Author Topic: [FF7PC-98/PSX] The FFVII AV mod (2010-11-22 Demo) (Read 70812 times)

Armorvil · « **Reply #50 on:** 2010-11-21 13:16:48 »

Ha, I understand now. Thanks

Armorvil · « **Reply #51 on:** 2010-11-21 21:21:45 »

Sorry about the double-post, but I managed to convert the demo for the PSX. Thanks to Lasyan3's earlier version of Hack7, that allowed me to edit the 2 field files that caused me problems (about the batteries, I just made them available in shop - I can't believe I didn't think about this solution, earlier).

First post about to be edited with a link to a .PPF patch.

EDIT : 1st post edited with the link.

xLostWingx · « **Reply #52 on:** 2010-11-22 02:06:46 »

Sweet, I will grab your demo for now but probably will not play it for a little while. But when i do I will provide some feedback.

sl1982 · « **Reply #53 on:** 2010-11-22 02:09:32 »

What does AV stand for anyways?

Armorvil · « **Reply #54 on:** 2010-11-22 10:14:54 »

It stands for my username. I took a habit of calling my mods / rom hacks "<name of game> AV" (I started the habit with FFVI, and I also have a PS3 AV -Phantasy Star III Generations of Doom- in the works).

About FFVII, I think it's fitting since there already are FFVII AC (advent children), FFVII BC (before crisis), FFVII CC (crisis core), and FFVII DC (dirge of cerberus). Makes for some kind of continuity >_>

@xLostWingx: cool. I'm looking forward to hearing from you ^^

Beavii · « **Reply #55 on:** 2010-11-22 10:16:50 »

Quote from: Armorvil on 2010-11-21 21:21:45

Sorry about the double-post.....................................

I beleive your allowed to double post in your own project forum with news and updates

Armorvil · « **Reply #56 on:** 2010-11-22 10:24:06 »

Yeah but even so, I'm not too comfortable doing it

EDIT: there's a problem with the .ppf patch, so link removed for now.

Armorvil · « **Reply #57 on:** 2010-11-22 15:21:12 »

OK, new working patch for the PSX version released in the first post. XDelta patches again, since they work so well (I think... ...no one complained that my .bat files didn't work, for the PC version, yet).

Beavii · « **Reply #58 on:** 2010-11-22 17:06:06 »

Quote from: Armorvil on 2010-11-22 15:21:12

OK, new working patch for the PSX version released in the first post. XDelta patches again, since they work so well (I think... ...no one complained that my .bat files didn't work, for the PC version, yet).

I couldn't get them working but then again, had i got them working i wouldn't have wrote 'BML'

Armorvil · « **Reply #59 on:** 2010-11-22 18:24:41 »

Beavii, do you have a 32bits or 64bits Windows ?... ...Now that I think about it, I think I overlooked 64bits ones

. Those who have one should either use BML, or download XDelta 64 bits version, and edit the .bat files I provided to correct the name of the program.

Also, little problem with the PSX patch : Reno, on top of the pillar, uses his rod on all party members in a single attack. Not a problem on the PC version, but the PSX can not deal with the animation. So, the game crashes. I already fixed it in my game, and am currently play-testing it.
So, if I experience other problems like this one, I can instantly fix them.

Bottom line is : you might want to refrain from downloading and installing it until I released a fix. You can still play the game up to this point though, and you'll have to save the game at the bottom of the pillar so you load it again once you installed the soon-to-be-released fix.

Thank you for your patience, everyone!

EDIT:

Here is the fix :

http://www.mediafire.com/?g5a3e93ugqxzrr5

Gosh, I'm tired >_<

Beavii · « **Reply #60 on:** 2010-11-23 10:51:02 »

Quote from: Armorvil on 2010-11-22 18:24:41

Beavii, do you have a 32bits or 64bits Windows ?... ...Now that I think about it........

was 64, but in repair shop just now.

Armorvil · « **Reply #61 on:** 2010-11-24 19:14:59 »

I've thought about changing my element system again. Because actually, I'm neither satisfied with the anti-slashes, anti-impacts, anti-bullets and anti-lasers accessories (I'm not sure someone would use them), nor with the fact that Barret would be immune to blunt weapons / punches / etc, Cid being immune to slashes of all kinds, Cloud being immune to firearms, and Tifa being immune to lasers.

