Author Topic: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.99994)  (Read 4886771 times)

EliteOne

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11175 on: 2022-01-30 23:57:53 »
I didn't feel that amount was really needed anymore; a lot of the Summon Materia that could have used it in vanilla, for instance KOTR, is 1-star in NT and doesn't require any AP. I went with around the same value for a lot of the Disc 3 bosses. I don't see a reason not to tune this back up though so will do that on the next patch and adjust Emerald Weapon's AP as well.

I just don't feel that extending the length of the fight with more HP is a good way to go for making the fight harder. 1million HP I don't think would be a good idea for NT either as it's not as easy to land the same kind of numbers that you can in vanilla; Emerald had this amount in vanilla and the only practical way to beat it in a timely fashion was to use KOTR or some other consecutive hit attack that could land max damage per hit (otherwise you're there for a very long battle of attrition).

See below.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-03 20:11:41 by EliteOne »

AhBeng2

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11176 on: 2022-01-31 00:12:35 »

Those are the vanilla items, yeah. That's very concerning because if that's giving you the vanilla prizes, it means your Flevel would be vanilla too; it's either not been patched or has been overwritten by another mod. The listed prize text should look like this:

Spoiler: show

10GP = Hi-Potion
20GP = Ether
80GP = Holy Torch
100GP = X-Potion
300GP = Gold Ticket
500GP = ? ? ? ? Bracelet
2000GP = ? ? ? ? Materia
10000GP = ? ? ? ? Weapon
Don't want to exchange


If this text is different in any way, it means the flevel isn't patched or has been overwritten. When you next run the game, try selecting New Game and see if the Game Type selection text box appears; if it instead just goes straight into the opening FMV then that'd be another indicator that it's a vanilla flevel.

By golly, you are right. I turned off the other mods and it is working fine now. I can get the Speed Plus materia and HP Shout now. All five levels in the sub minigame are restored and I should be able to get the 1/35 soldier now. Thanks a lot man.

By the way, regarding Tifa's dialog with Don Corneo at Wutai, is it meant to be switched around in Types A and B? Just wanted to know.

Also, I remember that there is a battle between Tifa and Zangan as part of her Limit Break side quest in NT 1.5. Is it possible to put it in for NT 2.0?

wdx

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.992)
« Reply #11177 on: 2022-01-31 05:38:40 »
Thanks for the reply! Found pretty much everything.
I see there are other optional bosses like a chocobo in the glacier? Is there a list of these extras? Also if there are new post endgame bosses?
Finally, is there no way of getting Could's pre-ultima weapon... weapons outside of the memory?I can't find either the "Iron Giant" nor "Wolfmeister" nor "Soldier 1st" anywhere to get the Ragnarok, any options?

Wolfmeister: can be fought on the train mission think its the 3rd fight.
Solder 1st Class: on the steps leading upto upto hojo fight, possibly at junon as well where the highwind sat after the 'gas chamber' scene.
Iron Giant can be fought: in the northern crater

most optional 'endgame bosses' are listed within the 'intel officer' on the highwind.
exception is the
Spoiler: show
 'the calamity' which you require to do certain steps to unlock. I've listed those steps within the spreadsheet posted above
by the time your able to get the clue for that fight its already too late, however provides a really good excuse to replay so can solve the secrets in subsequent run :)

i will edit this post in a wee bit and list most.  EDITED.

Spoiler: show

Curator at ShinraHQ During the Midgar Raid. (u dont get nothing in 2.0991 now... bug?)


cloud: shinra mansion flashback
barret mt corel. Large Area near the reactor.
Nanaki:  Bugenhagen's observatory revisit the gicave
Yuffie Pagoda 2nd climb then onto the sacred fire cave
Cait Sith - Temple of the anceints revisit.
Great Glacier Log area (feed greens + nuts) nut zeio.
battle square - special battle
Shinra Mansion at nibelheim play tifa's tune. back lefthand side room.
Vincents Cave.

Each of the materia Caves have a new boss.
Yellow Cave - Is unique depending on party leader depends who you fight ;) The Mimic
Red Cave Shinryu & Omega
Blue Cave: Quadrangea
Purple Cave. Fight 6 coloured Hero's

extra stuff
===========

gold saucer: score 90+ points on all snowboarding minigames
win all 5 sub minigames
score +5k points speedsquare. (propeller trick works well)

score 0 points in junon minigame. for key item
morph boss jenova death for sythesiscells  (only place to get it)

weaponsmith: make the masamune

northren crater: unlock 'the calamity'  designed for second play through pahsana green mission.

northren crater: you can get item NewGame+++ via menu buffer to the chest.

additional extra scene/reward if you complete the mod on hard mode with no SP usage.





