Qhimm.com Forums
Miscellaneous Forums => Graphical => Topic started by: Costa07 on 2009-10-15 23:07:39
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I was going to remake a new highwind model, and try to texture it good. I not to good at texturing and all. So I decided to post these pics i was using as a reference to my model, and a video of my model. I not sure if its any good so i decided to post about it before i even tried to finish.
Here are the pics i used as a reference to model it:
(http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/1953/3284455545afb28672f7.th.jpg) (http://img80.imageshack.us/i/3284455545afb28672f7.jpg/)
(http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/390/32844591258a373cd0f7.th.jpg) (http://img504.imageshack.us/i/32844591258a373cd0f7.jpg/)
Then here is a link to the video of my model in progress.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3PmSwPdvKg
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Shows some good potential, I think you should talk to pyrozen, he was looking to redo highwind for the world map project. Maybe you two should collaborate.
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Maybe he'll like to take over im not quite sure how to make the engine and propellers. But ill try working on it later i will probably some one to texture it for me tho.
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its a little too "round" if you ask me, try to make it a bit more edgy. the engines n propellors are pretty much just deformd cylinders, if that helps ye any
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its a little too "round" if you ask me, try to make it a bit more edgy. the engines n propellors are pretty much just deformd cylinders, if that helps ye any
ok im not quite sure how the propellers work since they spin in game there is another file that just the propeller though. Also the back propeller is on the model i was wondering if it is in a different file but i didn't find it any clue to where it is?
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even if they are separate, you can model it in and just separate it into another mesh with the p hotkey (whatever is selected will be separated)
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Bonus Disc texture :-P
(http://www.fileden.com/files/2009/9/12/2572576/Kimera093%202009-09-15%2020-24-23-34.gif)
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D: i finally find motivation to model something, i start up and i find someone else beat me to it? FFFFFFFFUUUU-
hehe, anyway, nice work. need some help texturing or something, just let me know.
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Neo if you want a copy of what i got so far i be more than happy to give it to you maybe you can fix the lil things here and there and texture it if you like.
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looks like a great start! let me know if you need any help texturewise, i'm clueless when it comes to 3d modeling or unwrapping a mesh.
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Yeah im clueless when it comes to textures :-P I actually start over i learn some new techniques and took timu's advice its coming along rather quickly im almost to where i was on my first model.
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D: i finally find motivation to model something, i start up and i find someone else beat me to it? FFFFFFFFUUUU-
hehe, anyway, nice work. need some help texturing or something, just let me know.
you could always remodel the little racecar you have for disc 2...
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you could always remodel the little racecar you have for disc 2...
What racecar?
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Bonus Disc texture :-P
(http://www.fileden.com/files/2009/9/12/2572576/Kimera093%202009-09-15%2020-24-23-34.gif)
Is that from the disc or have you been able to extract the model?
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looks like the original model.
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you could always remodel the little racecar you have for disc 2...
What racecar?
It's the little 6-wheeled car you get from Dio after you escape from Prison town by winning the chocobo races.
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Oh ok. You got me confused there when you said "Disc 2" but I think that is taking into consideration that Disc 1 is the installation disc lol. :lol:
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Yeah it would be nice to have all the vehicles redone. I'll try to do them all but i dont know thats a ot of work :-P
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Ok here is the progress of the new highwind i am working on. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UNMAvpRzmk
(http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/4424/blender2009101722373900.th.png) (http://img196.imageshack.us/i/blender2009101722373900.png/)
(http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/8705/blender2009101722374733.th.png) (http://img194.imageshack.us/i/blender2009101722374733.png/)
(http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/656/blender2009101722375710.th.png) (http://img21.imageshack.us/i/blender2009101722375710.png/)
(http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/2509/blender2009101722380312.th.png) (http://img24.imageshack.us/i/blender2009101722380312.png/)
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Wow you made that? Looks fantastic, keep it up
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don't forget its second form. :wink:
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Yeah it wasn't to hard i posted some pics in the post about if you can see the video good enough. But I'm hoping to get all the transportation models done. Either by me or if some one else is up too help thats great i just want new vehicles in game. And i already thought about its second form and saved a separate file at the midway point so i can make the second model from that point. So that one is pretty much done too.