Actually, I think I'll turn the Shout element into the magic element, the Shoot element into the physical element, and the Punch element into the "enemy skill" element. So, all magic spells would come with the Shout element, all enemies' physical attacks will come with Shoot, and all enemy skills of any kind (from the techniques labelled as Enemy Skills, to the Beam Gun, Tremor, Fire Breaths, ...these are specific to each enemy and there are too many to list) would come with the Punch element. It would allow me to make "physical" characters naturally halve all physical attacks (by halving Shoot), all "magical" characters naturally halve magical attacks (by halving Shout), and the three other characters naturally halving the enemies' special attacks (by halving -you guessed it- Punch).

I really like this idea, because it would specialize the characters without making their Vitality or Spirit stats sky-high right from the start (so they'd still have room for growth). And it would give an interest in changing your team members if you know you're about to deal with a boss that mostly uses physical, magic or "special" attacks. Besides, FFVII's vitality & spirit stats work the same as FFVI's, but only halved : whereas having a charactar with 255 in defence in FFVI reduces physical damage by 100%, having 255 in vitality in FFVII only reduces physical damage by 50%. That means there is not much difference between a character with 50 vitality and another with 0 or 100 vitality, in FFVII. The damage difference is quite ridiculous in this case.

With this idea implemented, differences between the characters would show more. If a magic attack dealt 1000, Aeris with 255 Spirit/MDef would only take 250 damage, whereas Barret would take 500 (with the same stats). With very powerful enemies, it would add another tactical dimension to the game.

And what do you think of this :

Cloud would halve the three elements (after all, he's a freakin' SOLDIER),

Would halve physical attacks : Barret, Cid
Would halve magical attacks : Aeris, Tifa, Vincent
Would halve special attacks : Red XIII, Yuffie, Cait Sith

I'm open to suggestions. Please tell me what you think ^^

EDIT:

And actually, I don't know if Cloud should halve all three elements - it would make him too overpowered, perhaps... ...Maybe only physical attacks.

EDIT2:

Here is what I decided, for now :

Cloud : halves damage from physical attacks and enemy techniques
Barret : halves physical attack damage, Def + 128
Tifa : Def + 128, MDef + 128
Aeris : halves magical attack damage, MDef + 128
Red XIII : halves damage from enemy techniques, Def + 128
Yuffie : halves damage from enemy techniques, MDef + 128
Cid : halves damage from physical attacks, MDef + 128
Vincent : halves damage from magical attacks, Def + 128
Cait Sith : halves damage from magical attacks and enemy techniques

...I'm sure you can see where I'm coming from - added some unique-ness to the characters, made Barret the tank, Aeris a tank mage, Tifa a well rounded fighter with no real strengths but no weakness, etc.

Tenko Kuugen · « **Reply #62 on:** 2010-11-28 04:21:11 »

whole post in 'my opinion' style. people who feel offended, feel free to go and make a campfire.

Are the damage modifiers supposed to represent something we can link to the visual appearance? Because some stuff doesn't make a whole lot of sense, tbh.
If anything, Cloud should be the all-rounded character.
Barret as tank is spot on, he's the muscle guy.
Tifa seems to be more specialized in physical combat than magic, and thus should reduce physical damage ( not as much as for example barret, but she's stronger than others )
Aerith, sure, is the magic girl. Instead of halving all magic damage, she should halve all positive elements ( aka, the elements that make up the earth aka 'holy' because thats imo what her allignment should be ) and completely null Holy.
Nanaki be somewhat like Cloud, all rounded but with more focus on physical than magical. halving enemy techniques is essentially much less useful than the other stuff.
Yuffie should be focused on speed ( like, permanent haste anywhere ) and evade instead of actual damage reduce. If push to shove, she's the one character thats the most likely to have anything to do with enemy skill stuff, but I still say thats pretty useless.
Cid being the robust mechanic is okay, but I say he should be less robust than barret and instead get a boost to physical attack. ( or maybe a major boost to attack and take more damage from magic, because.. well.. he's cid. the science and mechanic guy. nothing to do with magic, really )
Vincent the monster should get 1/3 of both physical and magical resistance and halve the negative elements ( poison, gravity, whatever you think of as negative and unholy ) he's basically the dark counterpart to aerith's holy.
Cat Sith... I really dunno. Enemy skills make sense, true. Maybe give him mdef and def boosts, seems more logical seeing how he's a robot.

Armorvil · « **Reply #63 on:** 2010-11-28 10:03:17 »

Thank you for posting your thoughts, Kuugen

Overall I kinda agree with you, but there are reasons why I chose this. First, I think you underestimate the "Halve enemy techniques" ability. It doesn't only reduce damage from Enemy Skills, but from all these attacks enemies do that aren't magic or melee. Like lasers, white flashes, blue flames, grenade attacks, white flashes... ...and there are a lot. In fact, their frequency is almost as high as physical attacks' (as opposed to purely magical abilities, that enemies wouldn't use much if I didn't add more spells to some enemies).

