Author Topic: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer  (Read 23843 times)

EQ2Alyza

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Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« on: 2020-03-05 14:11:37 »
The Reunion will not be included in any Qhimm Catalog moving forward.

DLPB (Dan) has made it very publicly clear, through both words and actions, that he does not want it featured anywhere except within his own domains. That means no catalogs, no .iros, no separate threads and no alternative hosting sites. This is not to guarantee people won’t still do it, so I can’t speak on behalf of them. But I can speak for the Qhimm Catalog, and it’s not happening.

With all that said, there are a couple things that need to be addressed for others not familiar with modding FF7 to understand. The most complex mod to ever touch this game is The Reunion, hands down. And unless you have taken the time to crack it open and see for yourself, you will never fathom what it takes to even attempt implementing it into something workable for 7th Heaven.

First off, prior to R06, the method of modding was through an executable installation. It was much easier reverse engineering to pull out parts of it like BEACAUSE or MENU OVERHAUL and begin the attempts to format it (.iro) for 7th Heaven. Parts of it worked well, while others not so much. After the first publish of it in 7th Heaven, it didn’t take long to realize how incompatible it was with basically ever mod there is. The Reunion touches so many aspects of the game files, that it’s almost guaranteed to break at some point throughout the game when a Reunion file finally clashes with the same file of another mod it doesn’t like. The Reunion is still in development and crashes with itself, so let’s combine it with other mods and hope for the best...whoops...

The game crashes...there are hundreds of thousands of game files, so now try thinking about troubleshooting that without the knowledge of knowing what exactly the Reunion is changing. The only way this can happen is if DLPB is working directly in tangent with the other mod author to help build and fuse them together as one. A prime example would be with New Threat, which is constantly asked if compatible with Reunion. The only answer to that is never...not unless DLPB and Sega Chief decide to fuse them into one. The amount of work for that would take years I imagine.

Now secondly, R06 introduced DLPB’s own method for modding FF7, which in conjunction, basically made R06 proprietary to it. It also baked in restrictions for use with 7th Heaven. R06 is proprietary and 7th Heaven restricted...the message should be clear at this point...

It was in past Qhimm Catalogs so why can’t it work now? With much humility, I will admit that it was a mistake, and I’m sorry. Sorry not only to DLPB, but also to the community for leading us to believe we could have everything. We need to stop asking about the Reunion and leave DLPB to his work. Moving on is the only way to set this issue free of its past and create a better future. In fact, we’ve already paved the way for this to happen. MENU OVERHAUL was finally removed in Qhimm Catalog, only to be replaced by Enhanced Stock UI. This was specifically developed by Chrysalis and I, so that the community could have a new menu mod in active development that is capable of working with other mods we love. This is how we need to build this modding community, by earnestly developing and giving something for each other, rather than desiring and taking everything for ourselves.

If anyone asks about The Reunion + 7th Heaven (or other mods), please politely guide them to this post and try to leave it at that. The only way we’re going to work and grow as a community, is by accepting this together for what it truly is.

genesis063

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Re: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« Reply #1 on: 2020-03-11 05:28:45 »
This will be sad for those looking forward to this but that's how it goes sadly.  Also I am currently back at work on mine and trying to work out the kinks while putting in something new about to test and see how it works.

heromic

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Re: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« Reply #2 on: 2021-09-19 17:59:41 »
do you know how can i get at least the ogg files from reunion mod and put on 7th heaven? i really like the 'almost ps1-like' music from there. but i never know how to make things like these :(

orichalcon

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Re: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« Reply #3 on: 2021-09-20 14:54:30 »
do you know how can i get at least the ogg files from reunion mod and put on 7th heaven? i really like the 'almost ps1-like' music from there. but i never know how to make things like these :(

i already told you the answer on reunion's discord, and if you actually read the original post of this thread you posted in - you will see mostly the exact same information that i told you
« Last Edit: 2021-09-20 17:37:31 by -Ori »

mades

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Re: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« Reply #4 on: 2022-05-27 07:32:37 »
I haven't tried your mod yet, since I literally just bought the game from Steam (using my PS3 for my PS 1 discs and finding a monitor was too much of a hassle lol). I looked at some vids, and man, they look awesome in terms of what your team did. When I saw people talk about "Reunion", I was wondering was everyone was talking about until I went on their site. I have no clue what they did. So will definitely use yours, and in terms of remastering the game the way your team did, THAT is was I wanted since forever. Then again, I haven't tried yet, but I can't wait. Probably this weekend or next week.

Spooniest

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Re: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« Reply #5 on: 2022-10-17 06:15:11 »
If you're looking for a way to combine Mr. Burke's work with 7th Heaven, like me, then you've probably happened on this thread which states without equivocation that Mr. Burke has stated explicitly that his work is not to be combined with 7th Heaven in any way.

