants at the moment to find one that satisfy their criteria for what a good FF7 battle system should be (which he then goes on to state)
B.) they want to change up the battle system to make it a new and surprising experience, but they don't want it to turn into your average action RPG
C.) they might opt out of the command system based on popular sentiments.

That's it.

Everything after this is now outdated. I am not going to edit it out, because that would be kinda dishonest, so here's me jumping to conclusion based on bad information. Enjoy. (really though, I should know better than to accept random translations on the internet by now. Even amongst journalists, most are just bad at translating Japanese. Not because they don't know the language, but because they're knowledge is mostly theoretical, and they don't enough enough experience with the natural use of the language.)

Yeah, because the old battle system is just impossible to program these days, isn't it *sarcasm*. "Might not work today" - what nonsense.  It would work very easily, but it wouldn't have the mass appeal your sell-out company now wants. 

It's a real shame that the ff7r didn't come about at same time as FFX for PS2...  it would have been the perfect time and would have maintained its roots.

I can't believe Kitase is saying BS like that when his company's previous numbered FF title (FF13) had a menu-based fighting system, and when one of their best-ranking and best-selling RPG franchises at the moment, the Bravely series, has menu-based combat.

I can't believe he is saying that as they relaunch the original FF7 on new platforms constantly, and it being the best-selling FF game in the entire franchise, which still sells today despite it being so "dated" its system "no longer works" apparently.

I can't believe he is saying this when Japanese companies are still producing several of RPGs for next-gen consoles, like the Persona series, the Atelier series with menu-based battle systems.

It's BS plain and simple. Kitase, I am sorry to say that despite being a long-time producer of video games, you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. You're out of touch with the fan-base, judging by almost every single poll and comment I've seen on the topic of the remake, you're also out of touch with the industry and the very genre that the game you're now producing original came from. That's disgraceful to say the least.

Is... this translated correctly?? iirc all other FF remakes were made into action RPGs as well. Please, correct me if I'm wrong...

Every FF remake I've ever seen was a menu-based game (FF3-4 most notably among them), as has every other RPG remake I've ever seen (granted they are few and far between - the Wild Arms 1 remake though is a good example though).

Kitase is pulling things straight out of his ass. Maybe he's grown senile?


Seriously though - this is so hilariously bad it's giving me a headache. I am this far from sitting down and recording a lengthy rant in Japanese directed at Nomura and Kitase, and sending the link to the SE members twitter, or writing a letter and sending directly to the HQ.
Probably won't have an impact but at least when the remake turns into a turd completely butchering anything and everything that made the original a good game, I can send another letter/video and go "ファンたちの言う事無視して、FF7のオリジナルは何でいいゲームとして思われた理由がか分からんのにリメイクしたらこうなるって言っただろう!ざまあみろ!”
« Last Edit: 2015-08-26 05:57:02 by hian »

Kefka

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #347 on: 2015-08-26 08:37:20 »
Wow, I can't believe I didn't hear the news of a REAL FF7 remake until just this week! (And then it took me a while to read this entire thread, lol). Anyway, I'm afraid I have to concur with those who are sceptical or even anxious about SquareEnix screwing this up big time. Their latest games are just proof that they simply don't know how to make good RPGs anymore. Most of it has already been said in this thread multiple times, e.g. the abandonement of the classical world map, the number of towns, NPCs, and sidequests continuously shrinking from game to game, ability systems getting simpler and leaving less room for customization (the crystarium, ugh!), and so on...

Funny thing is, instead of thinking about  the things I'd like to see, I always come up with a list of what I absolutely DON'T wish for in the remake. Here's my top 5 absolute no-nos for an FF7 remake (which would give me nightmares if implemented):

1.) Dropping the world map. I didn't like that approach in FF10 and FF12, and FF13 was the horror. When the world map is not there, something is missing. In fact, whether I buy this game or not will heavily depend on the existence of a world map. On top of that, so much important stuff AND sidequests in FF7 happen on the world map, so I simply can't imagine the game working properly without it. This is basically a make-or-break factor for me.

2.) Having only one controllabe party member in battle. What I always liked most about RPGs was the "party feeling" they provided, and that comes from being able to command multiple characters at once. The approaches taken in FF13 (and now apparently FF15 as well) are an absolute worst-case scenario to me. I sincerely hope that when Kitase and Nomura talk about preserving the feeling of the original, they mean having a fully controllable party. Together with the existence of a world map, this will be another make-or-break factor for me.

3.) Changing the story (that includes both cutting content due to laziness/convenience, or adding stuff from the mind-bendingly stupid compilation)

4.) Advent Children-like character design. They've always looked strange to me, so... unfamiliar. I've always preferred the anmie-style of the original, and my ideal characters for a remake would be those that are seen in the FMVs of the original, only in HD.

5.) Keeping all the funny scenes. Some of them have already been mentioned here, so I'm not going to repeat them. I know this will be very hard or even impossible when opting for a realistic graphics style, but it's scenes like these that give a game a "heart". And if realism means that funny and humorous scenes can't be made anymore because they would seem absurd, then they shouldn't choose a realistic character style to begin with.

@hian: yeah, you really should write them a rant letter telling them how to do it right. I would if I knew any japanese. Or maybe, we could start an online petition for the stuff we want and absolutely DON'T want to see in the remake. Do you think it's too late for that already? At least then, when the game still gets messed up, we can at least say that we tried.

hian

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #348 on: 2015-08-26 14:54:02 »
@hian: yeah, you really should write them a rant letter telling them how to do it right. I would if I knew any japanese. Or maybe, we could start an online petition for the stuff we want and absolutely DON'T want to see in the remake. Do you think it's too late for that already? At least then, when the game still gets messed up, we can at least say that we tried.

They still haven't started to select for game-play systems, just concept testing, so I wouldn't say it's too late to voice one's opinion.
Whether it is likely to have an effect is another tale entirely.

At the end of the day, I don't really think Nomura and Co are much open to suggestions. First, they're getting on in their years, and people at that age tend to be more stubborn in their ways than young people. Secondly, they've obviously already secluded themselves from fans, because they're already flirting with ideas that both the majority of western and Japanese fans alike, vocally object to all over the internet.
Finally, Nomura has said some pretty disturbing things about how it's important to not be too tied down to the original, and that he doesn't like the concept of JRPGs etc.

However, I am considering giving this a go.
If there are others here who thinks this is worth a try, and have some words they'd like included feel free to chip in. I'll write a script over the weekend, and then I'll decided whether to deliver it in writing or as a video.
If it doesn't pan out, I'll at least get to make a follow up saying "I told you so - you guys should be flogged. kthnxbai"

dkma841

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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake is HAPPENING!
« Reply #349 on: 2015-08-26 15:55:59 »
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« Last Edit: 2021-10-28 16:09:50 by dkma841 »