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Miscellaneous Forums => General Discussion => Topic started by: Rubicant on 2002-10-10 09:32:46
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Not so long ago, I posted that my dog ripped up my ff7 installation cd. Whether you believe me or not, I beg of someone a favor. I need a copy of the yamaha xg synthesizer driver which was included on the disc. If you need proof of my previous ownage I will gladly provide a picture of myself with the three remaining discs inside the case. However, at this time I only have one of the discs because my friend is borrowing the case containing two of the discs. If you are willing to wait a bit for the picture, then it will take a week or so.
All I am asking for is the synthesizer driver, nothing more. Whether you think I'm trying to con you into a piracy scam, please just recognize that I'm just asking for help.
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I'll put it up for you this afternoon, if no one else does first.
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where will you be putting it up? your website?
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I'll put it in my web space and PM your a direct link. Beginning the upload now, but my upload speed is real slow and I'm uploading some stuff to other people (P2P file sharing)... so... I'll PM you when its done.
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I gots a faster, better, (and more importantly), a relatively free idea that should work better than the S-YXG70.
The web site of this guy known on the VGMusic Forums as "Tony Thai" has the Full (non shareware) version available of the S-YXG100 and S-YXG50 available for download in a small corner of his site.
The site's main function is NOT warez, as far as I know, he mainly has his latest MIDI and mp3 compositions there, most of the MIDI's are XG, hence he decided to upload the install program for it.
So, to keep it a little general, I'll link to the main page of the site, which does not have direct links to the program or any other programs for that matter, so I don't know if that is still considered a "Warez" link.
Tony Thai's page is here (http://www.bloodomen.digitalstreaks.com/midiman/main.shtml). Last I checked, the "miscellaneous" link on his page should lead you to the page containing the link to the download.
I hope I'm not crossing the line here, though.
And, in regards to the funtionality of the S-YXG100 in FF7, I've done tests about half a year ago with the Shareware version of it in-game, the only real differences is that it uses the XG MIDI data setting instead of the General MIDI data setting in the config.
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Thanks you guys :)
except..why does the yamaha xg softsynth lag so much when loading songs? is there a way to counter this?
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Cool.
I really, really want a Win2k/XP version of the Yamaha Soft Synth, heh... I haven't tried the S-YXG100 yet though, maybe I'll be lucky and it'll work. Probably not, dangit.
[Edit]
Oh, he says the S-YXG50 works in Windows 2000... gonna try it.
Is the S-YXG100 really better? It's less than half the size of the S-YXG50.
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Faster response time in FF7 compared to when I use the S-YXG70 on the same card.
Is that good enough for you? Seriously, it actually is in the next class of XG synth above the class my XG hardware is classified as.
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Problem:
I had the SXG50 (it came with my card), and I could select to have 512 simultaneous voices. With the SXG100 I only have 256. That, and I can't access the plugins at all! What's wrong with it?
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512 voices?! WTF?!
XG hardware of that class can only do 128 at the most, so I don't see how softsynths could do that.
Second, do you by any chance use a K6 or K7 type processor? Yamaha said that processors of those types (might have been just the k6, not sure), can't use the plugin functionality because the plugins depend heavily on FPU calculations, and they said the k6 (again, and maybe k7)'s FPU capabilities are not enough, because they are only as good as an MMX Pentium1 class chip, which is not fast enough.
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I have a Duron 700 :D
Yes, yes, 512 voices. I don't know either, but it had it selectable (my sound card just keeps getting crazier, eh?)
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Hmmm....then I don't know why you can't access the VL plugin.
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Is there any kind of config file that I need to manually tweak?
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I don't know, never thought of that.
You might have to look around. I'm not sure which files exactly govern the synth's operation, but I would bet it would be more in the form of needing to tweak registry entries as well as looking for regular files.
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The number of voices it lets you select could be waaaay off what you can actually use in reality ;) The SB Live 1024 is so called because the softsynth on it lets you select up to 1024 voices. I've no idea how powerful a processor you actually /need/ to run that, though ... I guess it depends how much it can offload onto the Live DSP (answer: probably not enough). Besides, since when have you seen anything that would need 512 (or 1024) voices?
