Author Topic: The Dark Knight Rises  (Read 6963 times)

BloodShot

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The Dark Knight Rises
« on: 2012-07-28 04:03:17 »
Anybody see this yet? I saw it today, and before I liked nolans batman films about the same as Tim burton's with michael keaton, but after seeing Rises I've become a nolan fan all the way. I loved almost everything about it, and the plot was great and had me emotionally invested, as well as the fact that it went in directions I totally did not expect.

KaidenJames

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #1 on: 2012-07-28 06:54:56 »
It was a fantastic movie. I honestly didn't think that it would even come close to The Dark Knight, but I was wrong. Tom hardy as Bane was absolutely frightening. I also had doubts with Anne Hathaway as Selena Kyle, but she also did a very good job. I was completely interested in this movie from start to finish. And they maybe left open a new series with Joseph Gordon-Levitt as Robin/Nightwing. I highly recommend to anyone to go see this amazing film!

Mendelevium

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #2 on: 2012-07-28 11:00:49 »
This may contain many spoilers and may cause much hate, but I honestly was extremely disappointed by the Dark Knight rises.

I just couldn't get attached to the motivations involved for many of the characters. The story was lopsided and made very little sense in my eyes. For example the problems that the League of Shadows had been so inclined to eradicate in the first film were dealt with, making the villains involvement in the third film seem somewhat pointless. Sure the suspense was great, but it lacked meaning for me. The acting and directing were amazing as well; but the story felt like it kinda over looked the actions that took place in the second installment of the Dark Knight films.

Bane was frightening and interesting. Cat women was great. But the twists and the big climax were muted on my end; I found myself being disappointed around every bend, because they continually stretched the thin line they were already walking on. I am not sure if I am making any sense. Let me phrase it like this:

In the first film the League of Shadows wanted to destroy Gotham for it was corrupt and a mess politically and was leeching off the bigger system or something of that sort. In the second film with Harvey Dent's death and Batman taking the fall for it so the Dent act would get passed, Gotham's streets were cleaned up, people fell in behind this face that represented what was good for them; in effect getting rid of the problem the League of Shadows had with Gotham in the first place.

Another problem I had with the film were the inconsistencies.  Gotham was on lock down. How did Bruce Wayne make his return? I felt like there were a major few scenes missing. And how did he conveniently find Cat women so easily? Also his scene in the pit was somewhat rushed. I wanted to see him go through hell. I wanted to see him work up to climbing out of hell; to actually rise above the  fire they spoke of so fiercely through the whole film. His experience seemed far too simple and plainly easy.

I have a few other things I disliked about the film, but I can't think of them at the moment given it is four in the morning for me ^_^.

As a film critic my friends hated me when I voiced all this coming out of the movie theater :P
I wonder how you folks will view it. At the moment I feel as if I am the only one who expected more, and disliked it even remotely. :/.
« Last Edit: 2012-07-28 11:03:48 by Mendelevium »

StickySock

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #3 on: 2012-07-28 15:52:19 »
In the first film the League of Shadows wanted to destroy Gotham for it was corrupt and a mess politically and was leeching off the bigger system or something of that sort. In the second film with Harvey Dent's death and Batman taking the fall for it so the Dent act would get passed, Gotham's streets were cleaned up, people fell in behind this face that represented what was good for them; in effect getting rid of the problem the League of Shadows had with Gotham in the first place.
Just because a lot or most of the obvious criminals in Gotham were locked up does not mean that the politically corrupt or better concealed criminals weren't. That is apparent by the corrupted leaders working with Bane in the first place. I doubt that they would be considered good enough for the no tolerance league of shadows.

But even then that is not the motivation behind Bane and Talia, they were to get revenge on Batman, and not to break his body but his soul by showing that he lost. Making him watch everything that he had worked for be destroyed. Talia was the daughter of the original leader of the league of shadows, so she didn't care as much about the ideals of the league of shadows as much as she did care about getting revenge on Batman.
Another problem I had with the film were the inconsistencies.  Gotham was on lock down. How did Bruce Wayne make his return? I felt like there were a major few scenes missing. And how did he conveniently find Cat women so easily?
Bruce Wayne made his return because he is freaking Batman! He is a trained ninja, and all he ever does is sneak around, that's obviously how he got in. Not to mention the new found will from being inside the pit. How does any character in any movie also seem to just "find" the other so easily? It's because they don't want to waste time slowing the plot just to show how he tracked her down. Honestly, i've never seen a movie where we had to literally watch them leave one scene and track down the next character they meet with.
Also his scene in the pit was somewhat rushed. I wanted to see him go through hell. I wanted to see him work up to climbing out of hell; to actually rise above the  fire they spoke of so fiercely through the whole film. His experience seemed far too simple and plainly easy.
He was in the pit for a large chunk of the movie. What did you want them to add, another hour of wallowing in the pit for effect? Ask for it in a director's cut edition but thank God they didn't do that for when I watched it. It was just long enough to get the point across. I don't want to judge but it seems like all these plot points can be filled with just a little bit of imagination. Sometimes it's better for movies to not hit you over the head with answers and just answer the questions yourself.