« Last Edit: 2022-02-02 08:29:40 by wdx »

Silver92

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11178 on: 2022-01-31 15:12:23 »
Thanks for the weapon tip!
I'm not too happy that basically the secret encounter is missable? :'(
Also why Ultima Weapon does so little damage? I thought it was gonna be great then Cloud does 200 dmg per hit LOL am I missing something? I know it's supposed to do more DMG based on Cloud's HP% but same, very small damage even on full HP.
Also, is there any boss that can go through gospel + cosmo memory alternance? Is this just too much ?
« Last Edit: 2022-01-31 15:17:46 by Silver92 »

Tyler Durden

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11179 on: 2022-02-01 05:15:29 »
thank you for this amazing mod, its perfect
« Last Edit: 2022-02-01 05:40:41 by Tyler Durden »

Zikeagez

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.992)
« Reply #11180 on: 2022-02-02 00:53:33 »
Is the boss mentioned in your spoiler specific to Type B? I'm currently running A and do intend to hit up B after... but definitely missed the mark on some of those things if they were available in type A!

Wolfmeister: can be fought on the train mission think its the 3rd fight.
Solder 1st Class: on the steps leading upto upto hojo fight, possibly at junon as well where the highwind sat after the 'gas chamber' scene.
Iron Giant can be fought: in the northern crater

most optional 'endgame bosses' are listed within the 'intel officer' on the highwind.
exception is the
Spoiler: show
 'the calamity' which you require to do certain steps to unlock. I've listed those steps within the spreadsheet posted above
by the time your able to get the clue for that fight its already too late, however provides a really good excuse to replay so can solve the secrets in subsequent run :)

i will edit this post in a wee bit and list most.

chaos447

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11181 on: 2022-02-02 04:53:08 »
This does not work for me. It crashes when I select new game and tells me to go to

https://github.com/julianxhokaxhiu/FFNx/wiki/FAQ

I tried disabling every mod except for NT 2.0 and it still gives me this message.

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11182 on: 2022-02-02 09:27:34 »
By golly, you are right. I turned off the other mods and it is working fine now. I can get the Speed Plus materia and HP Shout now. All five levels in the sub minigame are restored and I should be able to get the 1/35 soldier now. Thanks a lot man.

By the way, regarding Tifa's dialog with Don Corneo at Wutai, is it meant to be switched around in Types A and B? Just wanted to know.

Also, I remember that there is a battle between Tifa and Zangan as part of her Limit Break side quest in NT 1.5. Is it possible to put it in for NT 2.0?

If your flevel was vanilla for a period of time then you may see other issues arise or some stuff may have been missed as a result. It's not really possible to tell what the scale of the damage is though without knowing how long it was like that or what was done in-game during that time. This might be why the dialogue was flipped for your wutai sidequest for instance as the variable flag used to differentiate between Type A and Type B is a repurposed one that is used in vanilla to track one character's affinity for the date scene; in a vanilla flevel, this value would be getting altered in ways the NT flevel isn't really expecting. Hopefully nothing game-breaking occurs.

That sidequest + fight was retired, it won't be going into 2.0.

Thanks for the weapon tip!
I'm not too happy that basically the secret encounter is missable? :'(
Also why Ultima Weapon does so little damage? I thought it was gonna be great then Cloud does 200 dmg per hit LOL am I missing something? I know it's supposed to do more DMG based on Cloud's HP% but same, very small damage even on full HP.
Also, is there any boss that can go through gospel + cosmo memory alternance? Is this just too much ?

I tried it out there against a fairly high defence enemy (Grand Horn):

If I use it on a Cloud that has no strength boosts at all (Lv.57, around 100 strength) then it dealt about 8-900 damage which wasn't a huge amount. It'll likely deal less against enemies with higher defence or if Cloud's level and/or strength is lower.

However, when I buff his strength stat with equipment and Materia to around 220, it started to hit for around 3-4000 damage against the same enemy instead.