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When have you ever seen anything that uses 256 voices? I bet there is almost nothing that uses even 128.
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Alright, so how do I fix my other problem? You know, the one with not being able to access the plugins? My processor is well capable of handling it ^^;
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Ok, Idea. Could someone who's got the plugin pack installed zip up the plugin files and send them to me?
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The S-YXG100plus (which is actually the version you've downloaded, if you choose the XG100 install), claims to come with the plugins with it.
Back when I was testing the S-YXG100 (the Shareware version, though), I also noticed that I could not access the VL plugins. In hindsight, though, I have traced the reason why to being that when I tested it, I was still using my old P1 233mhz MMX CPU, which couldn't handle the plugins.
So, basically, even if they were active, I'm not sure if I would know how to use them.
I do have a question for you KojiroTakenashi. Is there any option that reads as "Sondius-XG"? I think that is the tech that is used in VL plugins.
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Well, I think it detects what you have during install, so if it misdetects what I have, the plugins won't even be extracted.
Nope, all I've got on the control panel is just the bare basics. No plugin
-anything-.
That's why I suggested just sending the plugins themselves, since I could manually install them.
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Is the response time (loading of song) speed with this S-YXG100 completely cpu dependant? I have a 866 p3 and it takes 1 whole second for a midi file to start playing. Anyone have any hunches or ideas (on how to fix it).
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Not totally CPU dependant, though the CPU's speed may still be involved.
If you're letting it use DirectSound for playback, then its at the mercy of the level of hardware acceleration your card has for Dsound. Unfortunately, even with my card, I've noticed that a reponse time of one second is typical, because it has to initialize the Dsound routines first, then begin Synthesizing. The upside to this, is that it allows for concurrent playback of Wave and MIDI, even though both are using your Wave device.
Try letting it play with Dsound off. That way, it uses the Windows wave mapper, which also means that it takes control of the wave device, and in most cases, any other windows event sounds you've set up won't play back, when the softsynth is playing. But, the reponse time should get faster.
If all else fails, there should be a Dsound Reponse Time slider in the XG softsynth's config. Try setting it to the fastest time.
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Well, one second isn't too bad, but it's kinda annoying when aerith's piano theme is supposed to start *RIGHT* when the holy materia hit the ground (in that certain cinematic, I don't want to ruin anything for anyone), and all you hear is a *ping*, then when the orb is in the middle of its second bounce, the music begins.
Well, I've tried fiddling around with the settings and I've finally gotten the fastest..and apparently directsound with fastest response time is my only option. Ah well.
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Well, the S-YXG70's response time, especially on a 233mhz system like I had at the time when I actually used it for the game, was one of the reasons I decided to start looking for a sound card that had XG playback featured in a hardware synth.
After I found one such card (which isn't incidental that it is my current sound card), the response time issue went away, obviously. :P
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If you listen to the final fantasy VII theme midi with the S-YXG100 or 50, it sounds really cool. It sounds all technological, like how I expected ff7's main theme to sound like. The theme on the OST sounds semi-techno, but the yamaha instruments really brings this song to life. Go ahead and listen, unless you have already...
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I think in some respects Yamaha instruments and the like can improve stuff...
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Which is better quality, XG50 or XG100?
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The S-YXG100 in theory will understand the more of the more advanced SysEx messages (they seem to have a few more Variation Effect parameters than the S-YXG50), but for FF7 purposes that is a moot point, the since the game's XG soundtrack will play back correctly on even the S-YXG50.
However, I'll say it again, when I tested the performance FF7 had when using the S-YXG100 in comparison to its previous performance using the S-YXG70, I did notice the S-YXG100 did respond faster than the S-YXG70.
And, yes, I totally agree that the XG soundtrack really does bring FF7's music to a new level. My only gripes, though, are the fact that it doesn't have a French horn sample that sounds like the traditional Squaresoft one (the one found in the Soundfonts), and the fact that when using the XG soundtrack, OWA is only an Instrumental, which means no lyrics for me. :(
Oh, and one more thing. In case some of you are envying the fact that I can use my XG hardware synth in-game, let me tell you, that compared to the softsynths, my hardware doesn't have any bass emphasis. However, I suppose that that 2.1 subwoofer system I got for free a few month's back could make up for it, but still, I would have prefered the enhanced bass that the Softsynths seem to have.
