Cloud Strife Then, and Now

[strife98]

In the beginning of Final Fantasy VII, Cloud was an all out mercenary. He didn't care about the meaning behind the job, or peoples feelings towards it. As long as he was getting paid for it, everything was copacetic. Then he met Tifa again, and you find out about a little of his past, and a the possibility of a love interest with Tifa, and upon Tifa's urging's he agrees to continue on with Avalanche to the next reactor. As the story continues on, we can relate to Cloud and see that he's just like any normal person. He's never too sad. When things go down he gets serious and shows that he is ready for what's to come. He can be funny and helpful. He was like that all the way to the end of the game.

What happened since then? Why is it that when people who haven't played FFVII believe him to be a whiny emo kid? That feeling has visibly transferred to the more recent games and even into Advent Children. In Dissidia he is shown as a extremely depressed man who really has no will to fight there. In the Kingdom Hearts series, he's "given into the darkness in his heart." Even in the original game, even after Aerith dies, he has a sense of humor and goes on with his life and doesn't really take everything onto himself. I have friends who joke around with me when FFVII is brought up, and they relate the song Crawling (in my Skin) to Cloud. That's not how Cloud was depicted at all in FFVII. Cloud was a guy the entire group and even the player looked up to. When he did hit that depressed spot, you were rooting him on to pick himself out of it, and he did.

I personally do not like what SquareEnix has done with Cloud. Don't get me wrong, I played the later games and enjoyed Advent Children, but really, the only character in FFVII that can be considered emo is Vincent, but who would honestly say that to his face?

[BloodShot]

The compilation was made with different intentions then the original game (partly milking, and taking FF7 in a new direction) and written by people with different ideas for the characters and personalities. SE most likely reformed cloud into the way he is now because the fanbase of FF games (not the core fanbase, the most profitable) slowly shifted from intelligent people to emo kids and unintelligent consumers, and many consider that to be "cool" for some reason.

It's the same even with the character design. In FF7 cloud wasn't super muscular but he looked like a normal guy, and fit enough, whereas in Dissidia and other games him and other characters have been reduced to walking masses of anorexic, feminine males.

Most idiots who dislike FF7 remember to that one point in the game where cloud acts emo, which in reality is such a small part of the game, and they mix it with current views of AC and the compilation to form the common misconception that is "emo" cloud.

Ever since I've played the compilation, it's quite clear they have no regard for the original writers intentions. The inclusion of Angeal, and ESPECIALLY Genesis are evidence of this - Genesis's actions in Crisis Core not only retcon things in the original game, but they make Sephiroth a much worse character.

Honestly, unless SE decides to make a new game or film about Cloud and makes him clearly not emo, you are better off disregarding the whole compilation story-wise anyway, because while they made some okay products, they are terrible stories compared to the original game, ridden with translation issues as it may be.

"Embrace your dreams"

^ That's the pinnacle of modern SE writers right there.

Sad part is, some people think that's brilliant.

[strife98]

Understandable, but it's still sad, and what makes it even more sad, is that the people who know Cloud as "That emo guy," when they play FFVII, they are going to be disappointed cause it's not the emo Cloud they think they know.

Kingdom Hearts 1 is where they really show their turn for Cloud since they pretty much put Vincent's clothes on him. Kind of like a big sign saying, "By the way, this is how Cloud is going to be from now on."

[ajthedj747]

I agree with what you two have said. I would like to know what you think about how Cloud Strife is portrayed in  Ehrgeiz: God Bless The Ring. Do you think he is portrayed in a way that makes him non-emo? If so, could you tell me why.

Youtube has some footage if you have not played the game yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNKyXaBP_7Y

[BloodShot]

I always liked how they made cloud more muscular for that game, IMO his build is pretty fitting of his character, more akin to one of the concept art pics here, all the way on the right


I loved Ehrgeiz even though a lot of people didn't. It was actually one of my most played games among friends, and a lot of them didn't even like FF games, and we still play it because it's hard to find a modern fighter that plays like it that we enjoy as much. It was very cool how you could reverse everything with precise timing, a very heavily skill-based fighting game.

[Masamune]

Well, he turned 'emo' because of Aerith's death, the geostigma, his life being a lie, Zack's death. I'd be more than a little depressed if all that was going on to me. And Cloud in the beginning of FF7 acted the way he was because that was his fake SOLDIER persona. Maybe he was always a little 'emo' (think when he was a kid and had no friends). And in an interview with (I think) Tetsuya Nomura, he said that Zidane was a change from the somber characters Final Fantasy (not just VII) had. This was before the compilation.

BUT Cloud was supposed to have gotten over it by the end of Advent Children, so why is he "emo" in Dissidia? All of the characters are kind of 'emo' in that game, which sucks. In Ehrgeiz, I think that's before the 'emo' cloud. He looks pretty tough to me.
So I do think it's a shame that a lot of people refer to Cloud as 'emo'.

I wish they made Cloud look as muscular as he is in BloodShot's picture.

but really, the only character in FFVII that can be considered emo is Vincent, but who would honestly say that to his face?