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Model looks great!
Here some official art images:
(http://www.ffforever.info/pics/gallery/ff7/cg/fff_ff7_cg_06.jpg)
(http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn15/squallff8_2008/ff7-highwind3.jpg)
(http://www.ff-omeganebula.com/galeries/FF7/7b-highwind_v2.jpg)
(http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn15/squallff8_2008/ff7-highwind4.jpg)
(http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn15/squallff8_2008/ff7-highwind1.jpg)
(http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn15/squallff8_2008/ff7-highwind2.jpg)
They should help with details :wink:
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It looks great costa! My only suggestion is to move the lower deck up, closer to the body. right now it seems like it's much further away than the pictures dictate. How many polys is that thing at this point?
lee
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Ok i'll move it up what do you think like 1/4 of the way or 1/2 of the way? And about the polys i didn't even think about that till this point. The original model used 3 different .p files these right here. I look up my poly count in a minute. Any one know the poly count allowed for each .p file?
(http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/5052/kimera09320091018170149.th.png) (http://img16.imageshack.us/i/kimera09320091018170149.png/)
(http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/2671/kimera09320091018170215.th.png) (http://img19.imageshack.us/i/kimera09320091018170215.png/)
(http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/7328/kimera09320091018170235.th.png) (http://img204.imageshack.us/i/kimera09320091018170235.png/)
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i'd go 1/4 of what you have now, in all the pictures the lower deck seems to sit very close to the body of the aircraft. Looks very promising!!
lee
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Ok any clue on what the poly count limit is anybody know?
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There isn't a polycount limit. You can stuff there as many as you want. Of course using too many polygons will slow down the game. And could cause memory problems also.
Well, actually, there IS a limit. It's just it's sensless to reach such boundaries. Due to the data types used to reference vertices, polygons, etc. You can "only" have as much as 2^16 vertices, polygons, etc. And in fact Kimera wouldn't be able to handle more than 2^15 due to the inability of VB6 to handle unsigned data types.
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Ok thank you for clearing that up for me borde
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UPDATED MODELS
[/u][/i][/b]
HIGHWIND
Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NodQpmVavPE
Pics:
(http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/9977/highwind1.th.png) (http://img36.imageshack.us/i/highwind1.png/)
(http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/2550/highwind2.th.png) (http://img12.imageshack.us/i/highwind2.png/)
(http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/3638/highwind3.th.png) (http://img213.imageshack.us/i/highwind3.png/)
HIGHWIND TRANSFORMED
Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euu6fj_6LvQ
Pics:
(http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/4108/transformedhighwind1.th.png) (http://img190.imageshack.us/i/transformedhighwind1.png/)
(http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/9015/transformedhighwind2.th.png) (http://img18.imageshack.us/i/transformedhighwind2.png/)
(http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/4081/transformedhighwind3.th.png) (http://img18.imageshack.us/i/transformedhighwind3.png/)
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Judging by the relative size of the on screen model, and the slowdown factor...
I'd say 750-1000 polys isn't too high. It might be excessive, but it would still be within the technical OK area.
You really shouldn't need that many if you're an efficient modeler.
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The poly count so far is
6982 for the transformed and
13958 for the normal model but i still need to get rid of some unnecessary poly that are not needed.
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Wow.. I think Timu's whole Barret model is half the amount of polys as the transformed one
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Don't forget the hard limit of 65536 vertices per group. You could just split it into several groups of course but I'm not sure Kimera can do that automatically.