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Message
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The first time I played FF7, I used the XGLite of XG70. It sounded cool, but when I changed to XGSoft it was even better. Then I changed to the FF7 SoundFonts, vocals but crappy sounding. Then I got the XG Soundfont by one of you lot (sorry, I can't remember your name!).
The Audigy cards are so quiet on FF7. What causes this and how can I fix it?
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Oh, and one more thing. In case some of you are envying the fact that I can use my XG hardware synth in-game, let me tell you, that compared to the softsynths, my hardware doesn't have any bass emphasis. However, I suppose that that 2.1 subwoofer system I got for free a few month's back could make up for it, but still, I would have prefered the enhanced bass that the Softsynths seem to have.
Heh, get a real DB50XG, it has even the bass emphasis (apparently S-YXG70 is meant to be a software counterpart for one of those). :P In addition you'll get twice as large sample set (4MB instead of 2 MB carried by the softsynth).
Here's one, complete with the manual and cd-rom: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2061733519 Another one, although without the extras and really high price tag: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=912918438
You'll need a compatible soundcard to use one of them, pretty much everything from Creative before Live! will do, and other manufacturers still make PCI-based cards with WaveBlaster connector.
There's another alternative; DB60XG. It's identical to 50, except that it's a stand alone card instead of a daughterboard. Unfortunately it's ISA-card, which kinda makes it difficult to use in modern motherboards.
Believe me, the first thing I looked for was the DBXG50. Couldn't find it in any stores, and I wasn't exactly able to order it online.
Then, I found this card, which was the only one on the store shelves that did XG in a hardware solution (I still had only a 233mhz at the time, so I couldn't afford to get a new card and still wind up with software XG), and it was capable of EAX 1.0, 2.0, and A3D 1.0, and it claimed to have Hardware DLS (which it doesn't with the original drivers....took me a year and a half to find WDM drivers that let it do that, but then I lost the EAX/A3D capability), and then I saw the price tag (a mere $45 or so), and I basically jumped at the chance.
And besides, like I said, my subwoofer makes up for the missing bass emphasis. :P
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Ah, so these cards hook up to your main sound board? Interesting...that explains the connector dingy.
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Aaron, can you still get me a copy of the synthesizer driver that was included with ff7? I enjoy the newer ones that you and goku7 have brought to my attention, but I would like to try the older one out too...
Thanks
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Ah yeah, forgot about that.
Uploading now...
[Edit] Done, sending you a private message with the URL.
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Thanks you guys for helping me out and giving me ideas about the yamaha XG synths. I have finall come to a conclusion on which is the best.
As far as instrument quality goes, I would rate XG-100plus the highest.
As far as compatibility with ff7, I would rate XG-50 and XG-70 highest.
With the XG-100plus combined with ff7's midis, some of the instruments are missing (organs on cait sith's theme, piano in aerith's theme). This can be somewhat annoying. I have also noticed a little bit better response time with the XG-50 overall.
Oh, and by the way "The man with the machine gun" (Laguna's battle theme) sounds wonderful with the yamaha softsynth drivers..of course with the right instruments :)
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That's odd.....what MIDI data setting did you use in the config?
If you tried to set it to "General MIDI" the way the XG70 prefers it, then that could be why.
When I used the XG100Plus on FF7, it preferred the "XG MIDI" setting, as if it was a hardware synth. Perhaps that'll give you a little more compatibility.
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XG70 prefers General? I've used it on XG and it sounds five billion times better. (Only if you go to the XG70 control panel and change it from "XG Lite" to "XG Soft")
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Strangely enough, the XG70 appears to work on the config program with XG MIDI selected, but in-game all I get is silence, so I figured that that's what everyone else gets when they try to do that with the XG70.