An actual argument can be made for someone who only watched the movies though, and that's where is joker? I thought they released all the prisoners, even Scarecrow was released, so where was joker? He would obviously want in on the action. I bet they would have made him be more involved in the movie had Heath Ledger not died, but not mentioning him at all didn't seem like 100% the right thing to do.

Edit: On topic, I found the movie to be amazing, way better than I thought it was going to be. The whole trilogy is the epitome of superhero movies in my opinion. They have a sense of semi-reality that is a type of immersion that no other super hero move has ever done. Yeah, it's not 100% realistic but it makes sense for the most part and gives decent explanations even if science can prove some of it wrong. The point is that if you go in and watch the movie just for entertainment and not just trying to criticize it, it is easy to get lost in the plot, characters, drama, and action.
« Last Edit: 2012-07-28 15:55:48 by StickySock »

gjoerulv

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #4 on: 2012-07-28 17:38:46 »
It was epic beyond words. Go see it!

@Mendelevium
(som spoilers)
I don't see how these points necessarily makes a movie bad. I somewhat agree about Wayne's sudden apperance in Gotham, but given his nature I don't find it hard to swallow that he could easily sneak in. At the same time I felt it should be on screen. This alone hardly makes the movie worth citiquing based on inconsistency.

The meaninglessness you hinted towards may easily be experienced this way. Gotham are "saved" why destroy it now? I can see the critiques comming. The bad guys certanly seemed motivated, and extremely dedicated. Based on this the meaninliessness of it fals flat.

Bane was awsome, and I loved the "anticlimatic" way it went towards the end, concerning the villains. Anticlimatic =/= bad.

If it's something I felt is worth critiquing about this movie it is "cat woman". She kinda felt a bit too unseroius for this movie. It didn't annoy me much however.

BloodShot

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #5 on: 2012-07-28 18:22:56 »
I totally disagree about the league of shadows having no reason. The entirety of Gotham's peace was based on a lie, the act, everything. It would be pretty upsetting to find out that a hero that your entire city has been worshipping in the past 8 years turned out to be a psychotic killer who was the exact opposite of what his picture represented. That in itself is corruption, in fact it's quite heavy corruption, even though it's not necessarily bad people - it helps the town yes, but it's all bullshit.

It makes sense that the league of shadows still wouldn't agree with that as it isn't true innocence.

StickySock

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #6 on: 2012-07-28 19:27:42 »
If it's something I felt is worth critiquing about this movie it is "cat woman". She kinda felt a bit too unseroius for this movie. It didn't annoy me much however.
+1

I never really liked Anne Hathaway, but I thought she did a pretty good job as Catwoman. The fight choreography for her was also very well done. That being said, her physique was ridiculous. I wish that she either would have bulked up a little into an athletic build or just found a different actress. In the movie she looked anorexic and malnourished. Although her being around the 100 pound size mark would make her pretty much combatively inept, the choreography went a long way in making it unnoticeable.

Tenko Kuugen

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #7 on: 2012-07-28 22:51:56 »
I'll just refer to CAD for my reaction

excitement - this is gonna be awesome
leads to
annoyance - yeeeeeah, right. please to kill yourself
leads to
denial - oh god this can't be right. I must have gone to the wrong movie
leads to
anger - why for the love of god did I waste my money on this
leads to final stage of
indifference - oh whatever, not like I give two fucks about a franchise that gets rebooted every few years anyway

Mendelevium

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #8 on: 2012-07-29 04:20:47 »
The movie wasn't unpleasing, I just felt it could have been done better. I was disappointed by some of the things that were presented. I enjoyed the movie in the time of watching it, but after time to sit and allow it to process I realized it wasn't this psychological trip I got from the second film, not that I was expecting it to be. I just simply expected more from a Nolan film. I found the film to be a disappointing Bat Man film, but it was a decent action flick with some really nice suspense and plot twists.

And as for the pit scene; I simply wanted more from it, not another hour. Just more impact. It just didn't seem to be the same pit that Bane and Talia were in, by any means. It wasn't hell on earth. It was just bad and gritty.