As for Gospel and Cosmo being used together, I think Debarrier/Dispel effects should be able to get rid of the Peerless/Invincible status but not a lot of enemies use this from what I recall.

Is the boss mentioned in your spoiler specific to Type B? I'm currently running A and do intend to hit up B after... but definitely missed the mark on some of those things if they were available in type A!


That boss is locked to Type B.

This does not work for me. It crashes when I select new game and tells me to go to

https://github.com/julianxhokaxhiu/FFNx/wiki/FAQ

I tried disabling every mod except for NT 2.0 and it still gives me this message.

If that error appears it means you're using FFNX so first thing I'd try is running the game without mods enabled to test that it's working properly. If you're able to get to, say, the second screen of the game then we can rule out a setup problem with FF7 & FFNX.

AhBeng2

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11183 on: 2022-02-02 09:51:16 »
If your flevel was vanilla for a period of time then you may see other issues arise or some stuff may have been missed as a result. It's not really possible to tell what the scale of the damage is though without knowing how long it was like that or what was done in-game during that time. This might be why the dialogue was flipped for your wutai sidequest for instance as the variable flag used to differentiate between Type A and Type B is a repurposed one that is used in vanilla to track one character's affinity for the date scene; in a vanilla flevel, this value would be getting altered in ways the NT flevel isn't really expecting. Hopefully nothing game-breaking occurs.

That sidequest + fight was retired, it won't be going into 2.0.


All good mate. This mod is fantastic and I will be replaying it several times anyway. So even if I did miss out anything, its not a big deal. Thanks a lot again man.

Btw, do you still accept donations via paypal?

Perfect Zell

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11184 on: 2022-02-02 17:38:31 »
I discovered that Yuffie shows as an NPC on the Chocobo ranch, if you go there before she has joined the party. I was was playing on Type B. Is this intended behavior? Shouldn't she only show up after you have recruited her?

Zikeagez

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11185 on: 2022-02-02 23:08:41 »
So playing through Type A I seem to have somehow missed the Long Range materia. Not sure how I did that but here I am!

The documentation for its location specifies "If missed, place somewhere." Where is this somewhere? haha

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11186 on: 2022-02-03 12:30:49 »
All good mate. This mod is fantastic and I will be replaying it several times anyway. So even if I did miss out anything, its not a big deal. Thanks a lot again man.

Btw, do you still accept donations via paypal?

Yeah, there's a donations link on the first post.

I discovered that Yuffie shows as an NPC on the Chocobo ranch, if you go there before she has joined the party. I was was playing on Type B. Is this intended behavior? Shouldn't she only show up after you have recruited her?

Did you head down there before going into Kalm and concluding the events there? I'll update the conditions there.

So playing through Type A I seem to have somehow missed the Long Range materia. Not sure how I did that but here I am!

The documentation for its location specifies "If missed, place somewhere." Where is this somewhere? haha

The other Long Range is a bit trickier to get; when you've turned in all 3 items to the Kalm Traveller (desert rose from ruby weapon, earth harp from emerald weapon, and the Guidebook) you get an extra bonus of 3 Materia; one of which is Long Range.

Perfect Zell

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11187 on: 2022-02-03 17:31:12 »
Did you head down there before going into Kalm and concluding the events there? I'll update the conditions there.

Yes. I went to the ranch immediately.

AhBeng2

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11188 on: 2022-02-03 19:48:14 »
Yeah, there's a donations link on the first post.


Cool. I will send over a donation soon.

Btw, I tried triggering the battle with the Silver Chocobo at the Great Glacier by feeding it the Zeio nut but the game crashes. This seems to happen (to me at least) only in ver. 2.0993 even without other mods active. I removed ver. 2.0993 and tried again with ver. 2.0991 (with and without other mods active) and there is no problem. I could enter the battle with Chokhmabo in ver. 2.0991.

EliteOne

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11189 on: 2022-02-03 20:10:32 »
I went with around the same value for a lot of the Disc 3 bosses. I don't see a reason not to tune this back up though so will do that on the next patch and adjust Emerald Weapon's AP as well.