The other reason was to balance the trio that is Cloud / Barret / Tifa. I wanted to give access to the three kinds of characters as soon as possible, so you'd notice the difference of damage they take. If Tifa also halved Physical attack, the difference in melee damage that Cloud, Barret and Tifa would feel, would be negligible. Also, Tifa is "all rounded", but still on the weak size. The +128 in def/mdef equals to a decrease in magic & physical damage by 25%, as opposed to the 50% that some characters get. I wouldn't feel comfortable giving those attributs to Cloud, and I think they're fitting for Tifa who doesn't look as tough with her white top, mini-skirt and suspenders

(oh yeah, and Cid is indeed less robust than Barret... ...As for the bonus to damage, the strength stat and weapons will deal with it. What I describe above are armors and accessories attributes only).

Quote

Aerith, sure, is the magic girl. Instead of halving all magic damage, she should halve all positive elements ( aka, the elements that make up the earth aka 'holy' because thats imo what her allignment should be ) and completely null Holy.

The problem with this, is that some physical attacks are elemental. For example, Bombs' headbutts are fire-elemental, and I wouldn't want Aeris to halve these attacks. As for nullifying Holy, I agree that it should be her alignment - but since she disappears half-way through the game and since enemies will start dealing Holy damage later in the game, I don't see the interest. Hence why Tifa inherited it.

I also agree with you about Cid's magical resistance, but... ...It's quite hard to implement. You see, I made it so all characters are different. So I needed a character who had some magic resistance and halved physical attacks....Hm... ...Maybe I could swap Cloud's abilities with Cid's, so Cloud has some MDef while Cid halves enemy techniques... ...But then, I'd have to rework some battles in Midgar, as they might be too tough now (or maybe not). Tell me what you think, anyway

Tenko Kuugen · « **Reply #64 on:** 2010-11-28 15:00:18 »

mean wretch warning issued, I have a headache

when you say 'enemy skills' it does sound like you are refering to >LEARNABLE enemy skills, which I what I am refering to
Generally, the way you go about it isn't bad, but I really dont know enough about your mod to go any further than this.

xLostWingx · « **Reply #65 on:** 2010-12-03 05:49:16 »

I'm pickin up what you're laying down AV. I think that your solution is perfect for what I think you were trying to attain. It is also an innovative method that gives me some ideas for future work. You should get to work on that and test it out to see what it feels like.

EDIT: About Cloud. You could go crazy and make him really unique and perhaps give him a mix of High and Low stats and Abilities (such as the half-physical, half-magical and whatnot) and give him a ultra steep XP curve or something. Cloud is just a weakling with a successful Jenova cell implantation...makes for some strange effects perhaps...

Also, when making the mod for PC did you consider the break damage limit or HP limit? Because if so, the PSX version may be unbalanced.

Armorvil · « **Reply #66 on:** 2010-12-13 12:17:07 »

Thanks Lost Wing, will do

(and sorry about the late reply ^^; )

About Cloud, he seems fine for now. I'll see if I have to change things along the course of my playthrough / hacking.

As for the BDL, and even though ARMs made a working patch for the PSX (with a cap at 32,000 damage), I'm designing the patch without it mind.

Vgr · « **Reply #67 on:** 2011-01-06 20:33:01 »

Sorry asking maybe so much, but can you put in a new post all the features of your mod (and then edit your first post) because everything is messed up anyways

I'm about to test it. Seems very good

RickJMan · « **Reply #68 on:** 2011-02-11 02:03:09 »

Armorvil i have a question. I seem to have run into a little issue when applying your mod to my psx version of the game. when i double click the "apply scene, kernel, limtmenu, and shopmenu patch" nothing happens. the only one that works for me is the mds7pb_1. im probably making some stupid mistake and overlooked something, which i usually do lol, but i was wondering if you could help me out or send me the av files for these. although i do have well above an average skill in modification, i cant seem to figure this out :/ btw i absolutely love what you have done for this game. i have played final fantasy 7 since i was 4 when it came out and i have loved it since. i am 17 now. i have only started modification on it for the past 2 years though. your mod is exactly what i was looking for. it gave the game more definition if i could say that. but i think i have another thing you may be interested in, i had a thought that if you are playing the psx version of the game on a ps3 it would be no problem to add the more realistic characters into that version of the game by replacing them on the disc and deleting nonessential data (movie files that arent viewed until disc 2 or 3 or other character models redundant to the story at the time) from the disc to maintain its original size. ive tried it but it had major bugs im trying to work out. the only character i could change without causing the game to crash was the cloud battle character to the advent children model. i will keep you posted on my progress on this project if you would like.

i look forward to your reply and/or help with my issue and thank you in advance. and if you have any interest in my projects let me know and ill find a way to send you the files that you need to try them out for yourself.

