Author Topic: [FF7PC-98] The Reunion (OLD THREAD, SAVED FOR POSTERITY) (Read 1265478 times)

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1875 on:** 2013-08-05 19:22:50 »

Hext is only the future for others who want to use it. I've gone back to file editing for Reunion, although hext is used for small edits like cheats.

Template · « **Reply #1876 on:** 2013-08-05 19:31:48 »

Quote from: DLPB on 2013-08-05 19:22:50

Hext is only the future for prob foreign installs or others who want to use it. I've gone back to file editing for Reunion, although hext is used for small edits like cheats.

There is interest in using Hext for injecting changes to game files without changing the actual file (well, obviously, that's what it does). I'm sure you guys can imagine all the possibilities this invention opens up as far as trying out different mods on the fly. Say mods that are normally very difficult to combine or uninstall or swap. I can't claim to have thought of that, though, and perhaps the scope of that implementation is not practical.

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1877 on:** 2013-08-05 19:47:30 »

Oh no, a lot of that is true.... you can replicate MO with hext without having to change a file for the most part... there were a few things doing it this way that ended up being harder, but most people wouldnt run into those issues. It definitely helps with smaller projects totally

Template · « **Reply #1878 on:** 2013-08-06 10:27:14 »

Would it be OK to use any of your personal stuff from the modfolder after MO install for 7thHeaven .iro options, Dan? I think at least some of it is Felix's? I sent out this dumb form letter to like 60 people asking for similar permission for .iro conversion and mirroring on 7thHeaven subscription... but I forgot to put a link to Iros's 7thHeaven thread and it doesn't say WHAT mod it is I'm asking permission for. Mostly everyone seems fine with it but couple people are kinda not sure what I'm asking. I think Felix was on the carbon copy list, but I'm not positive I'm talking about the right Felix

I was hoping to set it up so that I can kind of emulate bootleg40 with some new stuff added all through 7thHeaven (all options totally configurable but easily uninstallable and swappable), such that all users subscribed can do the same. I don't think .exe mods will fly so proper MO is probably out but I can include pretty much anything else from any ff7 file or from the modpath the way Iros has it set it up. So I was thinking, the maps, the nice alternate credits, and I'm forgetting something. No sweat if you'd rather me keep them off the list, though. Just wanted to try to include as much as I could. Anyway people are going to install MO outside of 7thHeaven, of course. It's not that they wont be compatible. And for all I know 7thHeaven will do things to the exe, too.

Here's a copy of the silly form letter. Sorry if I come off snooty. I was a little drunk.

Quote

Hello,
I am requesting permission to repack your mod for Final Fantasy VII, available on qhimm.com, in .iro file format for use with the newly developed mod-manager, 7thHeaven, written by Iros. If permission is given, your mod would become available on a download mirror that works through the modmanager. Credit to you and links to your original release page on qhimm.com will always be included, as well as a preview screenshot and some info on the mod itself. If you update your mod, the database must be updated as well, allowing 7thHeaven to automatically alert users of new versions of your mod when they become available.

This is a form letter--I have many many developers to attempt to contact. One downside to the .iro format is that it does not leave the authors' readme files intact, if they included any. In the future, this issue may be addressed. Unfortunately, for this project to work well, as many of the qhimm.com sanctioned mods as possible must be ported. Because of this, I have made the decision to treat a non-response to this request as tacit permission. This also could mean that by the time you read this, your mod may have already been converted to an .iro file and put on the database. If this is undesirable for any reason, please let me know and I will be happy to remove it at your request. To save you time, you are invited to ignore this letter completely if you wish to give permission. Of course, if you have any special requests or instructions, by all means reply.

Thanks very much for your time,
-Template

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1879 on:** 2013-08-06 12:33:09 »

I don't mind anyone using our work, as long as credit is given in the mod

knightsoftheround · « **Reply #1880 on:** 2013-08-07 22:04:47 »

I'd quote both Clever and Template but that feels like too much trouble right now. XD

So yeah, seems like you'll be good to go with buying the cheaper 'new' versions and converting them with a program! I would have never realized that on my own!

EDIT: UH, I LOST TRACK OF WHAT PAGE THE CONVO WAS ON. This might be a little non-sequitor because of it, sorry. <_<

Template · « **Reply #1881 on:** 2013-08-08 06:48:51 »

I know we briefly touched on this, and you said for sure the 2012 flevels conflict with current ToughScript. Does that trickle down to Menu Overhaul on a 2012 flevel? I saw only 1 unexpected error doing that--I am familiar with it from trying to use ToughScript to translate a German flevel to English. It is in blackbgb. I wonder if it is harmless... Blackbgb just doesn't sound harmless. Is that a transition screen for the Midgar motorcycle escape? It would mean Game Converter is slightly incompatible with Menu Overhaul if it weren't a harmless error. And I haven't heard anything about crashes there... I just wanted to run it by you if you have a minute.