1million HP I don't think would be a good idea for NT either as it's not as easy to land the same kind of numbers that you can in vanilla; Emerald had this amount in vanilla and the only practical way to beat it in a timely fashion was to use KOTR or some other consecutive hit attack that could land max damage per hit


okay, i understand you're going to adjust Ruby weapon's AP back, in your next version.


and obviously you said 1 million HP was too high, but what about just making HP higher, for example to 150000 ?

or just making HP higher to 150000, on Hard mode, while leaving it the same on Regular mode ?

i'm only talking about superbosses, like Diamond/Ultima/Emerald weapon.


this would be much appreciated.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-03 20:14:32 by EliteOne »

wdx

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11190 on: 2022-02-04 07:16:29 »
and obviously you said 1 million HP was too high, but what about just making HP higher, for example to 150000 ?
or just making HP higher to 150000, on Hard mode, while leaving it the same on Regular mode ?
i'm only talking about superbosses, like Diamond/Ultima/Emerald weapon.
this would be much appreciated.

bear in mind lvl7 run (with no exp option) for hp values could become an issue. Its possible for you to adjust the HP's of the said superbosses yourself, via the likes of black chocobo :) (would using that application do it in real time at the start of fights) but with ATB wait 1 turn would be all it would take. and very easy to do.

EliteOne

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11191 on: 2022-02-04 08:30:50 »
Its possible for you to adjust the HP's of the said superbosses yourself, via the likes of black chocobo :) (would using that application do it in real time at the start of fights) but with ATB wait 1 turn would be all it would take. and very easy to do.


i don't understand how to do that.

do you know how to edit superboss HP permanently ??


i would like to set the superboss, in Shinra mansion, who uses counters, to 150000 HP and 50000 AP gained.

also, i would like to set Ultima/Emerald/Ruby weapon, to 150000 HP and 50000 AP gained.


if it only makes sense to do this on regular mode, then that's fine.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-04 08:43:58 by EliteOne »

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11192 on: 2022-02-04 09:32:49 »
Yes. I went to the ranch immediately.

I've added conditions there so it'll be sorted as of the next patch, thanks for letting me know.

Cool. I will send over a donation soon.

Btw, I tried triggering the battle with the Silver Chocobo at the Great Glacier by feeding it the Zeio nut but the game crashes. This seems to happen (to me at least) only in ver. 2.0993 even without other mods active. I removed ver. 2.0993 and tried again with ver. 2.0991 (with and without other mods active) and there is no problem. I could enter the battle with Chokhmabo in ver. 2.0991.

Thanks for the donation, much appreciated.

The model files appear to be missing for this enemy as it was using the wrong model files previously; I'll be updating the mod later to add the missing files along with some other things.


okay, i understand you're going to adjust Ruby weapon's AP back, in your next version.


and obviously you said 1 million HP was too high, but what about just making HP higher, for example to 150000 ?

or just making HP higher to 150000, on Hard mode, while leaving it the same on Regular mode ?

i'm only talking about superbosses, like Diamond/Ultima/Emerald weapon.


this would be much appreciated.

I'm not sure why you want the HP set to 150,000 for Ruby and Emerald when before you were asking for an increase to 1million; they currently both have 165,000 so this would decrease their HP rather than increase it. As for Ultimate Weapon, this boss is fought multiple times so increasing its HP would be a bad idea as it would exponentially increase the amount of time needed to trigger the final battle at Cosmo Canyon.

I've increased Ruby Weapon's EXP/Gil/AP to match Emerald Weapon; 50,000 for each where previously Ruby gave 45,000 EXP/Gil and only 4500 AP. I think Emerald was intended to have 5000AP rather than 50,000AP so that it followed the pattern of Exp/Gil/AP given by the other Weapon bosses but given that this is an optional super-boss I think it's maybe better that they have the increased AP.

As for the secret boss in Shinra Mansion, the reason it has those Exp/Gil/AP values is because it matches what it has from the game it came from. The amount of AP it gives is decidedly useless here, but there's plenty of ways to gain AP elsewhere; the North Crater's left-up path has two enemies that were great for AP farming in the vanilla game which have been buffed/modified in NT to better suit this purpose. Magic Pot now takes Ethers instead of Elixirs so they're more farmable (some mods disable the W-Item glitch so I felt this was a good idea to change the item to something more readily available) and the Movers enemy, while rare, has had the AP they give buffed up enormously (4800 AP per encounter; 14,400 AP if a Triple weapon/armour is used).