Armorvil · « **Reply #69 on:** 2011-02-21 19:41:48 »

Well, I never tried modding FFVII on the PS3 (I didn't buy it on the PSN actually, so I can't even try), so I can't help you there. Still, if you managed to replace Cloud's battle model with the AC one, it is quite an accomplishment ! I'm looking forward to hear more.

As for the patch, you're not the first one to have a problem applying it. Are you using the Greatest Hits version ?... ...Because another person who can't make it work has it, and I'm not sure if there are differences with the normal edition (I don't think so, but heh).

EDIT:

@Vgr255 : Yeah, I should edit the first post with all the info (and sorry about the late reply)... ...but I'm lazy

Also, I already told you in PM that I'm working on a separate patch with different features these days, but I thought it wise to mention it here, too.

It'll be called "FFVII: Total Grudge" or something like that - since almost all enemies have an attack that deals damage dependant on the target's # of kills (like Master Tonberry's Everyone's Grudge).

I've reached Gongaga, and I've never had so much fun with FFVII. You have to play with all characters and think about who's gonna get each kill, so no one ever gets one-shot'ed. You're happy everytime you obtain a new party member, because this means that you have a new way of absorbing kills. Of course the characters' max HP and # of kills to learn new Limits are consequently decreased.

And of course, there are many features of FFVII AV that are included in this. I'll talk more about it once it's complete (which shouldn't take too long, the development takes a lot less time than FFVII AV's).

xLostWingx · « **Reply #70 on:** 2011-02-22 17:12:51 »

Total Grudge sounds cool. Its still based off of AV? Sounds even better lol. How is Cloud holding up since he is in the party so often? Sounds like you could play a number of different ways - Make one character get all kills so everyone else never gets hurt; Spread kills out to balance the damage; or deliberately keep two or three characters from getting any kills. It would be interesting if you eliminated the ability to escape from battles or were to create more formations with side attacks so you are forced to kill at least one enemy before escaping. If this is based off of AV, then do you still have the Sources as items dropped? Otherwise you may have hampered the player's ability to farm sources later in the game without handicapping Yuffie (depending on if the Conformer is intact). Sounds cool though.

Armorvil · « **Reply #71 on:** 2011-02-22 19:35:04 »

Quote

Make one character get all kills so everyone else never gets hurt;

Yeah, but by doing so, no level 2/3/4 Limit breaks for the others

Quote

Spread kills out to balance the damage

Yeah, that's how I'm currently doing it. Cloud killed 35 enemies (350 damage hurts a lot, since his max HP is ~700 with a HP+ at level 23), Yuffie killed 29, Tifa killed 27, Cait killed 22, Barret killed 24, Aeris killed 25 (and already learned Breath of the Earth), and Red XIII killed 27. I still feed Cait Sith some kills while heading to Cosmo Canyon, and can't wait until I get Vincent... ...As for Cloud, he killed more because of my own stupidity.

Leveling them evenly is also a lot of fun - I never did it before, because I wasn't "forced" to (I always played with Cloud+Tifa+Yuffie).

Quote

or deliberately keep two or three characters from getting any kills.

Not a bad idea. I guess you could make a "boss only" party, with other characters taking care of random battles. That way, the boss only party would have a easier time dealing with the bosses...

Quote

It would be interesting if you eliminated the ability to escape from battles or were to create more formations with side attacks so you are forced to kill at least one enemy before escaping.

Actually, the beauty of this is that escaping battles finally has a use. You can escape battles all you like, but then you can kiss much needed Exp/AP/Gil goodbye. And escaping battles when you visit a previous area (like when you want to teach White Wind or something to a new Enemy Skills user) is a godsend. It isn't very interesting to increase your kill count (=the enemies' damage output) when you're gonna net low AP/Exp/Gil.

So no, most of the time, I don't want to force the player to kill enemies.

Quote

If this is based off of AV, then do you still have the Sources as items dropped?

Not in the version I'm playtesting. I think I'll add them though - because with the limited number of enemies you can kill throughout the game, might as well help the player increase in power. Enemies such as bosses also give more Exp/Gil, so you have an easier time leveling your characters evenly (after defeating Reno & Rude in Gongaga, everyone is level 22 or 23... ...except Aeris who is lv 34 that is (because of her "special growth")

).

Quote

Otherwise you may have hampered the player's ability to farm sources later in the game without handicapping Yuffie (depending on if the Conformer is intact). Sounds cool though.