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I think low deck is still far from the body and propellers suppose to be fatter :|
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one thing i noticed is that inside the engines, you have modeled the individual blades. Get rid of them and make it a flat face, the textures will do more than enough to simulate those. Also, it would be a PITA to have to work with a mesh for those, when one big texture will work just fine. That should cut down on the poly count quite a bit.
and +1 for moving the deck a bit closer to the body.
also, you might want to use the original game model to line up your engines and such. I don't think you can move the fire and wind sheer that comes off of the original, and it'll look very wierd if they dont line up perfectly(or close).
lee
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You'll never see the effect of that many polys in the game...
12 is about the most divisions you need to make a cylinder look round at that size. 8 would likely suffice, and most games from the PS2 era used 6...
If you weren't using blender I'd suggest using the Reduce function... Regardless... your model is pointlessly over-round.
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Don't forget the hard limit of 65536 vertices per group. You could just split it into several groups of course but I'm not sure Kimera can do that automatically.
True, I was wrong about the vertex indices data type. And no, the currently released Kimera can't even load 3Ds files so there is not much it can do right now about the vertex limit :-P
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looking at the model in context, you should have a polygon budget of about 600 polys. 800 would be pushing it.
You gain nothing with thousands of polygons.
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Just remember this.
A good texture can sometimes make up for a bad model, but a good model will always look bad with a bad texture.
The trick is to get the model as small as possible and make up for as much as you can through textures. Once you get it looking OK, if you have more polygons in the budget you can use them to make the model look better, but you should always shoot for efficiency over shear beauty.
Your model has more polygons for less effect than an entire player model for an average Xbox 360 or PS3 model. (They carry a 6k to 10k average depending on size-on-screen and company)
An average PS2 model is generally under 4k with quite a few being within tens of 2500.
I entirely agree with what halkun said, I said 1000 before, but I also said it was excessive. Do remember that the entire Highwind is only about 3-4 inches or less on an average sized monitor, and not much bigger on the larger ones.
Try looking at the model from a distance and see if you can count the individual polygons... In the majority of cases, you should be able to count the polygons when looking at the on-screen size of the model. (Few exceptions include highly detailed areas like character faces and hands, or joints that need to move fluidly.)
Again, round areas at your size, I'd suggest no more than 8 radial divisions.
Also, the more polys you have, the more difficult the model is to work on.
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OK figured out my problem i was using the default 32 division cylinders and shapes. Most of all the poly are not even close to being needed my flats surfaces on the ship has like 12 polys which is not needed
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Ok so i got the un transformed model done agian :-P This time the poly count is 767 but i still get rid of some unneeded polys that you cants see do to other polys in the way. So the take of a off a lil of the poly number i just posted. Its still the same general model i made before just with less detail same shape and form. and i compared it to the original models mesh to get the right size of thing as good as possible.
EDIT: The transformed model now has 674 polys
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cool good work
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screenies please... i want to see how it looks after reducing that much polygons... :-) take your time though, i'm not demanding here...
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Ok now with a poly count in the 700 and it texture here is how it looks but cant seem to get it to convert so it can go in game. I been working for a while just to finish it and now about a day to get it in game but its not working with me here sorry blender :-P
here some pics and video of it texture and finished.
PICS:
(http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/3579/blender2009110307572824.th.png) (http://img262.imageshack.us/i/blender2009110307572824.png/)
(http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/4394/blender2009110307573836.th.png) (http://img442.imageshack.us/i/blender2009110307573836.png/)
(http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/6356/blender2009110307574810.th.png) (http://img248.imageshack.us/i/blender2009110307574810.png/)
VIDEO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsscgCsnQ1U
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quick question are you only doing pre-disc 3 or are you doing disc 3 highwind
it looks good, rather acurate too, all i can think of that needs a little bit of impovement is the texture.
A noticable improvement on the original
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Thats the original highwind before its transformed i have the transformed model done just not textured yet. I'm a noob at texturing so i still need to improve on my skills there. Blender doesn't seem to export the 3ds file right like if it don't export the UV coordinates right
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You can export an .obj from blender, then use milkshape or wings3d to import the .obj and export a .3ds and the uv should be okay. You can also use biturn to convert the .obj to .3ds, but the uv will most likely corrupt and some polies will be flipped.