EliteOne

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11193 on: 2022-02-04 12:39:29 »
I'm not sure why you want the HP set to 150,000 for Ruby and Emerald when before you were asking for an increase to 1million; they currently both have 165,000 so this would decrease their HP rather than increase it.

see below.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-07 17:04:34 by EliteOne »

AhBeng2

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11194 on: 2022-02-04 20:33:31 »

Thanks for the donation, much appreciated.

The model files appear to be missing for this enemy as it was using the wrong model files previously; I'll be updating the mod later to add the missing files along with some other things.


No worries. It is just a token of appreciation for this wonderful mod.

I have a question about the conversation between Cloud and Aeris when the party revisits the Forgotten City. Bugenhagen informs the party that the White Materia is needed to summon Holy. Cloud then turns to Aeris and laments albeit mistakenly that Holy failed to appear because they did not have the White Materia. I can understand that Cloud is ignorant of the fact that the White Materia was all along in Aeris' possession. But, was Aeris herself unaware that she had the White Materia? Or she knew she had it but didn't know its purpose prior to Bugenhagen's revelation to the party at the Forgotten City? It seems rather odd that she did not rebuke Cloud for his incorrect deduction. As a side note, her dialog "A-ha. See, I told you I'd take care of it." at the end is simply hilarious and is totally in line with her goofy character. Good job.

By the way, at the Northern Crater, before Cloud hands over the Black Materia to Sephiroth, he says something along the lines "I'm sorry. Especially to you, Tifa. You have been so good to me. Maybe one day you'll meet the real Cloud." In my opinion, that dialog should be directed to Aeris as well (if she is in the party) since she did previously express her desire to meet the real Cloud. Also, I thought that akin to Tifa, she would try (in futility nonetheless) to persuade Cloud not to hand over the Black Materia to Sephiroth (due to her Cetra lineage) instead of remaining silent throughout.       

One part of the original story that was left unexplained is how did Tifa's mind survive after being drenched by the lifestream when Cloud got lost under similar circumstances? It was speculated that Aeris (after her death) actually guided Tifa in the lifestream; preventing her from getting lost. So, I think that it will be instructive if Aeris plays a more active role (alongside Tifa) in restoring Cloud's memories in the NT mod since she lives (or given the chance to live rather).

Maybe this is something that you can consider should you update the mod and make drastic changes to the story in the future. Cheers.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-04 20:35:31 by AhBeng2 »

Sega Chief

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11195 on: 2022-02-07 16:51:45 »
No worries. It is just a token of appreciation for this wonderful mod.

I have a question about the conversation between Cloud and Aeris when the party revisits the Forgotten City. Bugenhagen informs the party that the White Materia is needed to summon Holy. Cloud then turns to Aeris and laments albeit mistakenly that Holy failed to appear because they did not have the White Materia. I can understand that Cloud is ignorant of the fact that the White Materia was all along in Aeris' possession. But, was Aeris herself unaware that she had the White Materia? Or she knew she had it but didn't know its purpose prior to Bugenhagen's revelation to the party at the Forgotten City? It seems rather odd that she did not rebuke Cloud for his incorrect deduction. As a side note, her dialog "A-ha. See, I told you I'd take care of it." at the end is simply hilarious and is totally in line with her goofy character. Good job.

By the way, at the Northern Crater, before Cloud hands over the Black Materia to Sephiroth, he says something along the lines "I'm sorry. Especially to you, Tifa. You have been so good to me. Maybe one day you'll meet the real Cloud." In my opinion, that dialog should be directed to Aeris as well (if she is in the party) since she did previously express her desire to meet the real Cloud. Also, I thought that akin to Tifa, she would try (in futility nonetheless) to persuade Cloud not to hand over the Black Materia to Sephiroth (due to her Cetra lineage) instead of remaining silent throughout.       

One part of the original story that was left unexplained is how did Tifa's mind survive after being drenched by the lifestream when Cloud got lost under similar circumstances? It was speculated that Aeris (after her death) actually guided Tifa in the lifestream; preventing her from getting lost. So, I think that it will be instructive if Aeris plays a more active role (alongside Tifa) in restoring Cloud's memories in the NT mod since she lives (or given the chance to live rather).

Maybe this is something that you can consider should you update the mod and make drastic changes to the story in the future. Cheers.