Of course, I agree that the XG Data set is 5 billion times better... :P
Also, in case you didn't notice, there are two GM MIDI data sets. When it detects that its using both the GM data and the XG70, it uses the second GM package, which is a slightly altered XG data package.
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I only use XG Midi data when using the yamaha softsynths. I extracted all of the XG midi files from the lgp files, and cait sith's theme and aeris's piano theme were missing instruments. You think they would work in-game?
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Well, all I can say is that according to the manuel, the XG70 should be used with the GM data setting.
But, there is a noticeable difference between the XG MIDI data version of "Fighting", and the GM MIDI version the game uses when you select the XG70. The latter version doesn't have the gong, but the former one does.
And, I'm a little surprised that the XG package is missing some instruments, since I use the XG MIDI data setting with my XG hardware, and I haven't noticed any missing instruments on those two themes.
Yes, I have heard the SF2 Data packages version of those themes, so I do have something to compare it against. However, I've only heard the SF2 being used with the 512k SF provided by Squaresoft, so I don't know how much I'm missing, sample-wise.
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Oh well..It's no big deal anyways. I've worked my own way around it.
Can someone please enlighten me on how ff8 music works? Were there any soundfonts or yamaha compatibility included with the game?
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Well, FF8's a whole other animal, but fortunately a little more DirectX friendly.
The default configuration programs do NOT let you use any of your MIDI hardware if it can't handle DLS. That's one of the main reasons behind the creation of the FFSF's version of the config.
Second, DLS is basically software Soundfonts, only with the plus of being available on nearly all computers regardless of the soundcard, since the functionality is built into DX6 (or is it 6.1?). Anyway, on the FF8 Install CD, there is a DirectMusic upgrade for the S-YXG50/70/100 series, but it really doesn't do much for soundtrack quality, as there are all but 2 or 3 XG-specific songs in the soundtrack, plus both the MS synth and the yamaha synth still use the same DLS file, which unfortunately is built upon a DLS conversion of the Bank 0 instruments from the XG20 series, otherwise known as the XG70's "XGLite" mode.
But, that's where the FFSF Project (http://ffsf.cjb.net/) comes in. Squaresoft put together a rather poor DLS file in comparison to the PSX soundtrack's samples, but it still had a lot of potential, which you can see by comparing the original PC soundtrack with my Improved Tracks patch, since both are geared for the Original DLS, so you're still dealing with the same sample set file.
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ok, just wondering. I don't even have ff8 (for the pc). I was just curious.
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The game's music sounds superb with my wunder-hardware X3
Speaking of which...how do I get the Orchestral DLS to work?
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I downloaded Samuel's DLS for FF8 the other day, along with Fice's plugin for Winamp, and I gotta say the music's amazing. The DLS came with the SGT files, so I used those. The sound quality's the same, if not better, than the PSX version, I felt quite nostalgic listening to replicas of the original songs. Plus the fact that they were MIDI and not MP3 was a nice change for me.
Now, how will I manage to listen to the music AND play the game?...
Oh, just wondering, I know this is a little off-topic, but does anyone else find that Winamp crashes when you try to seek through an SGT song using Fice's plugin?
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It has to do with the fact that Fice's plugin is still working out the length of the segment when you are searching back and forth within the song.
Take a close look at the Total Song Length being displayed by Winamp when you click play. It should be all over the place, giving you a numerical value that won't stay put, at least until the plugin finally figures out the length; at that point you should notice that the total being displayed will stabilize on a certain value.
At that point, you should be able to search thru any point in the song without it crashing.
Note, though, that this is all theoretical, as I've gotten it to work without crashing on my system by using that approach. Your actual milage may vary.
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I use the FF8 Configurator (version 2.0) to play music from FF8. It lets you seek through the SGT and loops and everything.
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Winamp finds the total length of the SGT almost straight away for me, but even then I still get an illegal operation box after seeking. Then I found that if you pause, seek, then unpause it doesn't crash.
Aaron: Interesting. I've never used any of those programs before as I don't own FF8. Oh, and Fice's plugin loops fine, but I'll try FF8 Configurator anyway,
Thanks.