Also the whole thing with his back being broken seemed kind of hard to believe.
"You have a protruding vertebrae, I'll just hang you on a rope to fix it."

And Bruce Wayne or not it jarred me just seeing him get back from the foreign country. It gave no explanation. I am only asking for some explanation.

As for the Joker note, I agree entirely I missed his face in the movie. Or at least his name being mentioned.

Tekkie.X

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #9 on: 2012-07-29 09:58:09 »
Joker would have most likely gone to Arkham, they only mentioned releasing the people in Blackgate prison though, Scarecrow hasn't really gone out on a killing spree in Nolan's universe so he probably just got thrown in Blackgate and thus his appearance. Arkham doesn't even get a mention I think.

It's also kinda hard to bring the dead back to life, sure a double with some voice lessons could have been used for Joker but people would have just whined endlessly.


I quite enjoyed the movie, I can forgive the Pit scene, its meant to take place over a couple of months, there's probably a load they cut out to help keep the film much shorter that it could have been so it may seem a little disjointed as a result.

Sticky, not sure why you're saying Hathaway looked too thin, looks perfect healthy too me, about average for a woman, I've seen thinner professional athletes, I'm also quite glad there wasn't loads of "fan service" when she's on screen, there's no blatant skin showing, and only a couple off ass shots and only because of how you sit on the Batpod.

The only part that really annoyed me was "Robin" if they'd used the name of one of the real Robins(Dick Grayson, Jason Todd or Tim Drake) as his real name in the "reveal" it wouldn't have been such a let down since that and Talia have been rumoured and spoiled for months, actually had this not been the last of Nolan's Batman films having him be Jason Todd would have been a great idea bringing Red Hood into play in the future.
« Last Edit: 2012-07-29 10:33:57 by DragonNinja »

gjoerulv

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #10 on: 2012-07-29 10:53:38 »
I totally disagree about the league of shadows having no reason. The entirety of Gotham's peace was based on a lie, the act, everything. It would be pretty upsetting to find out that a hero that your entire city has been worshipping in the past 8 years turned out to be a psychotic killer who was the exact opposite of what his picture represented. That in itself is corruption, in fact it's quite heavy corruption, even though it's not necessarily bad people - it helps the town yes, but it's all bullsh*t.

It makes sense that the league of shadows still wouldn't agree with that as it isn't true innocence.

If you refer to me, I don't get the lack of meaning either. I can see people bitching about it though.
What I'm saying is that even if there was no meaning, it would simply fall flat (the meaningless argument) 'cause of how the villains act. There are at the very least satisfaction in the dedication and motivation in the villains actions.

Mendelevium

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #11 on: 2012-07-29 11:01:08 »
I might have been a bit too rough with my statement. I just meant that the linkage between the three movies felt kinda warped. I wished they linked them together better. The motivation felt shaky is all, and it left me not feeling entirely satisfied. I don't mean to offend anyone :P.

obesebear

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #12 on: 2012-07-30 16:02:36 »
I think the third one was probably the weakest of the 3.  However, as the final movie in a trilogy I though it was extremely good.  They paid a lot of homage to Batman Begins (Haven't rewatched the Dark Knight to know if the same is true there), and the ending was just right.  They left only a tiny opening for a sequel, but did so in a way that everyone will be happy with this ending.  The writing was still good, throwing in humorous lines even in the middle of tense scenes.


As for the Joker making an appearance, that's not what the movie was about.  Scarecrow was a weak character in the first film, and thus was brought back briefly in the second just to show that he's not a major character and to give a little continuity.  The Joker was the main villain in the second, and EVERYONE knows about Heath Ledger.  It would be hard to do even a cameo without people either thinking it was tacky or movie goers then expecting him to suddenly have a larger role throughout.


Either way, the plan is now to own all 3 on Blu ray.  Excellent trilogy!

BloodShot

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #13 on: 2012-07-30 22:27:34 »
On top of the league of shadows background being a drive, what about the whole monologue from the dark knight?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efHCdKb5UWc

"Some men just want to watch the world burn"

I think that can definitely apply here as well.

dkma841

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #14 on: 2012-07-30 23:04:48 »
It's kinda obvious if they do make the next Batman it will include Robin in it if you seen the end it shows Robin going into Batman's cave where he will begin his journey in the next film

BloodShot

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Re: The Dark Knight Rises
« Reply #15 on: 2012-07-31 00:20:54 »
« Last Edit: 2012-07-31 00:22:32 by BloodShot »