On the Holy Materia: Based on just what's in the original game's dialogue, I think it's up for debate if Aeris actually knows what that Materia is or rather what it specifically does. When you first meet her she says that she has a 'useless' Materia that she keeps as a memento from her mother; you can read that a few ways as either she genuinely doesn't know what it does, she's keeping it a secret in case people try to take it, or that it's tongue in cheek and she doesn't believe there'll ever be a need to call for Holy and it's therefore 'useless' in that sense.

What clinches it for me personally is when Cloud 'talks' to her in that dream after the Temple of the Ancients and she doesn't seem 100% sure where she's going or what the end result will be. The game up to that point has also pointed out a few times that Aeris isn't as connected to the Planet as prior Ancients were and she usually has trouble communicating with it clearly.

The OG dialogue is (and bear in mind there's minor differences between PSX and PC release in case this isn't 1:1 what's said on PSX):

Spoiler: show


{AERIS}
“The secret is just up here.”

{AERIS}
“At least it should be.
   …I feel it.
   It feels like I'm being led by something.”


So you could read that as not being aware what the plan will be, which would be very unusual if you were aware that you had a Materia that could call forth something like Holy. She's praying when the player finds her again, so an argument could be made that she is aware of Holy at that point but there's no way to really know for sure based on in-game text.

On the Black Materia handover: In the original builds, Aeris' script group was a copy of another character in most instances and I think I specifically tried to use ones where the character was most inactive (probably Vincent) to cut down on the amount of work needed and avoid adding too much story-wise or altering existing scenes (she was relegated to hanging out with Yuffie and suffering from air-sickness to avoid Highwind scenes; it should still be that way in the 1.5 build I think). I went back and made her more active in the 2.0 build on request, but I guess that scene at the Black Materia hand over wasn't revisited. You're right in that she probably should react in some way so I'll add it to my notes.

On the Lifestream: I don't know actually why Tifa emerges with her mind intact from the Lifestream, maybe it's to do with prolonged exposure? Perhaps in the extended stuff like the ultimania they offer an explanation but I try to go with what's in-game from the original whenever I can. I also think of that section as an important part of their character development so I won't be tampering with it to add Aeris in or stuff like that. I already get enough flak as it is for ruining the story forever and missing the whole point of the plot. It also makes it harder to do low level runs.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-07 16:54:10 by Sega Chief »

EliteOne

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11196 on: 2022-02-07 17:03:56 »
I already get enough flak as it is for ruining the story forever and missing the whole point of the plot. It also makes it harder to do low level runs.


sorry, i apologize.

i have disabilities, so there's difficulty typing correct numbers.

my request was supposed to be Diamond weapon at 165,000 HP, but Emerald/Ruby weapon at 365,000 HP.

i meant to type a " 3 " ,but typed a " 1 " by accident.


in regards to superboss in Shinra mansion, who uses counters, i think that Cloud's Ultima weapon critical hit should be set to 1/3 of the Masamune, and the Masamune critical hit should be set to 1/2, of where it is now.

my reason is that when you fight superboss in Shinra mansion, using the Masamune, its too easy, but too hard without it.


i would really appreciate these changes.

wdx

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11197 on: 2022-02-07 17:56:11 »
my reason is that when you fight superboss in Shinra mansion, using the Masamune, its too easy, but too hard without it.

if finding a particular boss too hard, maybe strategise and rearrange materia to help provide protection vs elements that a particular boss uses. alongside working out the weaknesses. bear in mind not all weakness's are 'weakness' as if an enemy is weak to an element and can absorb that dmg, it would simply absorb double the amount :)  some other bosses may not be weak to the likes of an element however that can do standard dmg, good example is
Spoiler: show
 gravity which works on several bosses  (not with the boss your speaking of thou)
stat/element boosting armour/assessories can make a fight a whole lot easier if using 'correctly'.

another thing to bear in mind the game specifically tells you about is counters, counters can't be countered. physical counters and magical counters vary you can assess which attacks are which element via a few tests to come up with strategies which work. specifically on the boss your speaking of a lot of its counters are based around level being devisable without remainder,

eg lvl4 holy will only hit party members at level 8/12/16/20..... so leveling a character to something not divisable by a lvl based attack would avoid a fair bit and can also make things easier for you. 