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Ok so converting them with milkshape works but when i open it with p creator and and open the bitmap it all looks right just got to flip the y axis. But when i save it as a .p file then look at it with kimera its just all white with no texture with it any clue?
EDIT: funny story seems i forgot to edit the rsd file to a sign the textures :-P . But im about to crash i'll finish my work later.
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If you are using anything other then the default 8 bit textures i don't believe Kimera will show them and they come up white.
Also fantastic work on the model. Though i think the texture could use some more work. Though i SUCK at texturing so i can't really talk there :-P
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No the current version of Kimera does display 24 bit textures, but you do have to load and 8 bit texture in Pcreator when making battle model p files.
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Oh alright, thanks for the clarification*
EDIT: Firefox made me look stupid :P guess it's what i get for rushing
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Oh alright, thanks for the calcification
I think you mean clarification. You don't really want to be calcified.
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looks great! The model looks fantastic and the textures look good too.
I'd work on the raw metal a little bit to remove the "banded" highlights you see now, but other than that it's excellent! Very good for your first attempt at this.
lee
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Oh alright, thanks for the calcification
I think you mean clarification. You don't really want to be calcified.
Don't be so sure; some people like weird stuff :-D
Also, this model is really good. When he first came here, Costa07 wasn't a very useful member, but that's certainly changed now. He's done what I did, but in reverse. :-P
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Oh alright, thanks for the calcification
I think you mean clarification. You don't really want to be calcified.
Don't be so sure; some people like weird stuff :-D
Also, this model is really good. When he first came here, Costa07 wasn't a very useful member, but that's certainly changed now. He's done what I did, but in reverse. :-P
There was a time when you were useful? :-P
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There was a time when you were useful? :-P
Yeah, it was a long time before you came :lol:
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There was a time when you were useful? :-P
Yeah, it was a long time before you came :lol:
Was it artwork? Cuz i could use a few more good artists
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There was a time when you were useful? :-P
Yeah, it was a long time before you came :lol:
Was it artwork? Cuz i could use a few more good artists
Nope. I'm useless at both 2D and 3D art, so I'm afraid that I can't help. :-P
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Well guess i didn't figure it out in game the textures look like that got a rainbow layer on them but in kimera they look just fine. I sent a message to NeoCloudstrife to see if he can help me get it in game correctly so untill then i'll just have to wait for his reply. Here is a pic of it in game but not sure y the texture is like that?
(http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/2130/ff72009110616272078.png) (http://img237.imageshack.us/i/ff72009110616272078.png/) (http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/ff72009110616272078.png/1/w1440.png) (http://g.imageshack.us/img237/ff72009110616272078.png/1/)
EDIT: Oh yeah and i know its not lined up right im still learning how to get things in game
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Right, i got it all done, just need a save with that version of highwind to test it.
And hey, this is your first model, right? its pretty epic for a first one, i like how you've done it. the textures arent the best in the world, but you've set them up properly (i.e UV map and texture on top) and at least you can do some stuff with photoshop or whatever.
i do seem to recall a problem with multicoloured-ness, i'll research it if need be.
so yeah, anyone mind sending me a save with this highwind?
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ok still same problem here is a save with the the version of the highwind on disc 2
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?4moagzoy5qg
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If you want, send me your texture sheet n i'll add a lil awesomesauce to it.
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ok i'll pm you now.
EDIT like pyrozen said the raw metal nees some work
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Hmk, long story short, i'm gonna modify your model to 1, be a little more efficient (the count might actually go up just a bit cuz i'm adding in a few more details), and i'm gonna redo the uvs. Look about for a finished product sometime...
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Ok sounds good cant wait. I just want a new highwind to go with the new world map textures. So next model... maybe the submarine
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nuuuu the buggy!
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Ok ok the buggy....... maybe :lol:
EDIT: Has anybody ever looked at the buggy closely? It has a big fan in the back and 2 fans on the tail of the car wander what the 2 on the tail are supposed to be for
EDIT2: Interesting pic i found of the buggy looks good.