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1882 on:** 2013-08-08 12:43:53 »

MO won't work on a 2012 flevel at all

Not at the present time, due to ts. Even if that map was passed, it is likely other problems will exist. So best to wait for Luksy to fix up his program.

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1883 on:** 2013-08-08 14:55:53 »

This dialogue has proved annoying in all 3 revisions, but now it sounds good in game. I've tried to convey the point of the scene.. that Jessie is talking to herself (while being distracted by her work on the computer) and then realises Cloud is nearby. The scene is destroyed in the original translation.

Old:
Jessie
“Money…”{NEW}
“Oh my.
   It must have been for a lot of it.”{NEW}
“Sure!
   Well, what the hell? It's a verbal agreement.
   Now let me figure this out.”

“Oh stop it, {CLOUD}!
   Did you hear me?”

New:
Jessie
“(Money…)”{NEW}
“Argh,this is impossible.
(…Well,a lot was
promised,after all.)”{NEW}
“(Yeah,definitely!
It was an agreement.)
Now,time to figure this out…”

Jessie
(Oh no,it's Cloud!
I think he heard me…)

Template · « **Reply #1884 on:** 2013-08-09 09:14:56 »

Scenes like that, where they just completely garbled the original script, are why I am most looking forward to the Retranslation. That is the kind of stuff people just forget about because it made no sense. Jessie is one of my favorite characters in the game. A hopelessly in-love martyr. In a video game. The depth of details like that in the story make up for some of the giant loose ends, but the retranslation is clearly going to make the game more coherent in just about every scene.

I wanted to ask about compatibility issues again. I'm spending a great deal of effort all of a sudden putting together this catalog of mods for 7thHeaven. The only file we really need be concerned about is the flevel, right? People aren't going to be messing with the exe anyway, if they are going to use MenuOverhaul. Certainly a mod like Ultima Espio's Aerith revival, which makes a lot of changes to the flevel, including script changes, hasn't been incompatible with Menu Overhaul this entire time? I can't help but wonder what goes wrong with bootleg's mode changer when things go wrong. Could it be related to Menu Overhaul and flevel incompatibilities with certain modes? I really want to try to be ready with 7thHeaven iros that are 100% compatible with the Reunion when it happens and I will be implementing a mode switcher type mod for 7thHeaven when I can get the time and headspace to work it out.

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1885 on:** 2013-08-09 09:43:10 »

The Menu Overhaul should be compatible with every change to flevel

Changes to flevel are fine for MO. The translation project won't be compatible but that's all. If something isn't working with MO it is probably either a bad flevel, or a 2012/13 flevel being used. All MO does for flevel is decode/encode So as long as ts can do that on the flevel, it should work. Unless I missed something. You should run a decode encode on the flevel from its data folder using ts, and see if it gets stuck.

Template · « **Reply #1886 on:** 2013-08-09 10:30:41 »

Quote from: DLPB on 2013-08-09 09:43:10

The Menu Overhaul should be compatible with every change to flevel Changes to flevel are fine for MO. The translation project won't be compatible but that's all. If something isn't working with MO it is probably either a bad flevel, or a 2012/13 flevel being used. All MO does for flevel is decode/encode So as long as ts can do that on the flevel, it should work. Unless I missed something. You should run a decode encode on the flevel from its data folder using ts, and see if it gets stuck.

Awesome! This clears some stuff up for me.

We need to be careful people are using original flevels, so perhaps GameConverter will be changed to reflect that. Other files can be just copied over during conversion. Let me ask you this though: with GameConverter in mind: ToughScript NEEDS an original 1998 English Flevel to start from (it can be altered), and then it can translate to the other languages, right? (including Italian which we have a script for and maybe some others eventually maybe--Que saudade!) But the retranslation WONT be compatible with any mod that changes the script? Like Aeris revival needs to be installed without the retranslation? If that's true that's a shame. I wonder if I can fix that somehow... like next year or something lol.

Kaldarasha · « **Reply #1887 on:** 2013-08-09 11:00:14 »

7thHeaven does not replace the flevel, 7thHeaven will more patch it every time the game is started and loads everything in memory. So every changes the Reunion will make to the flevel, will be overwritten through a flevel which is loaded by 7thHeaven. In other words a 'flevel.iro'-mod isn't compatible with the with the retaliations part of the Reunion.

@Template
TS should work with any flevel.lgp as long it has no bad entries produced by old unlit programs. That means, that the retaliation should work on a flevel with modified scripts as well. As long the text order isn't messed up...

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1888 on:** 2013-08-09 11:00:28 »

ts is compatible with ANY change to 1998 flevel as long as the TEXT entries remain the same. The text can change but the entries have to be the same. If it detects a difference in the text number, it will skip that map

You wouldnt want to install translation on aerith revival or vice versa because the text would be changed.