an immense part of the fun from this mod for me, was to work out viable strats enabling a 100% run at lowest possible level, whilst having solutions to morph all bosses (inclusive of those which hp too high to sense) :) if a particular materia/weapon/armour setup doesnt work something else will :)

if you nip onto discord and pm me (wdx) I can talk you through how to alter any enemy that your fighting hp level.  much higher HP's usually just drag's on battles, not necessary making them harder but more akin to repeatition. Use X use Y if party member dead revive, rinse repeat.

ps totally agree the Masamune is Very OP.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-07 18:05:02 by wdx »

AhBeng2

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11198 on: 2022-02-07 21:57:19 »
On the Holy Materia: Based on just what's in the original game's dialogue, I think it's up for debate if Aeris actually knows what that Materia is or rather what it specifically does. When you first meet her she says that she has a 'useless' Materia that she keeps as a memento from her mother; you can read that a few ways as either she genuinely doesn't know what it does, she's keeping it a secret in case people try to take it, or that it's tongue in cheek and she doesn't believe there'll ever be a need to call for Holy and it's therefore 'useless' in that sense.

What clinches it for me personally is when Cloud 'talks' to her in that dream after the Temple of the Ancients and she doesn't seem 100% sure where she's going or what the end result will be. The game up to that point has also pointed out a few times that Aeris isn't as connected to the Planet as prior Ancients were and she usually has trouble communicating with it clearly.

The OG dialogue is (and bear in mind there's minor differences between PSX and PC release in case this isn't 1:1 what's said on PSX):

Spoiler: show


{AERIS}
“The secret is just up here.”

{AERIS}
“At least it should be.
   …I feel it.
   It feels like I'm being led by something.”


So you could read that as not being aware what the plan will be, which would be very unusual if you were aware that you had a Materia that could call forth something like Holy. She's praying when the player finds her again, so an argument could be made that she is aware of Holy at that point but there's no way to really know for sure based on in-game text.


I am not familiar with the PC version of the OG dialogue (I bought the steam version to play this mod) but I can verify that in the PSX version, whilst not identical, the dialogue is very similar. Therefore, it has always been my contention that Aeris was somewhat doubtful of her plan to use Holy and its efficacy in stopping Sephiroth. She was also oblivious to the fact that Sephiroth had the power to contain Holy and never had the intention to sacrifice herself. I was curious about your interpretation of her dialogue and why you wrote her lines the way you did. It is interesting to learn that we are on the same page on this matter because many people seem to believe that Aeris was in control all along, she was “aware” that she was going to die and willingly sacrificed herself to save the planet.


On the Black Materia handover: In the original builds, Aeris' script group was a copy of another character in most instances and I think I specifically tried to use ones where the character was most inactive (probably Vincent) to cut down on the amount of work needed and avoid adding too much story-wise or altering existing scenes (she was relegated to hanging out with Yuffie and suffering from air-sickness to avoid Highwind scenes; it should still be that way in the 1.5 build I think). I went back and made her more active in the 2.0 build on request, but I guess that scene at the Black Materia hand over wasn't revisited. You're right in that she probably should react in some way so I'll add it to my notes.


That’s great. Hopefully, any additional dialogue on Aeris’ part in future versions will solidify the overall plot.


On the Lifestream: I don't know actually why Tifa emerges with her mind intact from the Lifestream, maybe it's to do with prolonged exposure? Perhaps in the extended stuff like the ultimania they offer an explanation but I try to go with what's in-game from the original whenever I can. I also think of that section as an important part of their character development so I won't be tampering with it to add Aeris in or stuff like that. I already get enough flak as it is for ruining the story forever and missing the whole point of the plot. It also makes it harder to do low level runs.

Yeah, I don’t think it was ever explained. I never paid any attention to the compilation and supplementary material, so I may be mistaken. I concur that the lifestream sequence is important character development especially for Cloud and Tifa; although in my humble opinion, Aeris’ addition will not dilute that in any way. In fact, by playing a more active role, it enhances her character development since she will be directly meeting the real Cloud (after all that was what she expressed in the Gold Saucer date sequence). But, this is just my view and I don’t think it is in anyway consequential to the overall plot. 

However, I strongly disagree with the view that you have missed the point of the OG by making changes to the story. I am hoping that you don’t take that view seriously because the changes in Type B were very good and I wished that the changes extended beyond the Midgar portion of the story.

demos1085

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Re: [FF7PC-98/Steam] New Threat Mod (v2.0.993)
« Reply #11199 on: 2022-02-07 22:49:12 »
Quote
"One part of the original story that was left unexplained is how did Tifa's mind survive after being drenched by the lifestream when Cloud got lost under similar circumstances? It was speculated that Aeris (after her death) actually guided Tifa in the lifestream; preventing her from getting lost. So, I think that it will be instructive if Aeris plays a more active role (alongside Tifa) in restoring Cloud's memories in the NT mod since she lives (or given the chance to live rather)."