And that's why Vincent is not 'emo'.

[Covarr]

Well, he turned 'emo' because of Aerith's death, the geostigma, his life being a lie, Zack's death. I'd be more than a little depressed if all that was going on to me. And Cloud in the beginning of FF7 acted the way he was because that was his fake SOLDIER persona. Maybe he was always a little 'emo' (think when he was a kid and had no friends).

Zack's death was well before FF7, and he wasn't emo for the majority of the game. He was a douche to Barret at first, but that wasn't being emo, that was just him not really caring because it wasn't his problem. His behavior was actually pretty typical mercenary behavior. I'd say that while Zack's death and misplaced memories) were certainly contributing factors, Aerith was really the catalyst that tore him apart.

The scene where Tifa goes through his mind and sorts things out acted largely to heal his memories. From that point in the game on, he was not only reassured in his own identity, but emotionally stronger than ever. This was a key point in the story, as it marked the end of his personal journey so that he was finally prepared for the task at hand.

Geostigma didn't so much contribute to an existing emo attitude as it brought a defeated one back. With geostigma, he felt that those close to him were in danger, and that he was powerless to help them. Also, it's worth noting that pretty much everybody who was afflicted with geostigma seemed pretty emo (just look at the kids' faces), and I suspect this was never intended to be thought of as a personality trait, and rather as a symptom of an illness. This was made much clearer in Advent Children Complete (almost all the extra 25 minutes of content was story, not action).

It's generally only been in non-canon appearances (Kingdom Hearts, Dissidia) that he's been portrayed as that dark, brooding, emo tool for no reason at all. Unfortunately, his appearances in these games has colored public perception of the character as a whole, and done a lot of damage to the FF7 property.

[BloodShot]

I really need to actually watch AC complete. I almost completely (no pun intended) forgot it existed.

[Masamune]

Zack's death was well before FF7, and he wasn't emo for the majority of the game. He was a douche to Barret at first, but that wasn't being emo, that was just him not really caring because it wasn't his problem. His behavior was actually pretty typical mercenary behavior. I'd say that while Zack's death and misplaced memories) were certainly contributing factors, Aerith was really the catalyst that tore him apart.

Yes, but until the end of the game, he didn't really know who Zack was, and he thought that he was Zack. So it would be impossible for him to be depressed over something that, to him, didn't exist. So you're right, Aerith's death was what really got him.

The scene where Tifa goes through his mind and sorts things out acted largely to heal his memories. From that point in the game on, he was not only reassured in his own identity, but emotionally stronger than ever. This was a key point in the story, as it marked the end of his personal journey so that he was finally prepared for the task at hand.

I completely forgot about that scene. Square must have also forgot about it too, because with this they have no excuse to make Cloud 'emo' again after this.

Geostigma didn't so much contribute to an existing emo attitude as it brought a defeated one back. With geostigma, he felt that those close to him were in danger, and that he was powerless to help them. Also, it's worth noting that pretty much everybody who was afflicted with geostigma seemed pretty emo (just look at the kids' faces), and I suspect this was never intended to be thought of as a personality trait, and rather as a symptom of an illness. This was made much clearer in Advent Children Complete (almost all the extra 25 minutes of content was story, not action).

But wait, Square does have an excuse, Geostigma. Even though the 'emo-ness' should be a symptom of Geostigma, they make it seem like Cloud's personality (think all the other non-canon appearances of Cloud).
But AC Complete did have some action; like when Cloud saves Denzel and Tifa and cuts down falling buildings. And they show Denzel smashing a fire hydrant. But who can call that action when the movie has so many other big fight scenes.

It's generally only been in non-canon appearances (Kingdom Hearts, Dissidia) that he's been portrayed as that dark, brooding, emo tool for no reason at all. Unfortunately, his appearances in these games has colored public perception of the character as a whole, and done a lot of damage to the FF7 property.

What's worse is that today's Final Fantasy/SE fans really like the emo tool.

[BloodShot]

I really wish they stuck with the muscular design in later iterations. He doesn't have to look steroid induced, just physically fit for god sakes, instead of being as small as the woman characters they create.

Though I suppose as long as androgyny is at all prevalent in Japanese culture and the "new" general fanbase who refuse to eat enough food or exercise at all (or do ANYTHING that would help their form) this trend will continue and probably get worse.

[strife98]

Well, at the very least I'm glad he's not as pale as Sephiroth was in Advent Children. I guess it's things like they've done with Cloud that makes me glad they haven't done anything to the other games that make the top of my list, like Legend of the Dragoon. I'm almost terrified of what they would have done to Dart if it had gotten the popularity that FFVII did.

[BloodShot]

Random, but I just accidentally found this picture, and I can't stop laughing for some reason



Sry about hotlinking

[strife98]

Oh....my god. I don't know whether that's amazing or disturbing. Whatever it is, it's manly.

[ajthedj747]

Would you two gentilmen be intersted in my artistic license version of Cloud Strife's image? I am thinking about coming up with my own character sketch of him that is based on four different versions of him.