Template · « **Reply #1889 on:** 2013-08-09 11:08:33 »

So Aeris Revival should still work with Retranslation? lol. I think I'm a specific sort of daft, you know? Sometimes I can make big leaps in logic and surprise you, but usually I need things spelled out pretty simple.

I'm looking at GJoe's Hardcore, it doesn't mess with the text, so it's fine for the retranslation. But I'm really unsure about Aeris revival, and it's really a favorite mod of mine so I just want to be sure I get it right when I go live. You'd think if there were a problem, PitBrat would have already addressed it, but retranslation was a preview on boot40 so I'm not sure.

BTW: Did calling it the Retranslation go away? ~~It may not be a word in the dictionary~~ but making up words is fine with me. ^{I like making up words, but retranslation is legit}

Edit: aha you anticipated my daftness and answered my question. Thanks for spending the time, Dan. I have the option to put a disclaimer on the "flevel.iro" mode switcher, whatever I end up with, for the config of Aeris revival and make it clear not to put it with the retranslation. Part of the beauty there, is that even if people mess it up, they can fix it in 2 seconds flat, as long as the base install underneath 7thHeaven is sound. Combined with the magical MO uninstaller this is going to take some of the pressure off of bootleg reinstalls. It's cool because PitBrat is in on the process and so whatever comes in the future (who knows) will be sort of orchestrated with compatibility in mind.

Hellbringer616 · « **Reply #1890 on:** 2013-08-09 13:19:55 »

Quick question, I know Kaldarasha has been working on a mod that allows clouds field models to change with the weapon he has equipped at the time. Will this be compatible? Because i think that feature would really tie a nice pretty bow on FF7 once completed

Kaldarasha · « **Reply #1891 on:** 2013-08-09 13:40:16 »

Quote from: Hellbringer616 on 2013-08-09 13:19:55

Quick question, I know Kaldarasha has been working on a mod that allows clouds field models to change with the weapon he has equipped at the time. Will this be compatible? Because i think that feature would really tie a nice pretty bow on FF7 once completed

I have no doubts that it will.

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1892 on:** 2013-08-09 16:56:04 »

Also, retranslation is a word:

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/retranslation

I use both... beacause is a retranslation.. and I'm better off using both in the description so people know what it is.,

Template · « **Reply #1893 on:** 2013-08-09 20:51:06 »

Oh good, I couldn't see why anyone wouldn't want to call it that. I just assumed it was a made up term to go along with beacause after seeing a post somewhere about how someone supposedly "refused" to say retranslation. Now they seem extra silly. I just figured you were being punny but it's a completely logical word, and it's the title I prefer to use for that project.

knightsoftheround · « **Reply #1894 on:** 2013-08-09 22:51:16 »

I get not liking words, Template. I really hate slid (past tense of slide). No, I can't explain it, it just bugs me, and I try to avoid using it but it doesn't really have any good synonyms.

@Hellbringer - If I recall correctly, model updates are a part of the greater Reunion project! I agree on the pretty bow thing, though!

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1895 on:** 2013-08-14 01:32:39 »

An example of some of the fun me and Luksy have in email.. questions related to things that still sound dodgy.

Here's one:

Quote

mds7_w1

“You come back this way
tomorrow,when you've had
a wash. I gots to set some <<
stuff up.”

Dan: Is this again meant as an insult? Not literally have a wash? if so
how would you phrase it?

Luksy: He's telling cloud to change his attitude, so maybe something like "Come back tomorrow when you've dropped the attitude"

knightsoftheround · « **Reply #1896 on:** 2013-08-15 11:07:44 »

'After you've cleaned up your attitude' might be a good balance between the original slang and the intended meaning, as well. I don't know what kind of character limits you're under on the dialogue boxes (the bane of ALL localizers is character limits I've come to appreciate/understand).

DLPB_ · « **Reply #1897 on:** 2013-08-15 20:18:29 »

Dialogue boxes can be pretty large in VII... you are never gonna run out realistically.

Salk · « **Reply #1898 on:** 2013-08-16 04:32:51 »

Quote from: mugenginga on 2013-08-15 11:07:44

'After you've cleaned up your attitude'

I like Lusky's variant much better.

knightsoftheround · « **Reply #1899 on:** 2013-08-16 08:07:32 »

Quote from: Salk on 2013-08-16 04:32:51

I like Lusky's variant much better.

Honestly, kind of so do I. XD Maybe not much, but...

I was going for a balance, but Luksy's seems more like something a casual speaker would say rather than a potentially snooty intellectual - and given the rest of the dialogue the person is definitely the former.

PS - Sorry if I caused a bit of a derailment with this on the overall topic, though!