I see what you mean. Anyways, all characters now have multiple ultimate weapons, so everyone has a weapon like the Ultima Weapon (power dependant on HP), the Missing Score (power dependant on AP), the Conformer (power dependant on enemies' levels), etc. You only get them late in the game though (some are in the Midgar raid, others are in the Ancient Forest, etc).

And yeah, it is cool ^^ Thanks for your interest, LW

xLostWingx · « **Reply #72 on:** 2011-02-22 20:07:37 »

Sounds like you took all factors into consideration

Have you used Libre to modify the Limits? Perhaps you could discourage players from some of these honor-deficient strategies by making higher level limits much more valuable (at least relatively speaking - Braver might suck so there is extra incentive to obtain Climhazard, or maybe it doesn't take much more damage to fill the Limit Bar at level 3 compared to level 2, so there is more incentive to kill enemies. Make the player really want to kill enemies while at the same time dread killing enemies lol).

As far as recieving sources from enemies goes...you only get items if you complete the entire battle. If you were to only give enemies that appear in large groups (Headhunters, Capparwires) the potential to drop sources - and make the odds 1/3-1/4 - then the player would be presented with a choice: Rack up kills in order to obtain sources or Forego stat building in favor of enemies being less deadly. AKA an offensive or defensive approach to the game. You could prevent enemies from dealing massive damage, but your party's stats would suffer or you could farm sources but every sources you earn increases the power of your foes.

This new mod sounds really cool and I think there is a lot of potential for it. I am making another mod too coincidentally. I am focusing on the scene.bin and its hard to articulate some of my ideas, but the strategies available to the player are going to number in the dozens - each with their own strengths and weaknesses. I really enjoy discussing/exchanging ideas so let me know what you think about my thoughts on your mod.

Armorvil · « **Reply #73 on:** 2011-02-22 22:15:58 »

Hey, no prob

This "Total Grudge" mod is quite hardcore. There is an armor that reduces damage from all Grudge attacks (you actually start with it, it's the Iron Bangle), but it has no Def/MDef, and few materia slots. I'm not using it while play-testing (when I tested the first reactor, I still didn't implement this idea, so no Grudge damage reducing for me), so you won't need to equip it to finish the game (I don't know why I tell you this, you didn't ask me anything about it ^^; ).

About Limit Breaks, I'm about to do it, yeah. The changes will surely be much like what I did with FFVII AV. Rebalancing, making some Limits actually useful, etc. And yeah, since I didn't modify the HP Divisor, Limit Breaks trigger very often - so I'll have to weaken them a bit (Gi Nattak takes ~2000 damage from Cross Slash

...A good thing this boss now has 20,000 HP).

For the sources, I think I'll do the same thing as in the AV mod : give them a 100% drop chance. But your idea has merits, because fighting battles with more than one enemy can be a big challenge if they use Grudge attacks (2 hits being sometimes sufficient to kill a party member, you can have two or three corpses lying around in record time). So yeah, I should make it so that battles with only 1 monster would net less interesting drops.

And no prob, I love talking about modding too

Vgr · « **Reply #74 on:** 2011-02-25 18:00:28 »

Since Armorvil no longer works on this mod, I will continue the work for him. I will change the name of this mod to 'AVgr' to combine both usernames. I believe that some people wants to keep the original name, so just tell me about that.

- From ArmorVil to Vgr255 :
The changes in this mod will be made so you feel you still play the original AV Mod. I will keep the same kind of work Armorvil did.

- After-Midgar changes :
Most of you played until the end of Midgar in the AV Mod. The KERNELs are already modified in the bigger part so I practically won't touch them. I will mostly modify the scene.bin to tweak the enemies. I will maybe change some things in the KERNELs but not very likely. Sephiroth will be controllable in the flashback. He won't be immortal anymore.

- Ideas and feedback :
If you've got ideas for some tweaking in the scene.bin that you think might be useful, I'll be glad to implement these. Also, I need feedback! Feedback help me correct things and so on.

- Bugs report and the like :
This will be my first tweaking in the AI. Bugs are very likely to happen. Report them with a scene number, a code and a savegame if possible. If you're using Aali's custom graphic driver and the game froze (oops, something very bad happened etc), provide me APP.LOG and crash.dmp and tell me which version of the driver you use.

- Beta-testers :
I will be busy with tweaking so the testing will wait... PM and/or add me to [email protected] (with a text to tell who you are) but this won't be for now.

Author Topic: [FF7PC-98/PSX] The FFVII AV mod (2010-11-22 Demo) (Read 70812 times)

RickJMan