Hi there everyone.

I was lurking around seeing what is new with the mod and AhBeng2' s suggestion made me remember of a post I made here sometime ago, I agreed Tifa and Aerith could work together to repair Cloud's mind, here is how I proposed it could be done:

The “Mental recovery” of Cloud in Mideel, as it happens in the original history this event seems a little too convenient, almost a “Deux Ex Machina”, Tifa has no idea of how to help Cloud recover from his Mako poisoning (in fact nobody in the party has any idea about how to help Cloud), Weapon attacks, the earth cracks open and totally by accident both Cloud and Tifa fall into pure life stream, (Something that up to this point in the history has been presented to be something very bad, leading to dead or permanent insanity) and without any explanation Tifa resist all the negative effects of the life stream, somehow enters Cloud’s mind and helps him put back his memories and personality back together.

I think Aerith could help here, instead of making it a happy accident, it could be an intentional calculated risk, when the party visit Cloud and Tifa in Mideel the second time, (After completing the Corel Train Mission) Aerith would tell Tifa that when she visited the City of the Ancients by herself (Before she were attacked by Sephiroth), she listened the thoughts and memories left behind by the Cetra, and she came to understand the nature of the life stream a little better, due to this knowledge she thinks that maybe it could be possible to enter Cloud’s mind and repair it if the three of them enter the life stream together (Aerith because she could control the life stream to a degree, Cloud because she is the one in need of help, and Tifa because she was present during the Nibelheim incident and has the “Real memories” of that event, memories that are the key to repair Cloud´s persona), at this point Tifa will ask Aerith why she didn’t tell her this sooner, an Aerith will admit that is because she is really afraid of trying, as it’s is a very dangerous method and there is no way to know if it will actually work, if she is unable to keep the life stream in control the three of them will become permanently insane with Mako poisoning, but after searching her feelings she came to the conclusion that she has to try, because she cares too much for Cloud and for Tifa, to just let Cloud remain an empty husk for the rest of his life, Tifa thanks Aerith for being willing to do this for her friends, and together the three, voluntarily submerge themselves in a naturally occurring “Mako Hot spring” in Mideel.

The rest of the event plays out pretty much the same, Tifa manages to repair Cloud s memories and the three friends managed to get out of the Mako bath exhausted but alive and well. The only change to the original progression of the story is that the town of Mideel won´t be destroyed by an earthquake, but I don´t think that is too drastic of a change.

Quote
  I am not familiar with the PC version of the OG dialogue (I bought the steam version to play this mod) but I can verify that in the PSX version, whilst not identical, the dialogue is very similar. Therefore, it has always been my contention that Aeris was somewhat doubtful of her plan to use Holy and its efficacy in stopping Sephiroth. She was also oblivious to the fact that Sephiroth had the power to contain Holy and never had the intention to sacrifice herself. I was curious about your interpretation of her dialogue and why you wrote her lines the way you did. It is interesting to learn that we are on the same page on this matter because many people seem to believe that Aeris was in control all along, she was “aware” that she was going to die and willingly sacrificed herself to save the planet.

I agreed, Aerith was not some all knowing oracle, I think she was just trying to follow the instructions of her ancestors, to the best of her understanding, in fact, I think a good way to develop her character arc, would be she getting sad and distant after nearly getting killed by Sephiroth, not just because the physical pain of her injury but because her faith would be shaken, she followed the wishes of her ancestors, prayed with all her hearth, hoping for a miracle, and all she got for her troubles was a sword to the back, she would feel like she failed to fulfill her duty as a Cetra, or like her ancestors had forsaken her, so she would be understandably depressed, but after viewing the "video" in the waterfall of the City of Ancients, she would understand that her prayers were heard and that there is still hope for everyone, so she would recover her confidence and usual cheerful character.

Well that is it, I just wanted to share my ideas with AhBeng2, since we both seem to have a similar opinion about those plot points.
« Last Edit: 2022-02-07 23:39:04 by demos1085 »