I'm a darn songwriter myself, so all of this computer lingo/jargon is utterly Greek to me. But, I will say this, that 7th Heaven's graphical mods (particularly those done by Nino to match Nomura's original concept art, and Cosmos FMV which converts the FMVs to properly-proportioned characters) are phenomenal, and if YOU MUST CHOOSE, then I recommend 7th Heaven, with SE's script. At the very least, you are getting the FF7 script that SE has put out, and you can feel confident that, warts and all, this is the FF7 script that SE has published.

Mr. Burke's scriptwork is fantastic, but I can't play with Lego People forever. SE's officially published script gets the message across well enough. Play 7th Heaven with NinoStyle field models and Cosmos FMV. It's even working in 60fps now with analog controls.

7th Heaven has proven itself the superior choice at this point, and it's my personal biased and slanted and skewed opinion that Mr. Burke ought to just swallow his pride and publish his quite excellent script for the open source community, unless his name happens to be Kazushige Nojima, in which case, whatever.

But if his name is not in fact Kazushige Nojima and Daniel Burke as he has said, then publish the damned script. Stubbornness never got anybody anything but bruised spirits.

orichalcon

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Re: Reunion + 7th Heaven - The Final Answer
« Reply #6 on: 2022-10-17 23:22:53 »
If you're looking for a way to combine Mr. Burke's work with 7th Heaven, like me, then you've probably happened on this thread which states without equivocation that Mr. Burke has stated explicitly that his work is not to be combined with 7th Heaven in any way.

I'm a darn songwriter myself, so all of this computer lingo/jargon is utterly Greek to me. But, I will say this, that 7th Heaven's graphical mods (particularly those done by Nino to match Nomura's original concept art, and Cosmos FMV which converts the FMVs to properly-proportioned characters) are phenomenal, and if YOU MUST CHOOSE, then I recommend 7th Heaven, with SE's script. At the very least, you are getting the FF7 script that SE has put out, and you can feel confident that, warts and all, this is the FF7 script that SE has published.

Mr. Burke's scriptwork is fantastic, but I can't play with Lego People forever. SE's officially published script gets the message across well enough. Play 7th Heaven with NinoStyle field models and Cosmos FMV. It's even working in 60fps now with analog controls.

7th Heaven has proven itself the superior choice at this point, and it's my personal biased and slanted and skewed opinion that Mr. Burke ought to just swallow his pride and publish his quite excellent script for the open source community, unless his name happens to be Kazushige Nojima, in which case, whatever.

But if his name is not in fact Kazushige Nojima and Daniel Burke as he has said, then publish the damned script. Stubbornness never got anybody anything but bruised spirits.

This post is completely asinine, like 100%.

First of all, you know damn well that 'Mr. Burke' is banned here.  He can't respond to your post, which forces me to respond in his stead.

Second of all, the graphical mods you listed that would make 7th Heaven superior (Ninostyle models and Cosmos FMV) are almost 100% compatible (except in the case of Cosmos FMV you can't use the interpolated ones) with The Reunion, the analog controls are also not only compatible but built-in to it.

"Mr. Burke's scriptwork is fantastic, but I can't play with Lego People forever."  Then don't... Reunion's Model Overhaul (heavily based on Kaldarasha's ChaOS) happens to have (by far) the least amount of bugs of any model pack other than Nino's chibi pack, or you can just use Nino's or any other model pack with 100% compatibility.

The only mods I can think of that cannot be used with Reunion (which is only atm as we can and will add compatibility later down the road for some of these) are 60fps, HDR, manual rotating battle camera, widescreen mod, Re-Music, ESUI (which was originally ported from a Reunion mod that we abandoned), and a select few minor gameplay mods (like the Jessie Mod). I'm sure I'm missing a couple more, feel free to correct me, but there's not enough missing to alter my point.

Third of all, the two projects do different things - one is a modding platform focused on adding capabilities to modders and make it easier for users, the other is a restoration project.  Your statement of superiority is like saying NyQuil is superior to Pepto Bismol, sure there is some overlap there, but the statement at face value hardly even makes any sense...

Fourth of all, what you ask is not possible at the moment, and even if it was would be completely unfair to us while doing nothing for the modding community.  The Beacause translation started off as script only (which is why there were earlier versions that worked with 7H), but it was quickly discovered that a consistent and quality translation cannot be done that way.  So we adapted the menu, models, model animations, text boxes, field scenes, FMVs, textures, etc to tie in to Beacause so our script would be consistent throughout the game.  If someone ports all that to 7H then all they did was steal the entirety of Beacause and they will still be stuck at square 1 because you can't just go adding work to it without breaking and/or removing our work, which in turn degrades the translation enough that you wouldnt want to use it.

We could just as easily demand from the authors of those mods listed above that they make a version of their mod compatible with The Reunion.  But we dont, because thats shitty... Why would they want to double the amount of time they spent on the mod just to make a LESSER version of their mod so its compatible with something it doesnt fit in with anyway?  The answer is they don't, and neither do we... which is exactly what you are demanding.


TLDR: Let people who actually know what they are talking about do the suggesting/demanding around here.
« Last Edit: 2022-10-18 16:34:20 by orichalcon »