(http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/7937/buggy72.th.jpg) (http://img254.imageshack.us/i/buggy72.jpg/)
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just posting some wip on the highwind, bout all i feel like doing for now, later on the weekend i'll clean up the rest and get to textures.
(http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/1052/picture144.png)
(http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/1381/picture145q.png)
(http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/6998/picture146.png)
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wow see now thats what i was aiming for great job keep it up
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Right, i figured out the problem with the multicoloured-ness
It seems FF7 Does lighting differently for the field as it does for the world map and minigames. Since this is a world map model, i just assumed using the field model .p format would be ok, but i was wrong. all you gotta do is export them as battle models instead and just rename them to .p files. Well, that is, when timu's finished with the model and textures. i did notice on your model, costa, that the UV map was kinda "auto generated" instead of custom, that's why it didnt look as smooth between clusters of polys as it should have. doubtless Timu will unwrap it properly this time :D but damn, this is gonna be epic when it's done.
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Ok ok the buggy....... maybe :lol:
EDIT: Has anybody ever looked at the buggy closely? It has a big fan in the back and 2 fans on the tail of the car wander what the 2 on the tail are supposed to be for
EDIT2: Interesting pic i found of the buggy looks good.
(http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/7937/buggy72.th.jpg) (http://img254.imageshack.us/i/buggy72.jpg/)
I would imagine the big fan is for "thrust" and the 2 side-fans are for changing direction
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Timu any luck with texturing the updated highwind?
EDIT: And does anyone have a save with the buggy in it.
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Maybe this helps you http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=8880.0
The saves with the buggy are in save 03 i think, just choose fort condor battle 5 and exit the fort, it should be there.
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Sorry i been away for so long been busy. So timu any progress on the highwind model?
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I'm currently competing in a 3d competition, but the deadline is monday so i may start work on it again.
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Ok sounds good. Good luck with your 3d competition. Im about halfway done with the buggy maybe when im done i can send it to you to spice it up a lil more?
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Sorry to summon the dead but, I was wondering what had ever happened to the new highwind model. the world map being what it is now this would just make it all the sweeter :-D
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I gave it to timu to spruce it up a lil but he is probably busy at the moment just got to wait till he gets time.
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modeling needs time and effort especially your artistic skills, like what timu's doing now to make him busy :-)
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(http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/8995/hwwt.th.png) (http://img855.imageshack.us/i/hwwt.png/)
(http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/8125/hwww.th.png) (http://img805.imageshack.us/i/hwww.png/)
(http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/2827/hwwww.th.png) (http://img193.imageshack.us/i/hwwww.png/)
highwind almost done new and improved. 8-)
Highwind v1 & v2 http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=12983.0
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WOW! Most Impressive.
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Did you get the files i sent you and do you have someone to input it
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It's absolutely an improvement. I love the darker richer, more detailed look of it. Remember to do the second version also, so they can both be available.
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ya already almost done just have to make a few minor adjustments
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It might be a little while before I can import it. This is the last month of school so they're cramming all kinds of tests and finals and papers down our throat. Sorry :/
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Arg that's bad. Kinda same for all the modders I'd assume :/ Real life taking over...
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I'll be available to import any models if you need.
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http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=12983.0 realease of highwind v1 and v2
DLPB and pitrat you can use these in ur next release of FF7 Unified Model Installer
EDIT: Anyone every notice in the world.lgp that the chocobo is white and there are no textures for it? So does anyone know where it gets its textures from to be green blue black or gold if they are not in the world.lgp? Thanks to who ever answers. 8-)
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All the different colors of chocobos use that same with model. The game overlays the color on the model making it the correct color. So when you use a textured model it needs to use a mostly white grey scale texture to appear colored on the world map.
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k so i can still texture for detail then it will overlay a transparent color or will it erase all detail? Or is there a way to find and change the color textures?
oh yeah her some WIP but not too happy about the texture. (http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/2842/geln.png) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/827/geln.png/)